Timing Belt Change

[DeepSilentComplete]

Ok, can you all advise me about changing out my timing belt, or better yet having my local shop do the work? The beast has about 85K on her and I am thinking it might be due (overdue?). Yes/no?

My local shop has given me an estimate of $600.

Thoughts?

[tom4bren]

Bart just finished his:

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=14485&highlight=timing

[nfpgasmask]

Ahoy! Tom beat to posting my own how-to. I just did mine. I really took my time and I had it all done in about 3 days. That was mostly because I was documenting/photographing everything and there were some unexpected things that slowed me down. This whole process could be done in one long Saturday for sure, especially with my instructions in front of you. However, I would certainly give yourself a FULL free weekend and this job can be done with no problem. It's a little tedious, but it is very fun and you will feel really good about it when you are done. :D

Bart

[nfpgasmask]

Almost forgot...here is a direct link to my how-to:

Timing Belt How-To (http://www.nofuture.com/myvx/how-tos/tb/tbelt.htm)

Bart

[CrnCnn]

I should really do mine. When I get the money I will.

[nfpgasmask]

I should really do mine. When I get the money I will.

Let me know when you are ready. I'd be glad to help out, it's kinda fun actually. Is your VX leaking any coolant? You've got about 90k on the clock, right?

Bart

[CrnCnn]

Let me know when you are ready. I'd be glad to help out, it's kinda fun actually. Is your VX leaking any coolant? You've got about 90k on the clock, right?

Bart

No leakage as of yet. I think I am around 85k. If I could get some mula I would love to spend a weekend doing all the things I want. Diff brackets, brakes, freshen up my cladding paintjob, timing belt and all that goes with it, muffler, and some misc mods i have wanted to do for a while.

[tom4bren]

Bart,

Excellent write-up. Mind if I make a pdf out of it for the download section?

Tom

[nfpgasmask]

Bart,

Excellent write-up. Mind if I make a pdf out of it for the download section?

Tom

Absolutely. Have at it!

Bart

[tom4bren]

Good - I started it already.

It won't be as purdy as your HTML but it'll print better for taking a copy out to the garage wit ya.

[nfpgasmask]

Good - I started it already.

It won't be as purdy as your HTML but it'll print better for taking a copy out to the garage wit ya.

That's why you should have a spare PC in the garage!! ;)

Bart

[VehiGAZ]

My local shop has given me an estimate of $600.

Talk to an Isuzu dealer - mine said they'd do it for under $400, but I had the indie mechanic who did the S/C install do the t-belt, and it ran me like $700 or $800 in his hands.

[alterastro]

Does anyone know at what mileage they should be done?

Nick ;)

[tomdietrying]

Bart, I agree with 4bren.....GREAT write up!
Thanks.
Tom

[nfpgasmask]

Bart, I agree with 4bren.....GREAT write up!
Thanks.
Tom

Thanks, Tom!!!! ;)


Does anyone know at what mileage they should be done?

Nick ;)

I think the manual said 70k or 75k, iirc. Most people do it around 100k, sometimes more. :eek:

Bart

[JAMAS]

Talk to an Isuzu dealer - mine said they'd do it for under $400, but I had the indie mechanic who did the S/C install do the t-belt, and it ran me like $700 or $800 in his hands.


I just scheduled my timing belt replacement at the local Isuzu shop. Any day of the week it is $380 + tax. However, the last time I talked to him, during my $700 all fluids synthesized and serpentine belt replaced, he mentioned about a 20% off. So I held him to it.

Should be done for $304 + Tax. <KnockOnWood>Unless something else is broken when they go digging.</KnockOnWood>

53K on the clock, but 10 years on the calendar. Probably not a bad way to spend birthday money. Although that DEWALT 1/2" 18-Volt Hammer Drill would have been alot more fun to buy. Damn responsible decisions. They are never any fun.

[alterastro]

This is interesting... There is something in the UK (don't know if you have it in the US), called AUtodata. It lists everything you could wish to know about vehicles, including timing intervals and instructions etc.

For the 6VE1 engine after 1998 it quotes 72,000 miles or 96 months. I notice the spec in the knowledgebase says 100,000 miles which did seem high to me. The 6VD1 (3.2) engine is the same unless it is pre-1998 when the stated interval is 54,000 miles or 72 months.

Me thinks I need to change mine!

Be interesting to hear where you all think the differences come from :confused:

Nick

[nfpgasmask]

IIRC, the VX manual states 72k or 75k. I changed my belt at 87k and change. I just officially rolled 90k last week, and it is probably more since my speedo is off.

Bart

[nfpgasmask]

I just scheduled my timing belt replacement at the local Isuzu shop. Any day of the week it is $380 + tax. However, the last time I talked to him, during my $700 all fluids synthesized and serpentine belt replaced, he mentioned about a 20% off. So I held him to it.

Should be done for $304 + Tax. <KnockOnWood>Unless something else is broken when they go digging.</KnockOnWood>


So here is my question- How the hell is a shop going to do this for only $304? Is that labor only? I spent damn near $900 on OEM parts for this maintenance! Or are you ONLY doing a belt change and leaving the water pump, radiator hoses, idler pulley, tensioner pulley and push tensioner original?

I could understand $300 for the labor, but what about all the parts???? Are after market parts REALLY that much cheaper than Merlin?

Bart

[tom4bren]

Guess I'd better get back to work on making a pdf of your How2:)

[nfpgasmask]

Guess I'd better get back to work on making a pdf of your How2:)

Let me know if you have the same "problem" you had before. And make sure you have cleared your cache and deleted your cookies before hand. My ISP told me to do that and it seems to have solved the problem. Since it was a htaccess file hack, it is possible the problem gets downloaded into your IE cache and will crop up again. So far, after clearing my cache, I have not had the issue again. And if you want, I can zip it up and email it direct to you, if that would be easier...

Thanks,

Bart

[JAMAS]

So here is my question- How the hell is a shop going to do this for only $304? Is that labor only? I spent damn near $900 on OEM parts for this maintenance! Or are you ONLY doing a belt change and leaving the water pump, radiator hoses, idler pulley, tensioner pulley and push tensioner original?

I could understand $300 for the labor, but what about all the parts???? Are after market parts REALLY that much cheaper than Merlin?

Bart

Parts and labor to only replace the belt. If they find more then they will fix more.

I have $300 to spend. Not $900. So I am going to have them replace the thin rubber belt that could break and destroy my engine. However, if the other items seem to be good, I see no reason to spend the extra cash. I figured I was still ahead of the game with replacing it now.

As I understand it....the other items are just a "while you are there anyway" kinda deal. They have no "must be changed after xxx,xxx miles" type deal.

[nfpgasmask]

Parts and labor to only replace the belt. If they find more then they will fix more.

I have $300 to spend. Not $900. So I am going to have them replace the thin rubber belt that could break and destroy my engine. However, if the other items seem to be good, I see no reason to spend the extra cash. I figured I was still ahead of the game with replacing it now.

As I understand it....the other items are just a "while you are there anyway" kinda deal. They have no "must be changed after xxx,xxx miles" type deal.

Yes, you are right. IMO however, that is just a different way of thinking. In my case, the water pump was leaking coolant, and it is recommended that it get's changed anyway. The radiator hoses are cheap and easy to swap, so they got changed. The push tensioner and idler pulley are very important, so they got changed. IMO, it's always better to be safe than sorry. That "thin rubber belt that could break and destroy my engine" could still break even if it is brand new and your push tensioner or idler pulley fails after its been yanked and replaced...just something to think about.

I'm not trying to convince you to spend more money or do more work, just looking out for you. I would hate to only have done half the job to save money only to have to do it over or cause bigger issues later, that's all. Just food for thought.

Bart

[tom4bren]

"Let me know if you have the same "problem" you had before. And make sure you have cleared your cache and deleted your cookies before hand. My ISP told me to do that and it seems to have solved the problem. Since it was a htaccess file hack, it is possible the problem gets downloaded into your IE cache and will crop up again. So far, after clearing my cache, I have not had the issue again. And if you want, I can zip it up and email it direct to you, if that would be easier..."

OK. OK. Understood. No Thanks.

[etlsport]

bart, arent the idler and tensioner pulleys on the outside of the engine anyway? they could be done in a few hours without having the top of the engine off?

same with the radiator hoses, but with them you need to drain the coolant so it makes sense to do them with the water pump

[nfpgasmask]

bart, arent the idler and tensioner pulleys on the outside of the engine anyway? they could be done in a few hours without having the top of the engine off?

same with the radiator hoses, but with them you need to drain the coolant so it makes sense to do them with the water pump

No, don't confuse the "drive belt" (serpentine belt) pulleys with the timing belt pulleys. Furthermore, the serp belt and all of the outer pulleys do need to come off to get to the timing belt chamber, which by the way is on the front of the engine, not the top. Take a look at my how to. I go through everything on there that I removed.

http://www.nofuture.com/myvx/how-tos/tb/tbelt.htm

(Please tell me if anything odd happens when you visit that link, I had a problem with my ISP that should be resolved now)

I did remove some things that I didn't ultimately need to remove, but by doing so it made things much easier. The push tensioner MUST be removed to change the timing belt. And as illustrated in the video instructions, can be reused by compressing the tensioner rod in a vice, and then inserting a pin to hold it in place (which your mech will have to fabricate if he doesn't have one sitting around). The push tensioner is the part that keeps your timing belt taught on all the pulleys. If that part fails, BLAMMO! Your belt will come loose and bad things will happen. The water pump, being the main device that pumps coolant through your engine, is in my opinion a no brainer to change. Keeping your VX properly hydrated is VERY important. Furthermore, being that it is a possible source for leakage, should be changed and tightened up. To me, preventative maintenance is worth every penny. I would rather swap working parts out than struggle through and pay for fixing damaged parts. Not to mention the breaking down, getting stranded, getting towed, and getting taken to the cleaners by a mechanic who has to deal with your lack of preventative maintenance. :D

Seriously, not trying to scare anyone, just stating that there is a REASON why it is recommended to change these parts. I do not believe it is simply to make you spend more money. Am I talking outta my bunghole here?

Bart

[etlsport]

gotcha.. never been inside an engine (yet) makes sense that those are found inside the engine as well.. im with u on the preventive maintenance though, when my time comes (late in the summer probably) ill most likely be doing replacing most of the stuff u did.. sadly.. plus my thermostat which is stuck open

i wonder if it would be okay to order parts though napa, i can get them at cost though work.. but i REALLY dont want to have something fail on me..

[nfpgasmask]

i wonder if it would be okay to order parts though napa, i can get them at cost though work.. but i REALLY dont want to have something fail on me..

I bought OEM for one reason alone: I :heart: my VX. For my Trooper, it's Napa all the way. Still, I think it would be 100% better to install aftermarket new parts rather than NO new parts. But that is just my logic. With my VX I have never used anything but stuff shipped to me directly from our main man, Merlin. I know there are timing belt and water pump kits out there that are considerably cheaper.

Bart

[tom4bren]

The main reason that it is highly recommended to change the tensioner is that several members noted that the tensioner was no longer functioning (which could cause timing belt failure).

[VXR]

I thought that our VXs had a non-interference engine. So if the timing belt went it would not cause engine failure. Can anyone clarify :confused:

[nfpgasmask]

I thought that our VXs had a non-interference engine. So if the timing belt went it would not cause engine failure. Can anyone clarify :confused:

I am 99.99% certain you are correct. Engine damage from a broken timing belt would most likely NOT occur. However, I don't want to find out what does happen when something goes wrong under there.

Bart

[tom4bren]

The jury is still out on the interference issue. The specs indicate a positive clearance on the valves so THEORETICALLY yes, loss of the timing belt won't trash your engine. I'm not going to be the one to find out.

[nfpgasmask]

I'm not going to be the one to find out.

x2...

Bart

[VXR]

The jury is still out on the interference issue. The specs indicate a positive clearance on the valves so THEORETICALLY yes, loss of the timing belt won't trash your engine. I'm not going to be the one to find out

so no one has ever had one fail???

[deermagnet]

This comes from a training course for Isuzu techs on the new '98 3.5L engine.
We have a non-interference engine-

http://www.drivehq.com/file/df.aspx/publish/mgpa/vx3/98valve.jpg

Mark Griffin

[psychos2]

Just the fact that it is way easier to change when all the cams are lined up properly is all I would need to know. If the cams get out of time it is a pain to get them back in time. It is much easier to get everything lined up ,remove old belt ,install new belt with marks aligned and be sure that you will not be taking it back apart. I used the instructions from the vx manual, it was a piece of cake. If you are using an aftermarket belt , make sure to put marks on the belt before you remove it and make sure they line up with the marks on the new belt. The marks on mine were off it was a good thing I marked it and counted the teeth between the marks to make sure they were correct. It took maybe 5 to 6 hours. I remember someone saying that they had bent valves from a timing belt failure. So the jury is still out on the interference issue. The question is do you want to take the chance of having to also remove the heads and replace valves when you install the new belt? shawn

[psychos2]

There is an easy way to make sure you do not screw up the timing when changing the belt. Do the step to line up the marks by turning the motor.Once the marks are lined up take a paint marker and make a mark on the pulley were the notch is and also make a mark on the belt in the same place so they line up. Do this to both cam pulleys and the crank pulley. Also make sure to mark on the belt which mark is for which pulley ( crank ,left cam, right cam). And make sure you know what direction the belt turns. Then you can remove the belt. Take the old belt and count the teeth between the marks on the old belt,and make the same marks on the new belt,you should have the same amount of teeth between the marks on the old belt and the marks on the new belt. It is very important to get this right ,so double check . Install the new belt and line up the correct marks with the correct marks on each pulley and use some spring clips to hold them in place.When changing the belt the important thing is that you get the belt on with the same distance between the marks on the pulleys. You could line up the pulleys perfect with the marks and put the belt on with it one tooth off and you now have the motor out of time.If you mark the belt count the teeth and make sure the correct amount of teeth are between each mark you will only have to do it once. And do not trust the marks that are on the new belt as being correct, mine were not. shawn

[nfpgasmask]

Yeah, changing the timing belt really is not exactly difficult, but it is involved because you have to remove so much stuff to get to it. You also need to have the right tools on hand and the concentration/time to get it done.

To be perfectly honest, my timing belt looked absolutely fine when I took it off. No cracks or anything. But I had such a bad coolant leak it was a good job to get done along with changing my water pump.

Bart

[JAMAS]

This comes from a training course for Isuzu techs on the new '98 3.5L engine.
We have a non-interference engine-

http://www.drivehq.com/file/df.aspx/publish/mgpa/vx3/98valve.jpg

Mark Griffin

Well shoot!.....

I could have been using my DEWALT 1/2" 18-Volt Hammer Drill right now instead of being comfortable in the fact that my timing belt wont break.

Oh well, responsible decisions continue to take away my fun.