I Miss "SomeBeach"

[handeeman]

I miss 'Somebeach". If ya noticed he hasn't been back on site since July. So I e-mailed him (address on profile) and this is what he told me. It seems he was being hassled by some of our members privately about not being a site supporter. So he just dropped out.
That's not right. I push site support as hard as anyone, but I would never get on to someone for lack of it. I know "the Boss" wants it to be an individual choice. We don't know each others circumstances and we're suppose to be family here. Anyway, Somebeach will prolly be upset i told ya'll but I thought you'd wanna know.

[pbkid]

aw, cmon guys.... thats no bueno....
:embarasse

[JoFotoz]

I guess "hassled" is a very subjective term....


It seems he was being hassled by some of our members privately about not being a site supporter.



IIRC..I got several PM's with lots of questions from 'somebeach'...

In one of my many answers to him , I suggested he donate ...
.....given all the money saving help he was getting.


Frankly , I'd call that a friendly 'nudge' in the right direction.....:bgwb:


But if he took it as being "hassled'....I guess I'm guilty :confused:


jo

[circmand]

I guess "hassled" is a very subjective term....




IIRC..I got several PM's with lots of questions from 'somebeach'...

In one of my many answers to him , I suggested he donate ...
.....given all the money saving help he was getting.


Frankly , I'd call that a friendly 'nudge' in the right direction.....:bgwb:


But if he took it as being "hassled'....I guess I'm guilty :confused:


jo

If we was PMing people and getting a lot from the site I think there was nothing wrong with the mention of supporting the site from the member who was giving free advice. I guess it all depends on who you are getting the story from or whether you get both sides of teh story

[vt_maverick]

Eh, I see both sides. On the one hand, I think it should be someone's choice, and that we shouldn't exclude them from the conversation based on their status. On the other hand I'll probably spend $20 on gum this year.

Either way, I want him back too! Need another brother from the 757! :flower:

[nfpgasmask]

I personally never ask people to donate. Money is just such a sensitive subject, and way to personal, imo. I don't fault anyone for donating or not. IMO, asking someone to pay for "the Internet" just goes against everything the Internet was originally meant to be, that is, "free" communication and "free" distribution of information.

And with money being such a sensitive issue, I can understand how even a little polite nudging might come across as offensive, ESPECIALLY from a non-admin of the site. Seriously speaking, if I just joined a forum and some random other forum user asked me to cough up money, I would probably be taken aback a little. Maybe after a year or two of heavy use, then if someone asked me to consider donating, I would be OK with it, but not so early on. I didn't pony up for quite a while. I was a non-paying user for at least a year, iirc, maybe more.

I donate because I love this site and it is a great place to learn about the VehiCROSS and talk with fellow enthusiasts. To this day, it is the ONLY website I would ever consider giving actual money to, and I am a part of a lot of other great forums.

Bart

[handeeman]

I guess "hassled" is a very subjective term....




IIRC..I got several PM's with lots of questions from 'somebeach'...

In one of my many answers to him , I suggested he donate ...
.....given all the money saving help he was getting.


Frankly , I'd call that a friendly 'nudge' in the right direction.....:bgwb:




jo


I never asked and he never said who hassled him. I agree in a friendly nudge....we all gain so much from this site. I think we just all want the most for Moncha and to make it as easy for him as possible. I also know I don't want any of the family not feeling a part of it.

[vt_maverick]

IMO, asking someone to pay for "the Internet" just goes against everything the Internet was originally meant to be, that is, "free" communication and "free" distribution of information.


There is no such thing as free. Free is a relative concept. Anything that is free to you is only so because someone else already paid for it. Nothing is truly free.

Thus endeth the economics lesson. ;) Not a knock at all on people who don't support the site, I just have a personal pet peeve with people who say things should "just be free." (As in health care most recently... :mad:)

[ZEUS]

Didn't this come up before, Handee? Was it the same guy or someone else? This sounds really familiar to me...

[ZEUS]

Yup, here it is: http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showpost.php?p=170040&postcount=9

My reply: http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showpost.php?p=170352&postcount=12

[nfpgasmask]

There is no such thing as free. Free is a relative concept. Anything that is free to you is only so because someone else already paid for it. Nothing is truly free.

Thus endeth the economics lesson. ;) Not a knock at all on people who don't support the site, I just have a personal pet peeve with people who say things should "just be free." (As in health care most recently... :mad:)

Well, if you noticed, when I wrote free, there were quotes around it.

What I mean by "free", is that it's like a free membership to your library. A place where you can go and get information without paying for it. THAT is what the Internet started out like. But, it has mutated into some sort of hideous monster of crap and nonsense. There is really only a small percentage of the Internet left that is of quality, ad-less, spyware-less, FREE content.

I guess I am sort of an anarchist/idealist in that respect. Information should always be "free". :D

Bart

[KeithVXlvr]

Hell, I am a site supporter and I don't even have a VX anymore.

What a BEACH !!!

[vt_maverick]

What a BEACH !!!
Not constructive. He seems like a good guy otherwise, so comments like this (even just meant as a tease) are probably where he's feeling the pressure.

And wikipedia is probably the last best hope for free information, although it is largely influenced by people's bias / interests (for example, compare the number of hits for Star Trek vs. Van Goh). But wikipedia ultimately depends upon donations, just like this site.

[VX KAT]

I miss 'Somebeach". If ya noticed he hasn't been back on site since July.
That's so weird you should bring this up today Handee as just TODAY I was driving along & thought about him and recalled he changed his screen name, but couldn't recall which was the old or the new as I was trying to recall if he's posted recently. Anyway...., Somebeach (Doug), we really hope you come back and share some chit chat with the "fam".

Handee, does that mean our brains are wired the same somehow??? :eek::eek::eek:

[ZEUS]

"Handee, does that mean our brains are wired the same somehow??? "
Oh, you better hope not! ;)

[circmand]

Well, if you noticed, when I wrote free, there were quotes around it.

What I mean by "free", is that it's like a free membership to your library. A place where you can go and get information without paying for it. THAT is what the Internet started out like. But, it has mutated into some sort of hideous monster of crap and nonsense. There is really only a small percentage of the Internet left that is of quality, ad-less, spyware-less, FREE content.

I guess I am sort of an anarchist/idealist in that respect. Information should always be "free". :D

Bart


has a membership fee

[nfpgasmask]

our library in Indiana PA has a membership fee

That's messed up. I've never known a local community library to charge fees. Unless you return your books late, of course. :D

Bart

[handeeman]

That's so weird you should bring this up today Handee as just TODAY I was driving along & thought about him and recalled he changed his screen name, but couldn't recall which was the old or the new as I was trying to recall if he's posted recently. Anyway...., Somebeach (Doug), we really hope you come back and share some chit chat with the "fam".

Handee, does that mean our brains are wired the same somehow??? :eek::eek::eek:


"Handee, does that mean our brains are wired the same somehow??? "
Oh, you better hope not! ;)

LMAO.....I have to agree with the Dr.(Zeus)

[circmand]

That's messed up. I've never known a local community library to charge fees. Unless you return your books late, of course. :D

Bart

not every place does things the way other places do. That way people who use the library pay for it and those who do not use it are not paying taxes for it. The idea something is cheaper when everybody pays for it is wrong. People who do not want it are forced to subsidize those who do. Except for things everybody uses the cost should be born by those who do.

[vt_maverick]

not every place does things the way other places do. That way people who use the library pay for it and those who do not use it are not paying taxes for it. The idea something is cheaper when everybody pays for it is wrong. People who do not want it are forced to subsidize those who do. Except for things everybody uses the cost should be born by those who do.

...as taken from the how-to guide for establishing tolled freeways.

Just joshin' ya a bit there circ. ;)

[circmand]

...as taken from the how-to guide for establishing tolled freeways.

Just joshin' ya a bit there circ. ;)

I am all for tolled freeways just dont call them freeways they are tollways. If it gets me where I am going faster like the turnpike I will pay up. When I was in Houstob I had 2 ways to get to works one was toll with an electric eye you did not even have to slow down. The other was surface streets. So many people were going down town on the Westpark tollway the surface street were faster.

[deermagnet]

"It seems he was being hassled by some of our members privately about not being a site supporter."

This issue of members receiving unfriendly PM's has come up before. It's very easy to avoid these kind of PM's. I totally disabled PM's for my membership and hid my email from other members using my control panel. You can just allow PM's from a few buddies if you like. I also went to stealth mode when logged in that hides my online status so no one can stalk me in the forums. :p

If someone needs to contact me, they can do it in public on the forums.

Mark Griffin

[Riff Raff]

If someone needs to contact me, they can do it in public on the forums.

Mark Griffin

DeerMagnet--- I just wanted to make contact with you in public to verify our dinner-date for this weekend. I realize it's your turn to treat, so I prefer a nice blush wine and my T-bone steak cooked medium rare. Oh, and make sure the dancing girls arrive promptly this time for after dinner entertainment.:bgwb:

Back on topic, I too was initially prodded via private E-Mails & PM's to become a site supporter shortly after logging-on as a new member. A better monetary motivator for me to donate was not being labeled as a "Zoid" (before Moncha changed the format).:yeso:

[pbkid]

i just dont understand the personal prodding for someone to pay for a site that is designed to be optionary.

scott has said mulitple times that he feels very strongly that the site is donation only, not membership-fee driven.

so, why should anyone have the 'power' to tell another person they need to donate? our MODERATOR tells us no.....

i know that i was a member here for at least a year before i donated. i would have left if someone forced me to pay before i was ready.

[Marlin]

i just dont understand the personal prodding for someone to pay for a site that is designed to be optionary.

scott has said mulitple times that he feels very strongly that the site is donation only, not membership-fee driven.

so, why should anyone have the 'power' to tell another person they need to donate? our MODERATOR tells us no.....

i know that i was a member here for at least a year before i donated. i would have left if someone forced me to pay before i was ready.

I just read all of the posts in this thread, I never saw anything that said he was forced to pay?
I thought he was just nudged to support, I am in a similar boat as Bart, this is the only site I pay for, and as far as I am concerned, it is most certainly worth it just in archived info alone.
The concept that anything is free is completely false, be it something as simple as a streetlight or the fact that you can choose to pay or not, nothing is free.
The library is paid for by taxes, which means those that have jobs and pay taxes are paying for it, and those who do not......have "free" access to it without paying a dime. Kind of like universal health care, cash for clunkers....:flame2:

[SomeBeach]

I happened to check the site out and was flattered that there was a forum of I MISS SOMEBEACH. I actually signed in to check on Moncha after a member sent me an e-mail saying he was sick. I would like those site supporters who proudly boast their status to know I too was planning to support the site. I am not a wealthy man but $20.00 is not a big deal. Prior to taking the time to send my Paypal donation I noticed a devision in those who support and those who do not. It didn't matter why a person didn't donate it was about those who did and those who did not. One member was talking about needing tires and everyone pitched in to help out. I thought how nice that was to help out a person in need. As I am sure other members are in financial distress, it did not matter (to a few) who took it upon themselves to decide if you use the site you should pay. I stumbled onto another forum where it talked of persons who do not support and some members refered to them as "free loaders". I thought it was sad that members of this site, not Moncha (the boss), took it upon theirselves to decide non supporters were obligated to donate money. In fact, there is quite a bit of discussion on supporting the site. There is so much talk on supporting the site that I was a little offended that members would PM me to directly ask for money. Then to suggest I saved all this money and owe the savings to the site just hit me wrong. The site is free and any money given is a donation. Yet there was so much dialogue regarding those who did not donate $20.00. I know others feel like me and some of those may struggle to come up with the money. I would like to leave by saying I am not a free loader. I am a procrastinator but not a free loader. But before I could contribute I felt like i was not part of the group. I have to wonder what is said between yourselves in private messages about persons who have not donated.
I want to leave this site by saying I did enjoy the conversations and looked forward to getting on this site each night as I wound down from the stresses of my job. As a group you have made it clear that free loading is not accepted. I honor that decision and chose to quietly leave the site rather than get some friendly advice for free. I have posted this forum to help share what occurred. Had I not seen the forum discussing my failure to donate $20.00 I would have quietly faded away. I appreciate those who have contacted me to get me to sign on. I feel that since I was singled out as an example of a non supporter I would be embarrassed to ever sign on again. I think you guys would have liked me. I'm pretty funny and creative. As for Moncha, you have a fantastic site. I pray you feel well soon so you can get back to doing what you love.
As for those who are so passionate about site supporting I would recommend that you solicit donations by sharing the benefits. Encourage members to give but don't single them out. And never send a personal message to someone you don't know trying to make them feel guilty because they participated in a "how to" forum but they didn't donate. Some members refer to that as a gentle nudge. Let the forums nudge. I don't know how many members are not site supporters but they are members just like you. Praise those who give. End each of your chats by reminding the other members you are a site supporter. Get personalized license plates that say ST SPRTR. But don't seperate the group by making the non supporters feel they are inferior or free loading. You don't know why they aren't giving.
And that concludes my membership into this group. Hope I didn't offend anyone but hey, if I did you can open another forum like Glad Somebeach Is Gone or Can you Believe That Somebeach or maybe What A Cheap Bas&@%d Somebeach Is.
PEACE!

[nfpgasmask]

But don't seperate the group by making the non supporters feel they are inferior or free loading. You don't know why they aren't giving.

Exactly my point. It's too personal. Good luck SomeBeach.

:_beer:
Bart

[vt_maverick]

I happened to check the site out and was flattered that there was a forum of I MISS SOMEBEACH. I actually signed in to check on Moncha after a member sent me an e-mail saying he was sick. I would like those site supporters who proudly boast their status to know I too was planning to support the site. I am not a wealthy man but $20.00 is not a big deal. Prior to taking the time to send my Paypal donation I noticed a devision in those who support and those who do not. It didn't matter why a person didn't donate it was about those who did and those who did not. One member was talking about needing tires and everyone pitched in to help out. I thought how nice that was to help out a person in need. As I am sure other members are in financial distress, it did not matter (to a few) who took it upon themselves to decide if you use the site you should pay. I stumbled onto another forum where it talked of persons who do not support and some members refered to them as "free loaders". I thought it was sad that members of this site, not Moncha (the boss), took it upon theirselves to decide non supporters were obligated to donate money. In fact, there is quite a bit of discussion on supporting the site. There is so much talk on supporting the site that I was a little offended that members would PM me to directly ask for money. Then to suggest I saved all this money and owe the savings to the site just hit me wrong. The site is free and any money given is a donation. Yet there was so much dialogue regarding those who did not donate $20.00. I know others feel like me and some of those may struggle to come up with the money. I would like to leave by saying I am not a free loader. I am a procrastinator but not a free loader. But before I could contribute I felt like i was not part of the group. I have to wonder what is said between yourselves in private messages about persons who have not donated.
I want to leave this site by saying I did enjoy the conversations and looked forward to getting on this site each night as I wound down from the stresses of my job. As a group you have made it clear that free loading is not accepted. I honor that decision and chose to quietly leave the site rather than get some friendly advice for free. I have posted this forum to help share what occurred. Had I not seen the forum discussing my failure to donate $20.00 I would have quietly faded away. I appreciate those who have contacted me to get me to sign on. I feel that since I was singled out as an example of a non supporter I would be embarrassed to ever sign on again. I think you guys would have liked me. I'm pretty funny and creative. As for Moncha, you have a fantastic site. I pray you feel well soon so you can get back to doing what you love.
As for those who are so passionate about site supporting I would recommend that you solicit donations by sharing the benefits. Encourage members to give but don't single them out. And never send a personal message to someone you don't know trying to make them feel guilty because they participated in a "how to" forum but they didn't donate. Some members refer to that as a gentle nudge. Let the forums nudge. I don't know how many members are not site supporters but they are members just like you. Praise those who give. End each of your chats by reminding the other members you are a site supporter. Get personalized license plates that say ST SPRTR. But don't seperate the group by making the non supporters feel they are inferior or free loading. You don't know why they aren't giving.
And that concludes my membership into this group. Hope I didn't offend anyone but hey, if I did you can open another forum like Glad Somebeach Is Gone or Can you Believe That Somebeach or maybe What A Cheap Bas&@%d Somebeach Is.
PEACE!

Well said. Mind sending me an email with some off-site contact info in case I wanted to look you up when I'm on your side of the water?

Sorry to see you go and best wishes. :(

[ZEUS]

Not much else to say, I guess... since he has already 'signed out for good'.

[pbkid]

agreed, it can be gently nudged in the public areas but it should never point to one person for donations. and like scott has said so passionately that he wants this site to always be free for VX lovers. :_beer:

thanks for your positive input while you were here and hopefully you'll be back one day..

[handeeman]

I feel absolutely terrible. I certainly never meant to push somebeach away, I had hoped this would encouage him back. I'm very sorry.

[tom4bren]

I'm speechless. It's just wrong that someone was chased away like this.

At least he has an easy handle to remember so if I have a 'headlight polishing party' next spring, I can email him (the 'window fixin party was such a success:)).

[JoFotoz]

Handeeman..you have no need to feel "terrible" AT ALL.



I feel absolutely terrible. I certainly never meant to push somebeach away, I had hoped this would encourage him back. I'm very sorry.


Perhaps if anyone should feel bad..its me and the others somebeach talks of
that prodded him for a donation.

But frankly I don't....

When I first started posting here , I didn't even know there was a donation option
until it was "brought to my attention"...(PM's!)

I was grateful for the heads up ..and I certainly didnt feel "Chased away"



Truth be known , I would be happy to see a mandated membership fee.

We don't drive a gas miser , we don't drive a cheap commuter car ,
we don't fall into the 'barely afford to drive to work' category (dire circumstances excepted , as they do happen)....

...so 'in general' balking at $20 a year , when ya happily eat gas at about 17mpg , doesn't compute with me.


I guess it boils down to personal nature...

This Forum doesnt pay for itself.....
I STRONGLY believe that given the HUGE benefits gained from partaking of this site , we should ALL assume the responsibility to support it.

Forgive me if this is blunt..its sometimes a British trait...
....I taught Simon Cowell everything he knows!


jo

[ZEUS]

^^^I agree^^^ We ALL often say things that are not offensive - some people just take offense to them anyway - that's on them, not on me and not on you. Other times, we ALL DO say offensive things, and we get called out. Move on or move along... Doug chose to move along, period. His loss.

[vt_maverick]

I probably experienced the best case scenario for donation recruitment. I posted a WTB thread on something (child seat tethers maybe?) and someone PM'd me to offer theirs, as long as I agreed to donate to the site. Given that I was willing to pay at least $20 for the part + shipping, it was a no-brainer. Not that everyone should recruit that way, but it really demonstrated to me the value ($ and otherwise) in supporting the site.

[The Lompican]

Deermagnet - "I also went to stealth mode when logged in that hides my online status so no one can stalk me in the forums."


How do you go into stealth mode?

[deermagnet]

How do you go into stealth mode?

Quick Links>Edit Options
It's the first choice on the top and it's called invisible mode. Check the box and hit 'save changes' at the bottom.

I've been using that for many years. It allows me to move undetected among the shadows. :)

Mark

[SomeBeach]

Perhaps if anyone should feel bad..its me and the others somebeach talks of
that prodded him for a donation.

But frankly I don't....

Please forgive me but I had to check in one last time. I wanted to see how members felt about what I experienced. I never mentioned names but JOFOTOZ proudly boasts how he was one who feels this should be a paid site. Well JOFOTOZ this is NOT YOUR SITE and you have no right to run people off or make YOUR OWN rules. Nothing wrong with an opinion but you need to know your place. And members who choose not to donate need to realize that members like him think you are free loaders and should not be allowed to use the site. Mind you that JOFOTOZ is just another member but he takes it upon himself to criticize those who don't donate. If you read his forums you will see how he pats himself on the back constantly about being a site supporter. He acknowledges that he is blount so I too shall be blount. If you feel there should be a mandated fee discuss this with Moncha....IT'S HIS SITE AND HIS RULES! So members look out for those who think their OPINIONS should be rules. Who knows, maybe JOFOTZ will next say that silver VXs shouldn't be allowed on this site next.
Handeeman, thanks for being a great guy. This is not your fault.
What a shame that a few opinionated persons can screw up a good thing. I hope this forum ends without members feeling they should take sides. Since JOFOTZ is staying and I'm leaving it might be easier to just agree with him. Just be careful to obey his rules or you may be next to get blasted.
And JOFOTZ remember this is not your site. AGAIN....THIS IS NOT YOUR SITE so don't throw your rules around. And never send me another personal message...you don't know me. Had you felt a little bad for your inappropriate PM to me I would have respected you. That is not the case.
But you have been around longer and have more VX friends so I leave this site to you. Run off the ones that don't agree with you and sleep well. Maybe you can launch a campaign to rid the site of all non supporters. How proud you will be.

[Riff Raff]

SomeBeach--- Thank you for being a true "stand-up guy". I sincerely hope you can find it in your heart to re-visit our family. I realize some relatives of our family can be different; heck, you should sit at my Thanksgiving table and watch some of my own real relatives at work. In any event; please come back to us, as we welcome you (and all VX'ers) with wide open arms regardless of monetary status. If not, then please feel free just to "lurk" in the shadows so you & your VX remain in top condition.:yeso:

[vt_maverick]

Suggest we lock this thread before it goes further downhill...

[The Lompican]

Quick Links>Edit Options
It's the first choice on the top and it's called invisible mode. Check the box and hit 'save changes' at the bottom.

I've been using that for many years. It allows me to move undetected among the shadows. :)

Mark

Thanks Deer Magnet - I'll try that.. I ran into this same problem before in the past. (Being mentioned by name)

JoFotoz - "9 people online...using this site.....


JoFotoz, 4X4 UFO, CoastieCosta567, crager34, garfull, jdm monkey, mdwyer, mikemol, The Lompican

...3 are paid up members.

The other 6 know who they are...

[JoFotoz]

Somebeach...

I am simply stating my opinion...JUST AS YOU ARE.

You are essentially telling me I have no right to air my opinion....

...and in doing so , you simply negate your own right to air yours.


Saying I "feel" this should be a paid site ..

..is FAR cry from DEMANDING IT BE A PAID SITE...

...it was an OPINION.

Saying I think everyone that uses this site should ""assume"" the responsibility of supporting it...

..is a FAR CRY from ''"demanding"" everyone pays to use it !

Again..it was an OPINION.


I REALLY hope you will reconsider your exit...

And I'm sorry if you thought my 'nudge' was over zealous....
...I kinda feel the same way about your reaction!

You have clearly demonstrated YOUR strong views..

...please respect that I was simply doing the same!!

And letsa face it...sometimes the lack of intonation and voice inflection leads "posted' words reading rather cold .


jo

[Gussie2000]

I haven't post any word 'till now.

I've read each post carefully.

And my conclusion is :

It's absolutely imperative that ALL OF US stop this sort of topics.

We,under no circunstancies shall finger any member for donations.

I knew that @ some point down the road this issue will get outter control & here we are......

It's absolutely imperative that supporters stops pitching any words to any non supporters regarding this sensible topic.

Yes we all knows that scott appretiates all & every single donation to support the site,yes we all know that the site doens't support on its self & we all know that when the goal is not acomplish scott has to pull the rest to cover the remaining amount but again,The word donation means " help at your will" or "as much as you can offer" but we cannot keep going this road because scott don't want that & it's very unconfortable in any way no matter what.

At vehicross.info there's no 1rst class or 2nd class members,there's no preferred or non preferred members,there's no VIP members,there's no members that has the lead or any one that has to follow.this is not any sort of army forces where there's a commander in chief which other less ranked has to obey.

If we check all these past months we all can figured out that during the year of 2009 few of those months the donation goal wasn't only met,but donations exceeded the $ 300 required to cover the cost of the server.Other months the donation goal were bit short & others,like last month was only $ 20 donated to the site,what i mean with this is that all goes by the flow of the site it self.
Yes,it would be great that all members donates to the site,but because we don't know how tight each member's financial situation could be,we got to refrain from popping this topic ever again.

Another fact that slipped our minds is that new members are watching us & this sort of situations instead of encouraging them to be more active & more eager to help will just drive them away from the site.

It's only an small porcentage of us whom support the site & all we got to do is support as much as we can.

That's how scott choose the site to be & we all shall respect his decision.

Don't want my single post to be offensive to any of you guys & get my back side kicked,please....i just asking to keep this topic of the board & let the site flow on its own.

Somebeach,i was one of the 1rst group of members that welcomed you here,please don't leave,you are important as much as all of us in here,every one of us gives life to this site & every one of us are important in here.We are an community where some will not agree on every single topic,but i strongly believe we all in here for the same interests ............ isn't ?

[Grif]

@Gussie Those words are a class act.

I suggest we close the thread on those thoughts.

[VX KAT]

x2!!

[Anita]

If the originator of this thread (Handeeman) wishes to lock it up, I shall do so.

[tom4bren]

One more thought that hasn't been expressed yet - the benefits lost by a member leaving (irregardless of the monitary aspects).

I was counting on meeting up with VTmaverick & somebeach to run the Outer Banks next summer & I think it was somebeach who knew the trails.

Somebeach ... if yer still listening ... wanna 'play in the sand' next summer (I'll bring the burgers, dogs & grill)?

[ZEUS]

I haven't post any word 'till now.

We,under no circunstancies shall finger any member for donations.Teehee...

I liked everything you said, Gus... I would like to believe people will donate on their own but I don't have much faith in people. Yes, times are tough for everyone and money is tight. I know though, this site grew to be more than Scott had initially planned. Tone informed us all how badly the server needed to be upgraded to handle the amount of bandwidth we were going through. Things were very unstable. The lot of us raised enough cash to fund the upgrade - YAY US! Scott still did all the work. This upgrade would not have happened if nobody took the initiative to make things happen. However, this also raised yearly costs a bit and has increased Scott's workload in managing the site. Several of us have developed a friendship with Scott - he is a wonderful person to know, with a great sense of humor and wit, and he looks out for others in seemingly every respect. I admire the man and personally it feels to me like we should be looking out for him. I hate how this topic ends up so often and we all know Scott does as well. I whole-heartedly agree that some of the tactics used to recruit support in the past should be looked upon with regret and for my part I do regret my own failed attempts and methods.

Still, the fact is, a decent and subtle reminder of the needs of this site is a good thing. I know this site works because of the work Scott has done to make it work and because of the money that is donated to meet the yearly costs. If someone chooses to not donate, that is fine - it is NOT a requirement - but the need is still there for enough kind people to fund Scott's on-going efforts. New members come along every month and they don't know Scott (Moncha), his situation, his health, his frustration, the work he puts in, nor the funds collected to make ends meet. I believe it best for people to be informed and therefore I encourage decent site support reminders. If a current member already knows Scott and chooses not to support the site financially they need no reminder nor history lesson nor abuse.

Just be gentle and respectful in our methods and there should not be a problem in keeping things civilized nor finding the needed funds to keep things up and running.

I still see no reason for Doug to leave and think he is over-reacting... which is something I know very well :bgwo: but whatever, good luck to ya.

[erland]

In light of this conversation I humbly request to have the "Zoid" label taken off my name.

[Ldub]

In light of this conversation I humbly request to have the "Zoid" label taken off my name.

All ya gotta do is break 50 or 100 posts, I can't remember which...:yesgray:

At your current average of 10 per yr...well, you do the math...:smilewink

To put that goal on the fast track, twenty bucks changes you from "zoid" to site supporter...:thumbup:

The site supporter tag isn't showing up under anyone's name right now because the Boss was in the middle of a site upgrade when he started having some severe health problems...:(

[VXorado]

To put that goal on the fast track, twenty bucks changes you from "zoid" to site supporter...:thumbup:




I don't think Larry read this thread :laughing:. I think that counts as harassment

[Anita]

Let me add something here that maybe not everyone knows, but perhaps will put some of this discussion to bed. Scott has been working on a system where those wishing to sell something (VX related of course) on the forum would have to pay a small amt of $$ to post. If you are already a donor to the site, of course you would not have to pay extra. I think its a pretty fair way of handling a touchy situation which seems to illicit good folk to have very different opinions. I ask everyone to practice patience and kindness until Scott can put the system in place.