ATTN!!!! 5 SPEED SWAP W/TOD DONE! [Text View]

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BigMeatVX

04/04/2010, 10:23 AM

Ok, so heres the story....

After blowing thru 3, yes 3, automatics, I decided to finally go for the 5 speed swap.

For those of you that have been around a while, I would have done this swap long ago, if I had not been misinformed by "know-it-alls" on here claiming that this exact swap just was NOT possible!!!:upsetgray

After a bit of research, I concluded that I could indeed use the AR5 out of a newer Trooper. The Trooper, with the manual option, was only availble with a standard style transfer case, (No TOD) So...I needed to mate this tranny up to my stock TOD transfer case.

This is a DIRECT bolt in swap!!!!:p:bwgy::clap:
All parts are OEM!!!! EVEN the DRIVELINES are the SAME!!!!

Here is a list of needed items....

AR 5 manual 5 speed (1998-2001 Trooper)
Isuzu 3.5 Flywheel (3.2 will work if you have it turned)
New flywheel bolts OEM
Trooper clutch set (preasure plate, disk, T. O. Berring) OEM ONLY!!!!
Trooper input shaft pilot berring
New clutch preasure plate bolts OEM
Isuzu Rodeo Clutch master cylinder (1998-2001)
Isuzu Rodeo clutch pedal assembly (98-01)
Isuzu Trooper clutch slave cylinder (1998-2001)
Clutch hydraulic lines.
Trooper computer (manual tranny model 98-00)
Trooper shifter boots

Reccomended... New rear main seal
Optional...Trooper manual tranny exhaust system

Remove your old auto and transfer case, T. Converter, flexplate, pilot bushing from crank, and drivelines, exhaust, computer, shifter assembly...ect...

Remove blocking plate frome firewall (2 bolts) where clutch master cylinder will go.

install master cylinder, clutch pedal, hydraulic lines.
Install rear main seal, input pilot berring, Flywheel, disk, preasure plate

On the shifter assembly in the TOD transfer case, The metal top cover with 4 bolts will need to be removed and clearanced 1/4".
As you try to slide the AR5 into the TOD case, you will see where the shifter hits just slightly. This is the area that needs to be "trimmed" just a small amount. (I used a 4" angle grinder) took me 5 minute to remove 1/4"...

After that, you will be able to slide the two cases together..bolt cases together using the old TOD bolts you removed.

Install the Throw out bering in the input shaft...(do not remove wedge collar!!!) Do not install T.O. Berring on preasre plate!!!!:madb:

Install new gearbox and TOD unit as one...install slave,crossmember,drivelines,exhaust...ect..hook up computer...You will have to re-route some fuel lines. (bend and re-attach to tranny)

Have someone help bleed out the hydraulic system

On the old wiring harness, you will have to cut into the plug that used to go to the shifter switches (on auto tranny) isollate the black and blue/blk wires and connect them together. (this tells the computer you are in Park or Nuetrall, so the starter will engage):yeso:

Also you will need to find the reverse switch on the new gearbox and wire it up to the revers wires, so the reverse lights will work...

Lastly, the One of the oxygen sensors was moved to a different location (befor the CAT) on the trooper, so you may want to swap to Trooper exhaust or have a shop install the sensor ahead of one of the Cats...:bgwo:

Driving the manual trannied VX is AWESOME!!! More controll, power.:yes:
Power and shifting seems VERY similar to a 90s era 5.0lt 225HP mustang!!! VERY FUN! 0-60 times has surely dropped.
Everything feels more "DIRECT"...
The TOD functions just as it did with the AUTO...
Fuel Mileage has increased...figure 2-3 mpg better!
Duralbility...The Trooper clutch is HUGE...a 10.4" plate with 1700#s clamping force...(1 Ton style) however, due to the Pull-type design, pedal effort is light! (Pull style clutches are AWESOME, usually used on exotics) And have 30% less pedal effort than older push style systems...
The AR5 is a well build gearbox with 3 sycro rings (not 2) for smooth quick shifts, even with large heavy-duty clutch disks.

Feel free to ask questions or comment...

etlsport

04/04/2010, 10:40 AM

how much did the whole swap cost you? :dance::drool2:

any dummy lights on the dash?

BigMeatVX

04/04/2010, 11:01 AM

Costs:

Used Trooper 5speed....$650
Used Pedal assebly w/ master cyl. $125
New Clutch set w/R.Main seal.....$600 DO NOT BUY AFTERMARKET!!!!!!!
hydraulic hose.........$25
Computer.. $75
Used Flywheel .... $75
turn flywheel...... $45
rebuilt Slave cyl.........................$60
Shifter boots $45
Misc bolts, wreing misc, oil.....$85

Total........................................$1685 :)

DONT buy Napa or Auto Zone clutches!!!!
They are built wrong!!!!:mado:

rowhard

04/04/2010, 02:28 PM

Sweet. Does the TOD work like with the stock setup? No problem shifting up and down the box? How far is Lake Stevens from Olympia, think I would like to check this out. This VX is the first Automatic I have ever owned. Yea it's nice in city traffic, but boring.

Marlin

04/04/2010, 03:16 PM

You ROCK!!!! Once again proving, don't ever let anyone tell you can't do anything. You have certainly just broke ground with this swap.
Thats about what I spent putting in a new auto tranny a few months ago...where were you then?:)

Riff Raff

04/04/2010, 03:31 PM

How far is Lake Stevens from Olympia, think I would like to check this out.

ROWHARD--- According to MapQuest; Lake Stevens is 95 miles (+/-) away from Olympia. I too, would like to check it out. Perhaps we can "convoy" together to Lake Stevens on a pre-coordinated Sunday afternoon in the future.

BigMeatVX--- Awesome posting, my friend!!! I love people who are willing to trudge forward thru the fog and throw caution to the wind without fear of failure. Job well done. Thanx for such a detailed thread of information, as it gives other VX-ers another option if they also have tranny issues with their existing AT.

BigMeatVX

04/04/2010, 04:38 PM

Thanks for the respect....:smilewink

TOD works the EXACT same as before...it is noticably more sinstive to throttle...(remember a Torque converter "cushions" alot of drivetrain shock)

I will actually be in the olyimpia area this comming weekend...PM me if you wanna meet up and take a look at it....Take it for a drive around the block if you like.

I havent been on this forum much, sorry...been busy with my Rhino R1 conversion...

New lower Ring and pinion gears are next on the list.:yeso:

The only issue with the lights on the dash is that the new computer lights up the "check Trans" light in each gear....On the trooper this is the up-shift light, telling you when to shift into the next gear for best ecconomy.

the last "bug" I am working out is that the cruise controll is not functioning....my guess is that I need to chase down a wire that sends signal when auto was placed in to gear, or it may be the same blue black wires that I had to connect for the starter...I may rewire those to a switch on the clutch pedal (as per wiring diagram)...pretty sure this is the issue...starter needs to think its in nuetrall or park and Cruise controll needs to "think" that the gearbox is in L,2,3,D....I may use a relay for this....

Lastly the MA5 out of a Hummer H3 or GM colorado/caynon 5 speed will also bolt right up....This gearbox has a 1/8" larger input shaft...the rest is the same as the Trooper gearbox EXEPT for the tailhousing...It will not bolt up to the Isuzu TOD box....Howeveer You can use a H3 transfer case behind this gearbox...Advantages are 4:1 LOW RANGE ....dis advantage is that BOTH driveline will have to be changed to a less superior slip-in-tranny-style slip yoke....this means VERY short drivelines....

I am looking into the possibility that the H3 4:1 planitary gearset will fit in the Isuzu TOD box....(they are both BorgWarner TOD designs):yesgray:

Ascinder

04/04/2010, 04:52 PM

Pics or it never happened:p Seriously though, awesome job, just curious but how were the aftermarket clutches built wroung? Did you try a centerforce at all? How hard was it to mount up the clutch pedal assembly? I don't know if you knew, but I'm doing a V8 swap that's using a manual transmission. Did you have to fab the clutch mount or was it just a direct bolt up?

BigMeatVX

04/04/2010, 05:47 PM

Centerforce does not make one for this application...the used to make one for the Rodeo 3.2 however they discontinued the part due to lack of sales....(the guy at centerforce said that the stockers RARLEY failed...and that a pull-type cluch does not allow room for their "weights", and that it is difficult to improve on the OEM preasure plate design)

Many aftermarket disks are availavle in this 1"-24 spline count, however All of them are much smaller in dia. (pucks, twin disks, ect)

The aftermarket clutch sets that are made wrong...it is the "female" part of the wedge ring....the part that is attached to the preasure plate...

They machine the recessed area (where the snap ring sits) TOO BIG, and then the wedge collar slips right thru.:upsetgray:mady::mado2:...Take my advice don't buy one....Also the T.O. Berring wont even fit over the input shaft stub...Chinese JUNK!!!!:madb2:

The OEM Isuzu one is made with precision...big differnence!!!:bwgy:

Mounting up the clutch pedal assembly was easy...you have to move a few wires outta the way and re-mount the security system computer (right in the way) the pedal assembly is direct BOLT on...the VX firewall was pre-made with the correct pattern for the Rodeo pedal assly. AND for the clutch master cylinder....

ZEUS

04/04/2010, 06:03 PM

AWESOME! See ya put it to use in Moab this year? :D

VXorado

04/04/2010, 07:21 PM

I'm impressed and Jealous!!!!! Thanks for all the details, it nice to know that there are options if the auto trans goes out. IMHO manuals are much better than autos

don moore

04/04/2010, 09:52 PM

hmmmmmm...

tomdietrying

04/04/2010, 10:06 PM

Well done!
Peace.
Tom

Ldub

04/04/2010, 11:33 PM

WELL DONE !...:_wrench:...:thumbup:...:yesgray:

Sprey

04/05/2010, 01:27 AM

x2 on the Well done !!!

Hmmmm Any pics :D :D :D

nfpgasmask

04/05/2010, 12:42 PM

Centerforce does not make one for this application...the used to make one for the Rodeo 3.2 however they discontinued the part due to lack of sales...

Really? Because that is the clutch I just put in my 91 Trooper last November. I ordered it through Summit and it took a couple weeks but I know am running a 3.2 Rodeo Centerforce in my Trooper...

EDIT #1: Centerforce Clutch - Part #DF569040

EDIT #2: Ok, maybe I am wrong, you mention the 3.2 Rodeo clutch, looking back on my notes, I think the clutch I used is from the older Rodeos (3.1 I think).

Bart

So-CalVX

04/05/2010, 08:04 PM

this is awesome news! i have been wanting to hear this for a while now and it doesn't sound that expensive... sounds like i just need to drop my insurance and get a beater till this is finished if i attempt

now we jus need to get rid of the TOD and go full manual all around...
maybe i'll be the guinea pig on that... unless someone wants to do a write up before me and i can follow in their footsteps lol

blacksambo

04/05/2010, 08:45 PM

Congratulations! Well done. This may be close to how the Isuzu factory rally cars were put together? A lot of what you mention is in the '99 VX factory parts book. Sounds really fun to drive, and the extra mileage is a true performance boost without a mileage penalty. It's just far more efficient with the same HP.

Ascinder

04/05/2010, 08:54 PM

the pedal assembly is direct BOLT on...the VX firewall was pre-made with the correct pattern for the Rodeo pedal assly. AND for the clutch master cylinder....

That would have been really nice to know before I had gone out and bought all new Wilwood clutch equipment:mado: Oh well.

Sounds like it's all benefits for running a manual!!! Now we just need to find an actual OEM type clutch disc that doesn't cost so much and this will be a really affordable swap. It seems really strange that absolutley no aftermarket discs worked. If I may ask, do you mind sharing what brands/sources you tried before using the stock clutch setup? I just wonder if there is someone out there making them "the right way" that could be a factory alternative.

BigMeatVX

04/05/2010, 10:28 PM

I thought the Rodeo clutch pedal bolt-up was common knowledge...LOL:bwgy:

I tried a Napa Clutch set and a Auto Zone (LUK brand)...

The Disks are OK, but the preasure plates are machined incorrectly....

neither was made well.:madb::mado::upsetwgra and I had an (very used) OEM Trooper clutch still attached to the Flywheel I bought, so I could compare side by side...OEM quality to aftermarket JUNK!!!:upsetgray

I am sure that there IS a decent aftermarket setup somewhere out there, I just didnt want to buy anymore clutch sets (and return them the next day) Plus those were the only ones readily available W/O taking an even bigger gamble by ordering another aftermarket....

There is a way to use the aftermarket preasure plate...BUT ONLY IF you already have an OEM trooper preasure plate...,On the OEM, it IS possble to dis-assemble the inner portion of the preasure plate and re-install this part on the aftermarket preasure plate... basicaly replacing the part that was made TOO big with the OEM one....

There are ALOT of different trannys that use this input shaft...SO.... you CAN find a variety of DISKs that have the correct fit... (this should help the V-8 swaps)
Preasure plates might be a bit trickier, though....

WormGod

04/06/2010, 07:58 AM

Great job BigMeat. Hell of an undertaking. Keep us updated on the operation and reliability of the overhaul. I would love to go the same route, but it's not something I would want to do in my garage and I am doubtful that anybody around me would want to tackle it. Definitely a route I would love to take though.

LittleBeast

04/06/2010, 11:05 AM

I would love to see some pictures, and man if you did a How To (with pictures) on this I think you would have lots of new friends ;)

kodiak

04/06/2010, 03:32 PM

You have made VX history! This is right up there with landing on the moon. Great job!

VCrossfan

04/06/2010, 03:54 PM

VX'rs always find a way, Nice Job ! ! :smack: :_wrench: :_steering ! ! !

Hotsauce

04/06/2010, 05:21 PM

Pictures, or it didn't happen :)

Respect due.

John C.

Knigh7s

04/06/2010, 06:21 PM

Pictures, or it didn't happen :)

Respect due.

John C.

What he said! LOL, JK, JK...

Could you maybe give us a little bit more details about the install? a basic how to to get some of us started?

How about an install thread/wiki, that we can all pitch in with part numbers and all things needed, even the small stuff.

LiquidVX

04/07/2010, 07:35 AM

Seriously, this is astounding. I am practically checking this thread hourly for the photos. Since I have read this it feels like I have $1,700 burning a hole in my pocket.

AK Falco

04/07/2010, 07:10 PM

Lake stevens la ha has a good happy hour and I would love to check it out.

rowhard

04/07/2010, 08:36 PM

Lake stevens la ha has a good happy hour and I would love to check it out.

If your interested

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?threadid=17721

spitfire5454

04/07/2010, 10:37 PM

This is outstanding news. what is this tranny rated at for power. Im one of the lucky ones with a supercharger. we have talked about raising the boost before but we know that aside from computer-fuel control issue, the tranny was really our weak point. Is this unit more durable?

vt_maverick

04/08/2010, 05:44 AM

jdm monkey

04/13/2010, 08:52 PM

Will the rodeo MT fit too?

Dumke

04/15/2010, 05:33 PM

If your interested

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?threadid=17721

What happened to the meet and pictures??

Posting it here instead of the other post..

vt_maverick

04/15/2010, 08:06 PM

He must have sworn them all to secrecy. ;) Or maybe had them all sign NDAs so he can start selling 5-speed swap kits here. :p

RamAirZ

04/15/2010, 11:47 PM

I would think the rodeo one would work. The bellhousing and flywheel is the same so you could use an MUA5 from say a 98' Rodeo and delete TOD and get some Tera-Low's. I also don't see why the 93-97's wouldn't work as they also use the same flywheel. There is a guy with a turbocharged pup' running a 2wd MUA5 putting down over 300hp at the tires, so it should be able to hold it. The AR5 is rated at 260 ft/lbs but they also come in the Solstice and the base Mallet Solstice with the stock LS2 conversion retains the AR5 transmission, so it should be able to handle anything the 3.5 can throw at it unless your gonna order parts from Australia and boost the pee out of it! I talked to Mallet about the AR5 in the past and they said with 400hp/400ft/lbs from the LS2 on nice street tirres they never ran into any issues but weren't sure how well it would handle sticky tires and launching at the track. For our use and power even with a blower I think we would be fine. Nice swap! I'm thinking of swapping to an MUA5 later on, but most likely with an engine swap unless I can find a supercharger.

LiquidVX

04/16/2010, 07:52 PM

:_confused

Have we been trolled?

rowhard

04/17/2010, 11:29 AM

What happened to the meet and pictures??

Posting it here instead of the other post..

It didn't happen:confused:

vt_maverick

04/17/2010, 11:40 AM

It didn't happen:confused:

Did you guys get stood up?

LiquidVX

04/17/2010, 10:10 PM

Whats going on here? BM drops an atom bomb of a story with enough details to make it totally believable. A meet is scheduled... then nothing. Nobody is saying anything? Sorry but I am dying to hear and see more.

RamAirZ

04/17/2010, 10:59 PM

That sucks, but it seems totally possible. If anything a 5-spd swap is easily done, just no TOD.

Ldub

04/17/2010, 11:18 PM

The TOD functions just as it did with the AUTO...

:_thinking...From the first post...:_thinking

RamAirZ

04/18/2010, 12:02 AM

I meant by swapping in an MUA5 with integral transfercase. The TOD function seems to be the only issue that I see people worried about. If the TOD case does indeed bolt up to the AR5, then I don't see why it couldn't function as normal. I know the MUA5 had an integral case so it could not maintain the TOD since it didn't come with it. But if people just want a manual transmission, it should be fairly straight forward. That's what I was getting at, sorry

Ldub

04/18/2010, 12:08 AM

RamAirZ

04/18/2010, 12:11 AM

Ya my bad, I thought by "if anything" meant, at least to me, that just a 5spd swap is possible but may not have TOD. But now we know, and knowing is half the battle haha. I'm planning an MUA5 swap at some point. I'd like to have 2wd for around town and to be better on the CV's and what not. Also swap in some lower t-case gears. Then I can get a 4wd high function too.

LiquidVX

04/18/2010, 07:02 AM

ATTN!!!! 5 SPEED SWAP W/TOD DONE!

The TOD is what has me all jazzed up!

jdm monkey

04/18/2010, 09:34 AM

I guess we'll soon find out. I'm heading down the local junk yard to pull a 5 speed trans etc. today.

LiquidVX

04/18/2010, 10:55 AM

I guess we'll soon find out. I'm heading down the local junk yard to pull a 5 speed trans etc. today.

Great. Keep us posted with pics and info.

RamAirZ

04/18/2010, 11:43 AM

Ya for sure, your grabbing a 98 + AR5 from a Trooper right?

jdm monkey

04/18/2010, 05:38 PM

Bad news... no AR5 :( only a MM5. But I got the clutch pedal and brake pedal, master slave, clutch hard lines etc.

RamAirZ

04/19/2010, 12:04 AM

MM5? You mean MUA5? Did you snatch all that stuff from a Rodeo?

jdm monkey

04/19/2010, 08:43 AM

I looked at the firewall plate and it said: Transmission: MM5
Yeah I snatched it from a Rodeo.

RamAirZ

04/19/2010, 09:40 AM

ok that's just the transmission option code, not the actual transmission. That should be a Borg Warner trans with code MM5, what year was the truck? RNK should be the code for the AR5.

BigMeatVX

04/20/2010, 08:36 PM

He must have sworn them all to secrecy. ;) Or maybe had them all sign NDAs so he can start selling 5-speed swap kits here. :p

Thats a damn good idea!!!!:bgwb:

Sorry, everyone, my trip/meet got cancled....

BigMeatVX

05/17/2010, 02:57 PM

Update....For those curious about the swap.

Just returned from Moab...Got a great chance to do some real "testing" of the 5-speed swap out there...

Seems my 1st gear /low range crawl speed is slower and lower than with the auto...defenatly WAY more controll.

Big improvment in engine braking when dropping off steep ledges, and decending steep slopes.

Overall, the manual tranny and clutch held up well on some of Moabs more difficult trails. (wish I could say the same for my CVs)

Gas mileage on the trip down to Moab and back I averaged 19MPG+!!!
Not bad, especially when I was "cruising" at 105MPH much of the way there!!!
And, thats with HEAVY wide-*** 35s installed...

Stock tired VXs would surley see well above 20MPG...:bgwb:

RamAirZ

05/18/2010, 08:53 AM

Good to hear! Are you still running stock gears?

BigMeatVX

05/18/2010, 11:39 AM

Good to hear! Are you still running stock gears?

Yeah, 4.30 gears still....Limited slips front and rear.....
Lower gears are on the list....:yesy:

RamAirZ

05/18/2010, 11:51 AM

Where did you get the front LSD? Out of an Impulse or were you lucky enough to snag a power brute? I'm debating if I want to swap gears or not, with the MUA5, in 5th it will be about the same RPM as stock 4L30E with 255/55-18, both with 4.30's. I've debated going 4.56 or 4.77 but not sure I'll need em' when I do the tera-low's.

LiquidVX

05/18/2010, 02:15 PM

Cool story. We aren't ever getting pics are we...

BigSwede

05/18/2010, 02:26 PM

Well FWIW we all saw him wheeling it in Moab...I have pics but you can't tell it's a manual tranny from the outside.

LiquidVX

05/18/2010, 02:45 PM

oh good. I was really looking for some kind of confirmation before buying up all the parts. Thanks.

VX crazy

05/18/2010, 02:46 PM

Oh and I DID take a pic of the inside, I will post tonight if I can reduce the size of photo.

ZEUS

05/18/2010, 03:00 PM

Cool story. We aren't ever getting pics are we...I was lucky enough to get behind the wheel in the parking lot. The hole in the trans tunnel hasn't been cleaned up (and may never be) but in theory you should be able to make a manual Rodeo interior fit around the gear shifter. Otherwise, I can confirm it works just like a 5-speed oughta!

RickOKC

05/18/2010, 03:21 PM

Oh and I DID take a pic of the inside, I will post tonight if I can reduce the size of photo.
You're welcome to email the photo to me. I can reduce it and send it back to you (or post it.)

RamAirZ

05/18/2010, 03:51 PM

Awesome to hear! I'm planning a 5spd swapp soon myself so nice to see it works. The 97 and down pedals and what not should all work as well I believe.

VX crazy

05/18/2010, 07:52 PM

here is the photo.....not of Alans pants but of his gear shifter

Triathlete

05/18/2010, 07:59 PM

but of his gear shifter

Like that makes it sound any better!:bwgy:

VX crazy

05/18/2010, 08:01 PM

Like that makes it sound any better!:bwgy:

yeah, when I die someone is gonna find this picture labeled BigMeat on my puter and see its some guys crotch LOL

RamAirZ

05/18/2010, 08:44 PM

hhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

MSHardeman

05/19/2010, 09:43 AM

Here; I took a "crotch-less" picture of BigMeat's VX.

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/Top_of_the_World_10_10.JPG

I was totally impressed with what Alan and his VX where capable of. Most of what he did with a clutch I could bearly do with an automatic. Way to go Alan.:thumbup:

BigSwede

06/09/2010, 11:35 AM

Attention to anyone contemplating a manual tranny swap - there is a guy on the planet parting out a manual tranny 99 Trooper.

http://forum.planetisuzoo.com/viewtopic.php?p=321049#321049

Griffin

06/22/2010, 09:22 PM

Ever fix the light and cruise control so they could work properly? Maybe I missed it..

BigMeatVX

06/25/2010, 11:32 AM

Yes... the cruise controll now works as before....And I unplgged the "shift light"

Also, I just recently changed over to the Trooper style 5-speed exhaust system...
It uses a larger single Cat....and the "Y" is now before the Cat....I went 3" dia. From the "Y" back...Magnaflow cat and muffler...

eternal21

09/26/2010, 08:06 PM

Do you have any pics of the install? I'm contemplating this, and pics are always good :)

Oh, and the shift lever/knob.....is that from a Rodeo or a Trooper?

eternal21

09/27/2010, 09:33 AM

Well, part 1 down.....picked up the tranny w/92k on it for $100 :)

BigMeatVX

09/30/2010, 06:40 AM

Do you have any pics of the install? I'm contemplating this, and pics are always good :)

Oh, and the shift lever/knob.....is that from a Rodeo or a Trooper?

Trooper:yesy:

eternal21

09/30/2010, 10:38 AM

Cool, thanks. You don't recommend a non OEM clutch, but I see that Centerforce makes one for this application....thoughts?

BigMeatVX

10/01/2010, 08:15 AM

Last time I looked, the centerforce does NOT make a clutch kit fot the trooper 3.5?????:confused:
Mabey double check that?:yeso:

vt_maverick

01/03/2012, 08:32 AM

Wanted to link these two threads for anyone considering this swap in the future. I am currently having Buffy swap my transmission and he is attempting to improve upon the look of the install as well as create comprehensive "how-to" documentation with pictures here:

VT Maverick's 5 Speed Swap (http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?threadid=21729)

89Vette

01/19/2012, 01:30 PM

Kinda curious....

Will manual transmissions (or autos for that matter) from SBC's or other V8's hook up to the 6VE1 engine?

I'm curious because 6-spd units with a higher overdrive seem appealing. For example, the ZF-6 in my vette has a 0.5 6th gear. That's like going from 4.30's in the rear to 2.15's.

5th is about the same as the OD in the VX (.075). So, while the VX may not have the TQ of a V8 (to pull at .5 OD), you certainly could slow the engine on flat/downhill stretches. Then, back to 5th when headed more uphill.

IOW, isn't there an option for lower-speed OD out there?

(Actually, I was also curious about the trans in my mom's Lincoln LS. It's a V6 with a 5-spd auto. I haven't looked up the gear ratio's, but it's a hoot to listen too. It's the only auto I've driven that sounds as much like a stick. And, it sounds like it's got an extra shift (gear) getting to speed...meaning it might help with launches of a 4k lb vehicle.)

RamAirZ

01/19/2012, 05:58 PM

Ldub

01/19/2012, 06:41 PM

Kinda curious....

Will manual transmissions (or autos for that matter) from SBC's or other V8's hook up to the 6VE1 engine?

I'm curious because 6-spd units with a higher overdrive seem appealing. For example, the ZF-6 in my vette has a 0.5 6th gear. That's like going from 4.30's in the rear to 2.15's.

5th is about the same as the OD in the VX (.075). So, while the VX may not have the TQ of a V8 (to pull at .5 OD), you certainly could slow the engine on flat/downhill stretches. Then, back to 5th when headed more uphill.

IOW, isn't there an option for lower-speed OD out there?

FWIW...I have my doubts wether an OD will have much appreciable value with regard to mileage, especially if you choose to run larger than stock O D tires.

I'm rolling 35's, & my mileage got a little better with the addn of 4:77 gearing.
Indicating to me, that the mileage "sweet spot" is 2k & above.

Maybe for the occasional downhill grade, but for flat land running, I have my doubts.

89Vette

01/20/2012, 10:45 PM

FWIW...I have my doubts wether an OD will have much appreciable value with regard to mileage, especially if you choose to run larger than stock O D tires.

I'm rolling 35's, & my mileage got a little better with the addn of 4:77 gearing.
Indicating to me, that the mileage "sweet spot" is 2k & above.

Maybe for the occasional downhill grade, but for flat land running, I have my doubts.

Well....35's do weight a lot, lift the body up, and create more drag. FWIW, vettes with the A4 get 25mpg. With the ZF6, it moves up to 30mpg. Big difference slowing a SBC down (for hwy mpg).

LittleBeast

05/25/2015, 01:02 PM

After blowing thru 3, yes 3, automatics, I decided to finally go for the 5 speed swap.

Here is a list of needed items....

AR 5 manual 5 speed (1998-2001 Trooper)
Isuzu 3.5 Flywheel (3.2 will work if you have it turned)
New flywheel bolts OEM
Trooper clutch set (preasure plate, disk, T. O. Berring) OEM ONLY!!!!
Trooper input shaft pilot berring
New clutch preasure plate bolts OEM
Isuzu Rodeo Clutch master cylinder (1998-2001)
Isuzu Rodeo clutch pedal assembly (98-01)
Isuzu Trooper clutch slave cylinder (1998-2001)
Clutch hydraulic lines.
Trooper computer (manual tranny model 98-00)
Trooper shifter boots

Reccomended... New rear main seal
Optional...Trooper manual tranny exhaust system

Feel free to ask questions or comment...

I had my old tranny rebuild twice, and then swapped in another auto tranny to have the torque converter burn up in under a year, so I too am done with the auto tranny and have already bought a '99 Manual Trooper and it is sitting in my driveway. Couple of questions:

Why the new flywheel bolts? The old ones look brand new still.
Why the new clutch pressure plate bolts?
I am assuming I can still order the new clutch set/shaft pilot bearing/rear main seal from IsuzuParts.com, correct? Thanks in advance, can't wait to have this done.

orion

05/25/2015, 04:04 PM

Flywheel and clutch bolts are high stressed when in use, once removed you can have cracks in the bolt heads that can't be see. Always replace them. :thumbup:
Clutch parts should be easy to find, you can shop around.

eternal21

05/26/2015, 11:46 PM

I had my old tranny rebuild twice, and then swapped in another auto tranny to have the torque converter burn up in under a year, so I too am done with the auto tranny and have already bought a '99 Manual Trooper and it is sitting in my driveway. Couple of questions:

Why the new flywheel bolts? The old ones look brand new still.
Why the new clutch pressure plate bolts?
I am assuming I can still order the new clutch set/shaft pilot bearing/rear main seal from IsuzuParts.com, correct? Thanks in advance, can't wait to have this done.

Sometimes the bolts may stretch, but I've never seen it happen, personally. I reused them, and have since put over 12k on the setup.

bartmanS4

05/27/2015, 12:29 AM

Isuzu flywheel bolts are torque to yield and therefore should only be used once. Will they fail if you use them twice? Probably not but they made them TTY for a reason.

LittleBeast

05/27/2015, 02:58 PM

Should I go ahead and get:

Ring gear or Release fork?

My Release Fork is kinda rusty, but not sure about the ring gear.

LittleBeast

06/01/2015, 04:33 PM

So I ordered through IsuzuParts.com and these items are on backorder:

-Clutch Disc
-Pressure Plate

They are asking me what I want to do. They said that backordering the parts could take up to 3 months!?!?

nfpgasmask

06/01/2015, 05:12 PM

I would say that estimate is about right. The parts will need to come from Japan. I ordered 2 washer fluid pumps from Jerry and they took about 3 months or so for him to get them from Japan. It just is what it is. Or, buy something aftermarket. Just get a good Exedy clutch for the right application. Most of the time, the Isuzu clutches are Exedy anyhow.

Bart

LittleBeast

06/01/2015, 05:48 PM