Replace seals when repack bearings?

[LiquidVX]

I know some time ago Kenny did a write up about repacking the wheel bearings. I will be doing this since I have to take everything apart to replace the rotor anyways. My question though is do I NEED to replace the seals also? Advance Auto is the closest auto parts store and they do not carry the hub seal. If I must replace it is there a place online I could order them from? I searched the part numbers he listed in his guide but did not find them.

[MSHardeman]

If you are going to repack the bearings then I would replace the seals just to be safe. You will more than likely bugger them up when you take them out so it's good to have another set on hand.

You can give Merlin a call at St. Charles Isuzu and he can get the seals right out to you. They're pretty inexpensive, from what I remember, so it's cheap insurance.

[Ldub]

x2 what Mark said...:yesgray:

IIRC, they're less than $20 for a pair, so why not.

Also, you can get em at nearly fine purveyor of auto parts.

[LiquidVX]

ok. thanks guys. I will order them now.

[nfpgasmask]

Yeah, you can get them from AutoZone/Napa I think as well. Like $8 each I think...but I would go OEM for a VX for sure!

Bart

[LiquidVX]

I so I have most everything I need to replace all for disc brakes, lines, repack the bearings then have a great day. However I have been following the guides made by forum members and can't seem to locate a bearing locknut tool. Kenny's writeup says to use the ford 1/2 ton 4 prong bearing nut tool, which I bought but its way too big. I have been to 3 parts stores this morning alone and cannot find the locknut tool I need. So my question is:

What is everyone here using? I can I get these bearings out?

My car has been jacked up for a week and really was looking forward to finishing this mess today. Thanks for any info you guys have.

[Ldub]

You don't need the bearing tool...even a little.

Once the little phillips head retaining screws are out, (use a hand impact driver to remove them, & if possible, replace them with metric stainless screws of the same size/pitch) it's easy enough to put a flat blade screw driver on the edge of one of the non tapered holes & give it a little force in the right direction. I've never had to use more than the force of a couple of quick palm strikes to get them started. If you need a hammer, you MIGHT be trying to turn it the wrong way.
If the hole that you put the screw driver blade in is on the top, you want the hole to move left.
:_wrench:...:luck:

[MSHardeman]

The Ford hub nut tool works like a charm but you DO have to "alter" it. I think Kenny went over that in his instructions, but if he didn't; you have to grind off two of the four "prongs" of the Ford tool leaving two of them opposite of one another, then you have to grind the existing two prongs thinner (grind from the outside of the tool towards the center). Here's mine:

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSC043491.JPG

If you had more time I would gladly send you mine, but it sounds like you want/need to get this done today.

I'm sure the screwdriver and hammer work well, but I was just a bit paranoid about whacking my hub nut with a sharp object.

[LiquidVX]

The Ford hub nut tool works like a charm but you DO have to "alter" it. I think Kenny went over that in his instructions, but if he didn't; you have to grind off two of the four "prongs" of the Ford tool leaving two of them opposite of one another, then you have to grind the existing two prongs thinner (grind from the outside of the tool towards the center). Here's mine:

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSC043491.JPG

If you had more time I would gladly send you mine, but it sounds like you want/need to get this done today.

I'm sure the screwdriver and hammer work well, but I was just a bit paranoid about whacking my hub nut with a sharp object.

Yeah I thought about the screw driver and hammer but I will need to torque it properly on reassembly anyways. The Ford 1/2 ton locknut tool I have is 2 1/4" diameter. Its way too big. Do you have a part number on yours? Where can I get the smaller ford tool.

[MSHardeman]

Don't know if this is the part number, or not, but the number stamped on the outside of the tool is KD 2467. That's the only number that I see on it, but I think I got the tool from NAPA so it may be their part number.

The tool itself is 2 3/8" outside diameter, but I shaved the prongs down to an outside diameter of 2 1/8".

Also, don't know if this was in Kenny's write-up, but I also used an article that I found on www.planetisuzoo.com that describes, really well, how to repack the front bearings of an Amigo (pretty much the same set up as ours).

http://www.planetisuzoo.com/articles.htm?id=56&Isuzu_Front_Bearing_Repack

In the instructions they just call the tool a "4 prong Ford 1/2 Ton pickup front axle tool". It also says that if you want to use the special Isuzu tool it can be found at NAPA in the special tool catalog as part #3375.

This is all at hand because I just repacked my front bearings two weekends ago.

Hope all of this helps.

[Ldub]

FYI, the torque value isn't measured at the hub nut.
Proper preload is set by tightening the hub nut, & measuring resistance at the wheel stud, by using a fishing type scale. (before the caliper is reinstalled)
My personal favorite is a digital one I found at harbor freight.
You can easily get the hub nut tight enough using the same method as described for loosening.

[MSHardeman]

That's true, Dub, but I was just super paranoid about whacking at my hub nut. I tend to be mechanically disinclined and I was worried that I was going to stab or smash something that didn't like that sort of treatment.

I used my torque wrench as I was doing the pre-load on the hubs with the scale, and it came out to about 18-19 ft/lbs for my old, repacked bearings which is a pretty low torque number so a screwdriver and a hammer could easily reach that number.

[LiquidVX]

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/how_lock_nut.jpg

Thanks for the help guys but I must be dumb though. The service manual says to just remove the lock nut. How? I thought that's what the tool in my hand was for. Some say to tap it with a screwdriver and hammer which i have been trying but the nut is starting to get all marred up.

i have the 3 screws removed but seem stuck. It seems so simple but I don't get it. Maybe I should get the torch?

Where do I buy dental picks?

[MSHardeman]

Liquid, I see that you have removed two of the four prongs on the hub nut tool, but you MUST grind the existing two prongs "thinner" so that the overall diameter of the tool is smaller. Take a look at the picture of the tool that I altered and you can see that the two remaining prongs have been ground down from the outside in allowing them to fit into the holes in our hub nut.

You're right there!! Just grind the two prongs thinner until the distance from the outside of one prong to the outside of the other prong is a little less than 2 1/8" and the tool should fit in with no problem.

Oh, and I found a set of three picks (one straight, one right angle, and one obtuse angle) at my local auto parts store. You don't really need them, but it makes it easier to fish the locking ring out. You could probably do the job with a small screw driver. My locking ring was gooped to the hub nut with grease so the picks just allowed me to grab it and wiggle it loose so I could get it with my fingers.

I'll pm you my phone number so you can give me a call if you'd like.

[Kenny]

I may have referenced the Ford tool based on planetisuzoo's write up. I did not use one. I did the old hammer and a screwdriver. I think i did a lot of moderate taps and not big ones to turn it loose. The photo with "hub nut" shows the screwdriver I used to pull it out. Man it's been a while.

Liquid, let me know if you ran into the same thing as me and that the snap ring had to be shaved down to go back on. Always wondered why I had to do that....

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=11324&highlight=bearing

[MSHardeman]

Kenny, I have no idea why you had to shave your snap ring down. After reading your how-to I was worried that I would have to do the same thing, but I've repacked the bearings twice now and both times the snap ring went back on with no problem....even had a little room to spare on one side.

[MSHardeman]

LiquidVX, did it finally work out for you? Are you rolling on repacked bearings and new rotors?

[Kenny]

Kenny, I have no idea why you had to shave your snap ring down. After reading your how-to I was worried that I would have to do the same thing, but I've repacked the bearings twice now and both times the snap ring went back on with no problem....even had a little room to spare on one side.

hmm. I repacked the bearings and installed new rotors. maybe it was the hub nut was on a bit tighter before I took it apart. Wheels haven't fallen off yet, so all good!

[LiquidVX]

What a greasy job that was. I was able to get everything back together. The bearings really didn't need repacking after all but I was changing the rotors and figured while it was apart I might as well do it. But the original grease was still a nice blue color so I guess they were in good shape.

The hub nut tool worked out ok for me, I trimmed the prongs and it was a good fit.

I have not driven on it yet because Advance Auto parts gave me the wrong brake line coupler but I will be this after noon. I was replacing all the front brakes including the metal line that goes from the drivers side around the engine to the ABS.

One thing that struck me odd is in someone's write up it mentions using a fish scale for the proper pre-load. I went to Walmart and even bought the scale but then after I realized the fish scale method might give me too little or too much torque depending on the length of the wrench. I had a torque bar but that seems to have gone missing so I just guessed it. I will let you know when the wheels fall off.

[Ldub]

What a greasy job that was. I was able to get everything back together. The bearings really didn't need repacking after all but I was changing the rotors and figured while it was apart I might as well do it. But the original grease was still a nice blue color so I guess they were in good shape.

The hub nut tool worked out ok for me, I trimmed the prongs and it was a good fit.

I have not driven on it yet because Advance Auto parts gave me the wrong brake line coupler but I will be this after noon. I was replacing all the front brakes including the metal line that goes from the drivers side around the engine to the ABS.

One thing that struck me odd is in someone's write up it mentions using a fish scale for the proper pre-load. I went to Walmart and even bought the scale but then after I realized the fish scale method might give me too little or too much torque depending on the length of the wrench. I had a torque bar but that seems to have gone missing so I just guessed it. I will let you know when the wheels fall off.

You hook the fish scale to the stud, to measure the amount of resistance that tightening the hub nut is creating.
I believe it was in Mr. Changs write up where it was described in great detail.
And don't miss the part about tightening & loosening the hub nut, & rotating the hub, to get the bearings & races seated properly.

Guessing isn't good enough on this...:smilewink

[nfpgasmask]

I got the correct hub nut tool on eBay for $20.

Bart

[LiquidVX]

You hook the fish scale to the stud, to measure the amount of resistance that tightening the hub nut is creating.
I believe it was in Mr. Changs write up where it was described in great detail.
And don't miss the part about tightening & loosening the hub nut, & rotating the hub, to get the bearings & races seated properly.

Guessing isn't good enough on this...:smilewink

ok. maybe i should have actually read it instead of just reading the parts list. I torqued the lock nut down then loosened then lightly tightened it again. There is some rubbing noise coming from the front right which is the one i think i left looser then the driver's side. So I guess I have to take it all apart again and do it right this time.

[Ldub]

:_wrench:...

After tightening the hub nut using the hub nut tool, rotate the hub assembly several times, forward and back. You will then need to loosen the hub nut and
rotate the hub assembly forward and reverse several times. Repeat the tightening, rotating, loosening, and rotating sequence several more times. This action
distributes the grease and seats the bearings. Tighten the hub nut one more time. Attach a spring scale to one of the wheel studs and pull. I started them at 3
o'clock (forward preload) and at 9 o'clock (reverse preload) and pulled straight down to measure pre-load. The Isuzu shop manual shows the mechanic pulling
from the 12 o'clock position. Adjust the tightness of the hub nut until your preload reads between 2.6lbs-4.0lbs for old bearings and a new seal or 4.4lbs-5.5lbs
for a new seal and new bearings. I tried to obtain these readings in both forward and reverse motion. Be sure to do this without the brake caliper installed.

He splains it much better than I do...:yesgray:...:_wrench:...:_wrench:...:_wrench: ...:_wrench:...:_wrench:

[LiquidVX]

:_wrench:...

After tightening the hub nut using the hub nut tool, rotate the hub assembly several times, forward and back. You will then need to loosen the hub nut and
rotate the hub assembly forward and reverse several times. Repeat the tightening, rotating, loosening, and rotating sequence several more times. This action
distributes the grease and seats the bearings. Tighten the hub nut one more time. Attach a spring scale to one of the wheel studs and pull. I started them at 3
o'clock (forward preload) and at 9 o'clock (reverse preload) and pulled straight down to measure pre-load. The Isuzu shop manual shows the mechanic pulling
from the 12 o'clock position. Adjust the tightness of the hub nut until your preload reads between 2.6lbs-4.0lbs for old bearings and a new seal or 4.4lbs-5.5lbs
for a new seal and new bearings. I tried to obtain these readings in both forward and reverse motion. Be sure to do this without the brake caliper installed.

He splains it much better than I do...:yesgray:...:_wrench:...:_wrench:...:_wrench: ...:_wrench:...:_wrench:

This was perfect. I took the wheels off and and redid the bearings and now there is no noise and it feels great. Thanks for all the help guys.