Drinking and Driving...

[VXIRONwoMAN]

Since Mark started one about seat belts, I have to chime in with mine on drinking.

Working as a bartender I see how many people drink and drive everyday. Even all of my co-workers get into their cars after having a few, or more than a few. From personal experience about 90% of the people who go out don't call a cab or have a designated driver. It's disgusting. We live in Chicago, there are cabs everywhere. Even worse, my co-workers get completely blasted and drive home and can't even recall how they got into their home. It's a serious matter that the majority doesn't take seriously.

This link is really gory and is not suitable for the kiddos or the squeamish...

http://www.eatnineghost.com/do-not-drink-and-drive/

[crotchrocket]

I'm with you! I haven't ever drank and driven and don't understand those that do. If i drive after 1 pint (UK Limit) i don't enjoy it at all. However i now live in London and theres no need to drink and drive at all!!!!

[BigSwede]

My buddy got a DWI recently, had 4 drinks in 3 hours. Based on what he experienced, many of us may be over the limit even when we think we are "fine". He was totally shocked he failed...this is a guy who would never knowingly break the law.

I am seriously considering getting a breathalyzer just so I can find out when I am actually at risk of a DWI.

[VX crazy]

My ex husband got a DUI when he was a detective just a couple years ago....needless to say he can never work in law enforcement again. Its not worth it, they sell those little handy devices that you can breath into to see if your over the limit, maybe I will find mine before moab!

[circmand]

The only problem is only 25% of the accidents on the road are caused by drunks. That means 75% are caused by sober people. We need to not let teens drive at all they cause a lot of accidents, studies show using a cell phone is as dangerous as drunk driving people who use cell phones when driving should be arrest and fined just like drunk drivers, also old farts have you seen them? They drive cars 3 miles long and cant see over the steering wheel. They drive half the speed limit and shouldnt be allowed to driveeither. And dont get me started when they get behind the wheel of RVs. As long as we are working at this have you seen these women who put make up on and get dressed while they are driving? Off to jail with them to. Dont think I am forgetting the guys but their list is too long too mention as well. And finally some people just cant drive but are given licenses anyhow.

One should not drink and drive but that is just one of the many things drivers are doing that is dangerous but the one every one likes to pick that they think would solve the worlds driving problems.

[Mile High VX]

Just realize that between 3% and 4% of alcohol related crashes result in a fatality, while only 1/2 to 3/4 of 1% of non-alcohol related crashes result in fatalities.

It's also important to note that all alcohol related accidents do not involve a drunk driver. If a drunk non-occupant (a pedestrian) steps in front of a car the accident is reported as an alcohol related incident.

I agree that more measures need to be taken to eliminate other types of distracted/impared driving so that we can all be safer on the road.

[circmand]

Just realize that between 3% and 4% of alcohol related crashes result in a fatality, while only 1/2 to 3/4 of 1% of non-alcohol related crased restult in fatalities.

It's also important to note that all alcohol related accidents do not involve a drunk driver. If a drunk non-occupant (a pedestrian) steps in front of a car the accident is reported as an alcohol related incident.

I agree that more measures need to be taken to eliminate other types of distracted/impared driving so that we can all be safer on the road.

After posting I was afraid my ranting may come off a tad offensive and people would think I condoned Drunk driving I do not.

[Mile High VX]

No offense taken here.

I think you did a nice job of making us all aware of other harmful behaviors that make our roads equally unsafe...:smilewink

[Cobrajet]

32 years ago, at the age of 23, I realized had a choice to make; keep drinking and driving and lose my precious Cobra, my TS/SBI clearance, my career, and possibly my life, or quit drinking and have a safe (boring) life. I'm still here, so you know which choice I made. Cold turkey! It can be done!

(My cars make up for my otherwise boring existence. :))

[VXIRONwoMAN]

...chicks painting their nails (one killed a mutual biker friend), guys shaving, people reading, texting they all are forms of distracted driving and are no doubt dangerous.

The worst one for me beside the drinking and driving goes out to the government, for giving the driving test in foreign languages when all of our signs are in English.

[VX crazy]

Great point Cece! Many years ago I was driving down a highway that had a cross street that had a stop sign, very clear large sign below said, cross traffic does not stop, well a non american woman that could not speak or read english ran this stop sign with her 5 children beside her in her pickup as I T boned her almost killing each and every one of them. I wrote letters to the state, I was pissed that the state of Texas gave her a drivers license when she could not read the sign!!

[RickOKC]

A couple years ago a friend from work got a DUI. He wasn't a regular drinker, but a group of us had got in the habit of dropping by the pool hall around the corner after work on Fridays and he joined in a few times. On the way home one night, he got pulled over, arrested, car impounded, driving classes, 6 months of parole meetings, court mandated AA Meetings, over $5,000 in fees & fines, court dates, a breathalyzer installed in car and a lot of time missed from work. He went from being a happy-go-lucky, on-top-of-the-world type to being somber, depressed and near-suicidal ever since.

One day at lunch our friend said something that struck a nerve with all of us. "Everybody knows that a 0.08% alcohol level is a DUI. Some people know a 0.05% is a DWI. But NOBODY knows how that actually relates to THEM. One of the first things to go when you're drinking is your sense of good judgment."

He was right on the money - do you KNOW your alcohol level after 1 drink? 2? 3? How can you KNOW without some kind of measurement?

After thinking about that statement, a few of us got together and chipped in a few bucks to buy a consumer version of a breath test machine. Each person got it for two weeks then passed it on to the next person. I now have a better understanding of the shame, embarrassment and regret our depressed friend has been experiencing (ditto for everybody else in our group.) We realized we had been SO lucky that we didn't go through the same thing or worse.

Again, like he said, "The first thing to is your sense of good judgment." All this took place years after I watched a girl die on the highway due to drunk driving. I saw her weaving as she was coming up from behind my car so I moved over a couple lanes to get out of her way. As she passed me, I looked over and saw her red cheeks and bleary, dull stare. I can still see her face. A few minutes later, she hit a steel & concrete guardrail on an overpass head on. Her car seemed to explode in a ball of metal, dirt & dust. It took a second for it to register that the thing I saw fly up (looked like it went as high as the streetlight) was her body. I watched her land in the left lane. That was about 10 years ago and I can still picture every second in my mind as if it happened 5 minutes ago.

I had nightmares about that for months, yet years later I would still have a few beers after work and drive home.

I BEG you… if you drink at all, get one of those breath test gizmos from your local drugstore and LEARN firsthand about your personal alcohol level. Take your pick- $50 voluntarily, or $5,000 in fines or prison or death. It sure woke me up.

With an overwhelming sense of shame for what I've done in the past,
--Rick

[VCrossfan]

...chicks painting their nails (one killed a mutual biker friend), guys shaving, people reading, texting they all are forms of distracted driving and are no doubt dangerous.

The worst one for me beside the drinking and driving goes out to the government, for giving the driving test in foreign languages when all of our signs are in English.


I haven't drank a drop of any alcohol since a small sip of Sake during a toast in Tokyo on a business trip in 96 and before that it was 4 to 5 years. No bad or terrible thing that made me stop (I was just a community drinker before), I just realized driving was way to important in my life than having a couple and getting pulled over and losing it all. One of the Best choices in life I ever made.


And on the DMV's they need to give the Driving test class room and road in English only, you don't pass you don't drive. That might help make English stay the #1 language in the USA.

[pbkid]

My buddy got a DWI recently, had 4 drinks in 3 hours. Based on what he experienced, many of us may be over the limit even when we think we are "fine". He was totally shocked he failed...this is a guy who would never knowingly break the law.


hmm... interesting you say that.. because... as many of you know, i have first hand experience with this.
basically what you explained here steve is exactly me. i never was a heavy drinker, and i never drove when i had any feeling of even tipsyness...
well, as many of you have heard, i went to a friend of mines wedding... had a few drinks spread over a few hours..lost track of how many i had. so i stopped drinking, waited until i felt sober, then waited another hour, then ate.... came up with a .1 BAC.
i was also shocked when i failed.... i definately thought that he was going to test me, and on my way home with a 'be safe'....instead, 8 months later, im about 8k down and have definately lost a feeling of self pride through this ordeal. its been a long trip, and i just recently (last friday) came off of supervised probation.

i immediately stopped drinking after my DUI for 4 months, it has severely affected my personal confidence, my friend base has become completely nothing, and my career is going to be changed significantly due to me going to school to be in law enforcement.
before my DUI i was expecting to probably move directly out of college into a federal level job. i now am waiting a minimum of 5 years before i can even APPLY, much less have a chance of getting a job.

drinking and driving is absolutely not worth the consequences.

and on a side note of those who do choose to drink heavily. it takes alcohol 12 hours after your last drink to clear from your system. many people who get DUI's get them in the morning.
i currently have a breathilizer in my car, and i can attest to the fact that if you drink heavily and try to drive within 12 hours, you absolutely WILL get a DUI if you are pulled over... keep that in the back of your mind...

[VX KAT]

Very moving and thanks to those courageous enough to share your stories. Dave & I "usually" "try" to pick one of us to be the designated driver when we go out to dinner. BUT, it's so easy to have a beer or two anyway. Always "thought" because I'm a "big" girl, I must be able to handle more, and certainly 1 or 2 beers can't possibly put ME over the DUI limit, right? Wrong! Actually, have no idea what my BA level would be after 1 or 2 beers, heck, don't even know what my state's limit is! Ignorance is no excuse.

This, and the seat belt thread, have been a very important reality check.

And Jack, I have to say again, I respect you on how maturely you handled your situation.

Life is good, very good. Let's all keep it that way! :thumbup:

[pbkid]

:thumbup:

[circmand]

The law isn't about impaired and there is no information available about what is impaired. If you are even feeling better after a drink the law states you are impaired. The law is based on a percentage without taking into account the actually quality of driving. Now I am not saying anyone drives better after drinking they do not. But to claim as the law does that everyone becomes a bad driver at .10% and then change it to .08% based on a political organization is pure politics. On the bright side few get pulled at .08% because they are still driving better then a lot of the idiots on the road. A claim could be made that a person who had been drinking a small amount but worried about a DUI may actuall pay more attention while driving so that their impaired driving is superior to idiots who are sober yet talking on the phone or otherwise oblivious to other cars onthe road. I have been unablew to find any research that demonstartes that .o8% causes all drivers abilities to degrade to unacceptable

[RickOKC]

Actually, have no idea what my BA level would be after 1 or 2 beers, heck, don't even know what my state's limit is! Ignorance is no excuse.

Think of it this way:

Every road has a speed limit and you know you can get a ticket if you exceed it. Think of all the miles you have driven since you got your license. Now imagine that you have never driven a car with a speedometer. You would never know for sure what 25, 50, 75 MPH "feels like." Would you pay $50 to get a speedometer?

A home breath tester is a pretty cheap mod.

[circmand]

Think of it this way:

Every road has a speed limit and you know you can get a ticket if you exceed it. Think of all the miles you have driven since you got your license. Now imagine that you have never driven a car with a speedometer. You would never know for sure what 25, 50, 75 MPH "feels like." Would you pay $50 to get a speedometer?

A home breath tester is a pretty cheap mod.

A BAC test shows your Blood achohol content at the time of testing. If you do it at a bar right after your last drink it will read one thing but your BAC will actually continue to rise until all alchohol has been absorbed into your system. You could test yourself think you are legal get pulled and end up with a DUI. That is my issue with no real info available on tests and such. The newer maker of the breathalyzer for use by the police will not even release the methodology used and therefore cannot be independently measured whether it is correct. It has actually led to DUIs being thrown out of court. Those of you who have taken the DUI classes can back me up. The classes are all about how bad drinking is and have nothing to do with actual what is too much or how to judge if you had too much.

Actual I am surprised it is even legal to charge someone with DUI. Because if a guy and girl go out have a few drinks and then have sex but the next morning the girl regrets her decision the law says because she was drinking she did not have the capacity to say yes. But the guy who was drinking apparently has the capacity to know she really didnt want to. But if yopu are at a bar drinking your ability to drive is impaired but the ability to make the decision whether to drive or not isnt impaired.

Funny thing is even cold stone sober I can never really tell what a women wants or means how am I supposed to know after drinking? That is the way of the DUI law, They pass a law but if you ask for specifics they tell you "if you do not know I am not going to tell you" I think women are writing these laws.

[ZubrAZ]

many americans think that marijuana must be legalized. supporters backing it by stating they feel more concentrated while being high, and more productive.

how do members of this forum look on driving while being impaired by illegal drugs, marijuana in particular?

[Riff Raff]

many americans think that marijuana must be legalized. supporters backing it by stating they feel more concentrated while being high, and more productive.

how do members of this forum look on driving while being impaired by illegal drugs, marijuana in particular?

LOL, that's a perfect question for the almighty L-Bud.:laughing:

[Ldub]

LOL, that's a perfect question for the almighty L-Bud.:laughing:

A-least ya finally got the almighty part right frank...:uhohgray:...:laughing:

You gotta be one of the slowest learners of all time...:yesgray:

[VX crazy]

And some people are impaired all on their own without medications......

[circmand]

many americans think that marijuana must be legalized. supporters backing it by stating they feel more concentrated while being high, and more productive.

how do members of this forum look on driving while being impaired by illegal drugs, marijuana in particular?

Since I know everyone values my opinion!!!! If you are impaired and driving reckless you should be pulled and fined, ticketed, o arrested accordingly. It does not matter if the substance is legal or illegal operating reckless should be punished. If illegal drugs you also get further punishment for the degree the drugs and amounts warrant. However to selectively punish one form of reckless over another because of the reason of reckless is not logical.

[ZubrAZ]

does it mean, if an impaired person driving carefully at a degree, where that person realizing he/she is not sober, however can still react to green/red lights, road signs, other moving objects, then it shouldnt be punishable?

[BigSwede]

Heh, I have a buddy who has declared, publicly, that he would rather ride with me driving drunk than most people driving sober. Not sure what that means... other than when both of us have had some drinks he perceives me as an excellent (or at least adequate) driver. ;)

Whatever, I just ordered a Breathalyzer so I can take some of the guesswork out of all this.

[RickOKC]

A BAC test shows your Blood achohol content at the time of testing. If you do it at a bar right after your last drink it will read one thing but your BAC will actually continue to rise until all alchohol has been absorbed into your system.
Good information! I would never have considered using it when I knew I "had" to drive. A better application would be to do it at home when there is no need to go anywhere. Try out a few different situations, time frames and alcohol consumption to get a good feel for BAC with no worries.

[pbkid]

you know... to be completely honest.... the whole idea of buying a meter, testing yourself and expecting to know what your BAC is gonna be sounds like a terrible idea...

i think of it the same way i do radar detectors.. people think that because they have them, they will never get a ticket... well, i, for one know that it isnt true. i was clocked by aircraft on a highway going FAR over the limit because i was overconfident with my radar detector.
so, i actually blame that ticket directly on my radar detector... because i had a false sense of safety and security because i got so used to not having to worry about tickets.

i think the same could happen with a BAC tester. you could test yourself a few times after having 2 beers and think.. ok i know that im only at .06 after 2 beers... but what you dont think of is how much water you had.. maybe the days you tested it you had drank half a gallon of water, but one day you only drink one glass and have 2 beers at the bar.... BOOM.. dui....

make sense??

[4X4 UFO]

I don't drink, or use drugs, but I think that the reasons for reckless driving are pretty irrelevant. If you're driving like an idiot, you should be pulled over, and ticketed. There are very few actual accidents. Wrecks are almost always caused by negligence in some form. As a driver, you should be aware of your abilities, the abilities of the vehicle that you are driving, and how those abilities are affected by the conditions present where you are driving, not to mention the state of repair of your vehicle. This takes some study, some practice, and mostly, paying attention to what you're doing. Unfortunately, in this country, you can get a driver's license by demonstrating little more skill than it takes to open the vehicle door. Some people can drive well after a drink or two, and as long as they are driving well, they should be left alone. Some people can't drive worth a damn sober, and they shouldn't be on the road at all. Speeding is probably ticketed more than anything, and it is less subject to the law enforcement officer's subjective judgement (not all law enforcement officers are of the caliber of the officers in our group). Speeding exacerbates the effects of an accident, but it doesn't CAUSE nearly as many accidents as inattentive driving. I'd much rather see people pulled over for doing anything other than DRIVING THE VEHICLE! Even an average driver is more dangerous at 10 mph under the posted limit talking on a phone, than he is at 10 mph over if he's doing nothing but driving. It's a complicated issue, but ticketing people for something that MAY impair them is less important then ticketing people for driving as though they ARE impaired, even if the impairment is just stupidity, or callous disregard for everyone sharing the road with them. Sorry about the long post, guys. I like to drive, and I'm really concerned about the ever increasing "moron per mile" ratio. I just don't know if there is a cure.......

[PK]

Sorry, but I really don't see the rocket science in this.

I drink, and I drive - but I never do both together.

Use the nominated driver method, or taxis, and it is very hard to make a mistake.

If my friends want me to drink to be sociable, I will have 1 or 2 light beers, but that is all. You will drown drinking light before you go over the limit.

And if your friends pressure you to drink more -







Then they are not your friends.

PK

[Ldub]

i was clocked by aircraft on a highway going FAR over the limit because i was overconfident with my radar detector.
so, i actually blame that ticket directly on my radar detector... because i had a false sense of safety and security because i got so used to not having to worry about tickets.



make sense??

Ummmmm...NO...:rolleyesg

Don't you bear 100% of the blame, for speeding in the first place?...:smilewink

[BigSwede]

i think the same could happen with a BAC tester. you could test yourself a few times after having 2 beers and think.. ok i know that im only at .06 after 2 beers... but what you dont think of is how much water you had.. maybe the days you tested it you had drank half a gallon of water, but one day you only drink one glass and have 2 beers at the bar.... BOOM.. dui....

make sense??
Sure, that could happen. But I don't see the harm in seeing what my BAC is when I feel "fine" to drive after some drinking. Maybe I am actually fine... but maybe I am not. I want to get a rough personal calibration, because right now I have no freeking idea.

[BigSwede]

Recently here in the Minneapolis area a new service has begun that will come and get you at the bar...two guys and a car, one of the guys will drive you home in your car with the other following to pick the driver up. I'm told it doesn't cost any more than a cab. Seems like a great idea to me, and your car is home with you the next morning...

[circmand]

Recently here in the Minneapolis area a new service has begun that will come and get you at the bar...two guys and a car, one of the guys will drive you home in your car with the other following to pick the driver up. I'm told it doesn't cost any more than a cab. Seems like a great idea to me, and your car is home with you the next morning...


It is not the expense that bothers me with a cab and I prefer to have someone else doing the driving so as not to get any additional DUIs It is leaving my very noticeable vehicle all night at a bar where a coworker or ewmployee or boss sees it or it ricks getting damaged by not so courtious drivers.

[Jolly Roger VX'er]

This is a very serious topic for me that is near & dear to my heart...as an ordinary "Joe" who values his few beers after a hard day's work ethic...I can't help but feel a bit persacuted as I'm 44 years of age and have been stopping for a few after work my whole life with no accidents or problems of any kind, even in bad weather.

I feel that it is the few who can't regulate their drinking that has ruined it for the rest of us.

I pull in and have a beer....than eat while consuming a beer...and most of the time that's it...sometimes....SOMETIMES...I'll have one more that I stretch out for an hour or more. And if I want to stay longer...I switch over to soda and eat something more. The bartenders @ the places I go often ridicule me as I give the cut-me-off signal (universal slashing of owns throat) after only 2 or 3 over a 2+ hour period & eating.

I've dodged countless deer running amok in my VX on the way home and knock on wood have yet to hit one. But, in the back of my mind...as happened to somebody I know...I might not be so lucky...hit one...call a tow truck...only for him to call the cops because he thinks you're over the limit.

In the mean time....I'll observe bikers pull in...drink 'til their three sheets to the wind...stumble out the door...rumble away on their bikes in a big pack...and never seem to ever get noticed by the law. Heck...a few times they WERE the law. Just one of the reasons I bought a bike!

There are no taxi's out where I reside or believe me...I'd be using them just so I could leave my VX @ home and have absolutely no worries about getting stopped. Also, it just doesn't seem right to try to find a designated driver just for happy hour on your way home after work.

I do feel that one can minimize your chances of getting stopped by following the behaviors on the list below:

1) Don't stay out late...(i.e after midnight)...especially until closing time...this is when the DUI checkpoints are in place and sometimes they are watching a bar from across the street.

2) Don't drink too much then drive on a holiday (St. Patricks Day, Labor Day, etc..) This should be when you line up a cab or designated driver!

3) Don't take the main roads home...if you live out in the country...use the back roads and go directly too #4.

4) Always do the speed limit....don't go faster as this draws attention...don't go slower as this REALLY draws attention...focus on doing the speed limit...cruise control can be your friend!

5) Always inspect your vehicular lighting before having any beer, and be on the look out for any burned out bulbs...This WILL get you pulled over even if you swerved to miss that poor bunny rabbit! I carry spare bulbs for sidemarker/license plate lights as these will ruin your day if noticed!


I'm not condoning drinking too much & killing of innocents....but I am standing up for the average American who just wants to unwind from a stress-filled day at the office....pay his morgage...pay his taxes...raise his family...and out to be a villainous outlaw of society.

I hope I haven't offended anyone here with my way of thinking as that was not my intent....but this is my viewpoint and I'm sticking too it!

Have a nice day!

[Jolly Roger VX'er]

Thanks to this thread...I am going to try and find one of those do-eet-ur-self breathalyzers! Didn't know their was such a thing!


edit of previous post: "NOT out to be a villainous outlaw of society."

[Ldub]

Thanks to this thread...I am going to try and find one of those do-eet-ur-self breathalyzers! Didn't know their was such a thing!


edit of previous post: "NOT out to be a villainous outlaw of society."

Oh NOW I get it...:smilewink

Excellent point...:yesgray:

It's always a few rotten million who ruin it for the rest of us...:laughing:

[pbkid]

Even an average driver is more dangerous at 10 mph under the posted limit talking on a phone, than he is at 10 mph over if he's doing nothing but driving.

and I'm really concerned about the ever increasing "moron per mile" ratio. I just don't know if there is a cure.......
yes, and yes! :thumbup:


It is leaving my very noticeable vehicle all night at a bar where a coworker or ewmployee or boss sees it or it ricks getting damaged by not so courtious drivers.
yes and yes again :thumbup:



There are no taxi's out where I reside or believe me...I'd be using them just so I could leave my VX @ home and have absolutely no worries about getting stopped.



i guess sometimes i forget that other people have the option of calling a cab.... out here where i live. the nearest cab is over an hour away. and they are usually busy...
i actually called one a few months ago because i decided to have a drink at the local bar... the cab didnt show up till almost 4 am and cost me around $75 to get home.

i guess thats another important factor to remind them city folks of eh jolly roger? that not all of us have the option of a cab... so yes, usually pick a sober friend is the best option.

[RickOKC]

you know... to be completely honest.... the whole idea of buying a meter, testing yourself and expecting to know what your BAC is gonna be sounds like a terrible idea...

i think of it the same way i do radar detectors.. people think that because they have them, they will never get a ticket... well, i, for one know that it isnt true. i was clocked by aircraft on a highway going FAR over the limit because i was overconfident with my radar detector.
so, i actually blame that ticket directly on my radar detector... because i had a false sense of safety and security because i got so used to not having to worry about tickets.

i think the same could happen with a BAC tester. you could test yourself a few times after having 2 beers and think.. ok i know that im only at .06 after 2 beers... but what you dont think of is how much water you had.. maybe the days you tested it you had drank half a gallon of water, but one day you only drink one glass and have 2 beers at the bar.... BOOM.. dui....

make sense??

That absolutely makes sense and I think I understand what you're saying. You brought up some excellent points, but I still believe it is actually a terrific idea as long as you go into it with the right perspective.

I think what you're saying is that if you test yourself with the goal of seeing how much you can drink for the sake of "gaming the system", then yes, it is a complete waste of time and 50 bucks and dangerous. (My apologies if I misinterpreted your statements.) Anyone with that mindset will probably just gamble anyway and say "Oh well, I 'probably' won't get caught" or justify their actions in some other manner and drive anyway. Nothing will change.

However, it was more like a profound awakening for 100% of the people in my little group.

For example, when it was my turn to use the tester, I came home and had a couple beers during a 1 hour period just like we used to do after work on Fridays. I waited 20 minutes (as directed) and did the test. I could have been arrested if I had been driving. The next night I did the same thing during a 90 minute period. Could have been arrested. A few days later, I repeated the test with 1 beer instead of two in an hour. Could have been arrested. Next night: 1 beer in 90 minutes - probably could have been arrested considering the police probably have a more accurate machine than one that cost only $50. With food, without food, not much difference. Arrested. Arrested. No matter what I did the results were about the same.

In OK, a DUI is .08% but a DWI is .05%. Both have nearly identical legal ramifications.

The end result is that it scared the crap out of every last one of us and, where we used to think we were "OK" it made us realize the only "safe" amount of alcohol is ZERO.

It didn't bolster our sense of security, it actually destroyed our existing false sense of security. Everyone who participated were all basically the same age and we had always been told that one drink per hour was ok. That general guide proved to be incredibly FALSE.

That's why I spoke earlier about my embarrassment, shame and regret.

[pbkid]

rick- yes, you understood my statement correctly.
and ya, its amazing to see how long it stays in your system eh?

thats why i say 12 hours after your LAST drink. i have a breathilizer in my car and as long as i follow the 12 hours rule.. i havent failed once.... just an FYI (and mine is extremely accurate, maybe more so than the police.... mine is calibrated monthly)

[RickOKC]

rick- yes, you understood my statement correctly.
and ya, its amazing to see how long it stays in your system eh?

Whew, I don't like interpreting things wrong and misquoting without checking first!

What was REALLY amazing for me was during Week 2, I kept drinking another beer, waiting 20 minutes and then re-testing. I felt like I was perfectly fine to drive all the way up to a .15% BAC! That's nearly twice the legal limit and changes things here from a DUI to a FELONY DUI. Judgment truly is the first thing to go.

Dang, I HATE being this serious, but this was such a revelation for me that I can't shut up (sorry, everybody.) PBKid, I'm so sorry to hear what you're going through - it breaks my heart. Your experience is nearly a word-for-word description of the same awful pain that my buddy has described.

For those who want to try a consumer grade tester and don't know where to find one, check this out (http://www.walgreens.com/store/catalog/Screening-Tests/Slim-Ultra-Digital-Breath-Alcohol-Tester/ID=prod3427025&navCount=0&navAction=push-product). It's similar to what we got. It comes with 3 mouth pieces so you can lend it to others without them getting a case of the "oogies." Share the gift of knowledge.

[pbkid]

well, all i can say for myself is that it was definately a lesson well learned...

now that you know what you feel like at different BAC levels... imagine getting pulled over at .1 and thinking that your perfectly fine... hence the lesson learned

[BigSwede]

I felt like I was perfectly fine to drive all the way up to a .15% BAC!
And that is exactly what I want to find out. Maybe I have been fooling myself (and lucky) all these years.

[circmand]

DUI does not mean drunk you may actually be fine to drive the nanny state decided .10% was too much awhile back the for political reasons changed it to .08% just so MADD would be happy and politicians could get their vote. As I stated I have never found any info that tests were done to determine when achohol actuall begins to affect driving in a measurable way. Also most states have a double whammy set up on DUI where they charge you with 2 things so they can plead you down to one thing. They get their money from you, your attorney gets his/her money from you and you think they did something for it and your insurance company gets more of your money. On the bright side the cop who pulled me was cool. At the hospital he let me go out and smoke while we waited for a blood test. He failed to show up at my arraignment so my costs were minimal and that Halloween as I was giving out candy at my folks house I found out he lived down the block from them and we chatted

[WormGod]

I have had MANY field sobriety tests in my life. Where I used to live was a bar-crawl district and cops had a tendency to profile people based on what they are driving and where they are. Sadly, I lived a block away from the main strip, so I was pulled over and tested a LOT. The good news is, since I lived so close, I could park at home and walk to the strip, heh.

I was given one test years ago however where I did have couple of drinks. The sobriety was not an issue and the breathalyzer was well within the state limit, but I was still ripped a new one since the cop was the in charge of the "anti-street racing and drinking/driving unit". He was a good old boy with a chip on his shoulder and no matter how respectful and well mannered I was with him, I was still the scum of the earth. I was written up for quite a few things, but not what he really hoped to write me up for.

In the end, no matter how much you have to drink, the officer still has the right to subjective opinion on whether you are suited to drive or not (so it is here anyways). They will not/ can not arrest you for the offense, can ask that you call someone to pick you up at the pull over location to drive you home.

[Stephen Biko]

A few days later, I repeated the test with 1 beer instead of two in an hour. Could have been arrested. Next night: 1 beer in 90 minutes - probably could have been arrested

Unless you are a tiny little woman under 90lbs that ought to be a wake up call that the law is wrong. You'll still lose in court if it comes down to it. But next time you hear a politician blabbering on about being tough on crime, you should ask yourself if he's really just pushing more bad laws for his own career.

[Marlin]

Last time we had a thread like this mommy and daddy had to step in as it got quite heated and I think the thread was closed.
Here is where I stand:
ZERO TOLERANCE

Makes me think of those anti-drug commercials from 10 or 15 yrs ago. Showed a ballerina, she said "I want to be a drug addict when I grow up". No one says that, and no one says "I am going to go out, get plastered, and kill a family tonight!"
Drinking and driving is just plain stupid, heaven forbid if my family was in an accident with someone that was intoxicated, I would end up in jail, the drunk driver would not(deceased folks don't go to jail around here)

My job (Navy) comes with a centuries old stereotype and culture that we try to fight everyday, the drunken sailor. Every year, on both coasts, some Navy guy kills someone and/or himself due to drinking and driving. There is no excuse, no matter how stressful your job is. Buy the 6 pack(or box of wine as I prefer) and take it home, it will save you a bundle of cash as well. Can't get a DUI in my house, might fall and hurt myself, but I have high quality medical care...:smack:

There shouldn't even be a discussion as to how to avoid getting a DUI, its simple, don't drink and then go drive. In Japan the limit is .02. We have a simulator here on base, like a fancy video game similar to what pilots use for training. First round you drive around before drinking. The second round it sends you through the same course, but figures in a delay associated with a .08ish intoxication. most folks make it through just fine, but when they ghost your first run over the second run, you can see how much of a difference it makes, delayed stopping, (they have someone run out in the street on the screen), lane drift is more, and so on. Then they send you through at .15, most do not make it through that without an accident. Maybe its all BS, but as noted earlier, the first thing to go is your judgment. If you feel fine at .15, maybe you have a drinking problem? I know right now I can drink a bottle of merlot and feel fine. If I do that when I get back from a 7 month deployment, I would be plastered. That is just tolerance, my physical impairment is no different. your body processed alcohol the same way no matter what, the rest is a psychological adjustment to the feelings induced by the alcohol, very scary indeed. Think of it like cocaine, 1 line gets you going, you are high, as you build up a tolerance, you need more, but regardless, you are still physically high off the same line, just not the same emotional/psychological feeling and thus you need more. (not saying anyone does coke, I just used it as an analogy)
Bottom line, no tolerance for drinking and driving.

[Scott Larson]

Wow, this thread has struck a derisive nerve! I remember a day when pulled over for "questionable driving", got you an escort or a ride home, yes, "HOME", Not jail!!! How times and standards have changed...sometimes for the better, sometimes...

[circmand]

Can't get a DUI in my house, might fall and hurt myself, but I have high quality medical care...:smack:

We have a simulator here on base, like a fancy video game similar to what pilots use for training. First round you drive around before drinking. The second round it sends you through the same course, but figures in a delay associated with a .08ish intoxication. most folks make it through just fine, but when they ghost your first run over the second run, you can see how much of a difference it makes, delayed stopping, .

To have the high quality medical and great expensive video games but most of us are tax payers trying to hold on to our jobs and pay the taxes that pay for all the medical care and million dollar video games. I do not begrudge the military people great health care as they do a tough job and do it well. But million dollar simulators for them to play in bars is not what I consider a good use of my tax dollars. After all you do not see lay offs in the military, the government or the highly Democrat teachers field.

[Marlin]

To have the high quality medical and great expensive video games but most of us are tax payers trying to hold on to our jobs and pay the taxes that pay for all the medical care and million dollar video games. I do not begrudge the military people great health care as they do a tough job and do it well. But million dollar simulators for them to play in bars is not what I consider a good use of my tax dollars. After all you do not see lay offs in the military, the government or the highly Democrat teachers field.

I was being sarcastic about the health care. My health care is horrible, motrin for everything.
As for no lay offs, find me another job that sends you away from your family for months at a time into harms way at a fraction of pay that your civilian counterpart gets paid. Find me a job that works you 18hours a day, 7 days a week for months at a time, no OSHA, no union to get you a 20 min break every hour, or to make sure you have a comfortable chair.
Murder rarely ever makes the news, neither do DUIs, unless they involve a military member, then its everywhere. Its kind of like being a Sports star, but without the paycheck or glamor.
We spend almost 500K training these kids to become nuclear operators, 3.5 yrs of college in less than 16 months. There isn't a civilian school in the world that can top that, so if putting them through a simulator can save lives, or at a minimum protect innocents from a drunken sailor, then go right ahead. Money well spent. Think of it as preventative maintenance for a million dollar tool. That is what a fully qualified Nuke operator is worth.

[Stephen Biko]

Here is where I stand:
ZERO TOLERANCE


Zero Tolerance is probably the worst concept ever to makes it way into politics (3 strikes being the second worst). That sort of thinking is what got a girl stripped searched in high school because another girl accused her of having a motrin and a 7 year-old suspended from school for drawing a stick-figure shooting a water-pistol. There's also the issue of alcohol in common food - for example 7-Up is 1 or 2 proof as are most other citrus sodas.


Drinking and driving is just plain stupid, heaven forbid if my family was in an accident with someone that was intoxicated, I would end up in jail, the drunk driver would not(deceased folks don't go to jail around here)

But all the other ways people get into accidents are not worth murdering for? Talking on a cellphone. Fiddling with the radio. Spilling a drink in their lap. Looking at a billboard. Yelling at the kids in the backseat. Eating a sloppy hamburger. Not getting enough sleep. Tailgaiting. Etc, etc. All of them cases of bad judgment. All of them just as preventable as getting intoxicated.


In Japan the limit is .02.

There's an old saying about jumping off bridges. A limit of 0.02 is particularly bad policy because it invites all kinds of false positives. Anyone experiencing ketosis from low-carb dieting or being diabetic can blow 0.02 without much trouble.