Possible source of new CV shafts...

[Triathlete]

Thanks to Allen (BigMeatVX) who threw me this bit of info for my probing of new CV shafts. EMPI (http://www.empius.com/2010_driveaxles/driveaxles_pg36.html) has a new line of CV's that include Isuzu applications. They do not have a VX specific app but with our sharing of other Zu parts this should not be a problem. I am going to check on price/availability of these.
Now with that said what do we know for a fact is interchangable? I know there are Trooper and Rodeo's but exactly what years? I have heard 95+ Troops and 98-01 Rodeo's...does that sound right?

[RamAirZ]

I know BigSwede says he is positive the 95+ Troopers will swap out but you'd probably need the inner "stub" axle part where the inner ball assembly is snapped into to be sure. I wonder if EMPI's will be any stronger than the other aftermarket CV's out there. I talked to a guy awhile back (will need to find his info) that owns a company that builds custom shafts for offroad/high HP applications and he said he could do some for my old Rodeo when I had it, just need to send him the axle but he couldn't guarantee it being bulletproof or anything because of the CV angles and what not on different vehicles but they are "supposed" to be stronger than stock. Not sure how legit it was/is though

[phines]

I replaced mine a few years ago and they are off of a junked Passport (98 or 99) that had less than 40k miles on it.

They were perfectly, but I just found out last week that the 'premium' Warn hubs do not fit on these. The cheaper Superwinch hubs fit just fine, but the end of the axle (the notched section) is not long enough. I don't have my original axles, so I don't know if there was a difference or not... could just be that the Warn hubs were the wrong part number.
________
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[RamAirZ]

Good to know, did you replace the whole shaft including the "stub" portion or just undid the ball/cage portion from the Rodeo and put it in your VX cup?

[tom4bren]

I've got a set from the boneyard. They are not complete (missing pieces that the axle shop 'borrowed' to rebuild my CVs). They should be useful for a shop to determine interchangeability tho. If needed, lemme know.

[Triathlete]

EMPI has been a manufacturer of performance vdub parts for many years...baja bugs, vw drag cars, sand rails. They make quality stuff. From their description they sound well built. If the prices are fair and I can find them I'll be the guinea pig!:bwgy:

[BigMeatVX]

Billy look at the 98-04 Toy LC/lexas LX470 CVs...those are the ones Im upgrading to....WAY bigger and stronger....

[BigMeatVX]

I know BigSwede says he is positive the 95+ Troopers will swap out but you'd probably need the inner "stub" axle part where the inner ball assembly is snapped into to be sure. I wonder if EMPI's will be any stronger than the other aftermarket CV's out there. I talked to a guy awhile back (will need to find his info) that owns a company that builds custom shafts for offroad/high HP applications and he said he could do some for my old Rodeo when I had it, just need to send him the axle but he couldn't guarantee it being bulletproof or anything because of the CV angles and what not on different vehicles but they are "supposed" to be stronger than stock. Not sure how legit it was/is though

Sure the'll work, but be aware there ARE small differnces....ones that are not noticable untill you try and use a VX axle and Balls in a Rodeo/Trooper outer....wont fit....


Have a good look at the empi catalog...they list demensions of EACH part....you can see the differences yourselves...

There are alot (guys with machine shops) of ways to upgrade the axles and CVs on the Isuzus, but they are all costly

[Marlin]

Sure the'll work, but be aware there ARE small differnces....ones that are not noticable untill you try and use a VX axle and Balls in a Rodeo/Trooper outer....wont fit....




The ball problem is 100% correct. As I have posted before, the Zus have several CVs, beyond the short medium and long. There is also 2 "cup" sizes as well as the random tri-ball style. I managed to frankenstein a set out of a bag of CVs. I took the cups off of the shafts off of a shorter CV and found a long one with the same spline count to fit. No problems. Just a PITA in the dark, rain, and in a campground. It is possible though. I still wheel it, and that is with a locker. It fit perfect.

[RamAirZ]

Isuzu has a multitude of different CV combos lol, why couldn't they just keep everything the same? But still, yes it's more work, but knowing you can drop your axle and install new CV's should be a "blessing" to some. And if you install a Rodeo "cup" it'd make finding junkyard cv's that much easier.

[BigMeatVX]

Yep....I did the same thing...used a bunch of differnt ones and made it work....and ran em for a long time untill I snapped an outer cage while PURPOSELY lead-footin it on the last day at Moab...

After that"".I snagged both CVs out of my low mile parts VX and am now running the OEM correct-fit ones....

The outer CV that I busted was off a Trooper or Rodeo and Had smaller balls,star and cage...Than the OEM VX ones

The problem I had yrs before, was that the cup on the VX inner driver side shaft is BIGGER than the rest of the Isuzus at my local wrecking yards...and the ones that were right had a axle dis-connect built in...so the shaft was way short/wrong....

[BigSwede]

Hey, I said the 95+ Trooper CVs were the same length as a VX...no guarantees about anything else. :winkgray:

[Triathlete]

Billy look at the 98-04 Toy LC/lexas LX470 CVs...those are the ones Im upgrading to....WAY bigger and stronger....

Are these a "direct" replacement or will modifications be needed? I am looking for something that will drop right in. Also will it be compatible with the Asin hubs?

[RamAirZ]

He's talking about upgrading to the LC spindles and custom spindles in another thread, so no, I don't think they would be a direct swap lol.

[Triathlete]

After further digging here is some info I found...
From a web search I found that the Cardone brand CV axle part # for the VX is 60-1310. On the EMPI site I cross referenced that part# to their part# and came up with 80-1039 (complete axle including inner joint-long side). The same axle without the inner joint (**use old inner on long side or for short side) the part# is 80-3619. These part# reference to the 96-02 Troopers. **Accordind to the EMPI site the long and short side axles are the same length with the long side adding the inner joint. I checked and the EMPI shafts are available through BAP auto parts...1039 is $95 and the 3619 is $90.

Allen, since you have been doing a lot of delving into the CV delemma...do these part numbers sound right to you? I may be ordering a set this week if so.

[Triathlete]

Another question!
If I were to use these Trooper shafts it has been said the balls are smaller. So does this mean I need to replace the entire long shaft, including the inner joint or will I be able to get buy with just the shorter shaft and using the old inner joint? I guess what I need to know is does that green cup need to be replaced?
If so, how much extra work is required to change that?

[uncle_asa]

I checked and the EMPI shafts are available through BAP auto parts...1039 is $95 and the 3619 is $90.
Just if you want to save little bit, Billy: they both are currently listed at Amazon for $59.95 :winkgray:
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=EMPI+80-1039&x=0&y=0
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=EMPI+80-3619&x=0&y=0&ih=1_0_0_0_0_0_0_0_0_0.1531_1&fsc=-1

[Triathlete]

Thanks Alexander:thumbup:

[Marlin]

Another question!
If I were to use these Trooper shafts it has been said the balls are smaller. So does this mean I need to replace the entire long shaft, including the inner joint or will I be able to get buy with just the shorter shaft and using the old inner joint? I guess what I need to know is does that green cup need to be replaced?
If so, how much extra work is required to change that?

You would only need to replace the cup, which is not a whole lot more work, but I would definitely have a new axle shaft seal available, mine fell apart when I had mine out. The cup is just held onto the axles shaft by some clips and whatnot. No crazy stuff.

[Triathlete]

Thats what I needed to know and wanted to hear...thanks Marlin. Looks like I will be ordering these this weekend or early next week. I will give that Amazon link a shot. The seals should be available locally...I'll check Checkers down the road to make sure they have them. Someone suggested replacing them anyways since they are only like $12 or so.

[RabidPony]

Keep us posted on the fitment and ease of conversion/install. My pass front is starting to make noises so the time is nearing and it would be nice to know there's a reliable supplier out there with a quality product that fits.

[Triathlete]

Ordered the EMPI shafts today. $148 for both shipped through Amazon.com (thanks Alexander). Should be here end of next week and my Asin hubs are on the way as well!
Will snap some comparison pics when they get here and I rip the OEM ones out.

[VXorado]

Ordered the EMPI shafts today. $148 for both shipped through Amazon.com (thanks Alexander). Should be here end of next week and my Asin hubs are on the way as well!
Will snap some comparison pics when they get here and I rip the OEM ones out.


Thanks for being the guinea pig Billy, my cvs have been "clicky" since moab and need to be replaced

[RamAirZ]

awesome! Can't wait to see if these work out good!

[Triathlete]

Trust me, they will get tested!:bwgy:

[Triathlete]

Asin hubs came yesterday and the UPS man dropped this off at the door today...
http://i370.photobucket.com/albums/oo150/Triathlete/shafts/IMG_0531.jpg

[RamAirZ]

awesome! Did you get the full versions with the inner axle assembly with the cup or just up to the cage/ball

[Triathlete]

1each.

[RamAirZ]

Ah gotcha. Can't wait to see if these work out!

[rowhard]

Trust me, they will get tested!:bwgy:

No doubt in my ex-military mind after watching you last year at Moab. Sure hope they work out for you and US!

[Triathlete]

Ah gotcha. Can't wait to see if these work out!

Me too. They look really good...for the price if they hold up this will be a great deal...my fingers are crossed (mainly since I don't want to have to tear it all apart again for a while:bwgy:).

[Triathlete]

Okay...update!
Unless you plan on doing a ton of extra work to remove the inner cups order two #80-3619. Looking through the manual there are two lock ring clips that hold those cups in...not accessable easily. I tore both sides down and put the 3619 on the drivers side. Everything fit great. Balls and cages look the same as the factory shafts. Figured I would just pull the cup off the other shaft and install it as I did the other one. Unfortuneately I found out the hard way that the one with the inner joint was one of the y joint types....and since I tore it appart I can't return it...so the VX sits in the garage 1/2 torn apart waiting for the other shaft that I just ordered:mad: Hopefully it will be here by mid week.

Here is a comparison pic of the OEM and EMPI shafts...
http://i370.photobucket.com/albums/oo150/Triathlete/shafts/IMG_0537.jpg
http://i370.photobucket.com/albums/oo150/Triathlete/shafts/IMG_0538.jpg

[Ldub]

Okay, I'm not quite clear on what you're saying Billy....:_thinking

Are you saying our CV shafts are the same length, & we should order two of the same part #?

[RamAirZ]

Yes. and the part# we should order is for the CV without the inner cup. And it's hard to see the comparison when one is covered in grease and the other is in a plastic bag lol. Awesome that it works though!

[Marlin]

FOr what its worth, we sat around the campgroud trying to get the CVs to come apart. Jerry said that there is a tension ring inside the inner-inner joint that if you hit the outer wring with a hammer while pulling it apart, sometimes you can get them out.

For those that are replacing CVs, I think its a much better idea to replace the whole thing. It may cost you an extra 20 bucks each, but the time you will save in labor makes it well worth it.

[RamAirZ]

what do you mean the whole thing Marlin? Inner cup and all? That's alot more labor and how would you get the inner ring to clip back in?

[Marlin]

what do you mean the whole thing Marlin? Inner cup and all? That's alot more labor and how would you get the inner ring to clip back in?

No, I was talking about breaking the CV into its two parts, which is what it sounds like billy did. The CV allows flexing at two points, the cup, and a close to the middle. You can then break the CV into its outer and inner portions via the middle flexible joint.


http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMGP1477.JPG

BOOOOOOO!!!!!! I just noticed while looking at mine that one of my mecatech boots ripped. Grrrrrr, those things are expensive. Won't be buying those again. Looks like a have another project next week, or perhaps I will go the big swede route and just pump grease in there every once in awhile. I think he has been doing that a very long time with no problems. Mine tore at the small diameter portion, so at least the grease will still be in the joint. Gonna try and zip tie around the remaining part and see how that goes:)

[BigSwede]

The outer joints are not designed to be taken apart...which is probably why "strategic hammering" is necessary. I doubt that is what Billy is doing.

When I break a CV I just replace it from the cup outward with a junkyard CV for $40 or less...I get new boots as part of the deal too.

I know, I know, VX CVs are "special". :rolleyesg

[Ldub]

I know, I know, VX CVs are "special". :rolleyesg

Well yah...:rolleyesg

They have less headroom.

[Triathlete]

The outer joints are not designed to be taken apart...which is probably why "strategic hammering" is necessary. I doubt that is what Billy is doing.

When I break a CV I just replace it from the cup outward with a junkyard CV for $40 or less...I get new boots as part of the deal too.

I know, I know, VX CVs are "special". :rolleyesg

Nope, was trying to remove the inner joint from the cup...but, it was a totally differant type joint (y type). So I ordered another without the inner joint (part# 80-3619)which will work fine using the factory inner joint/cup.

[Marlin]

Well yah...:rolleyesg

They have less headroom.

:), and they can drive on water, I got asked if it was amphibious today...

[Marlin]

Nope, was trying to remove the inner joint from the cup...but, it was a totally differant type joint (y type). So I ordered another without the inner joint (part# 80-3619)which will work fine using the factory inner joint/cup.

If you are using the factory inner joint and balls, what part of your CV went bad?

[Triathlete]

oops...the cup/inner shaft. The passenger slde was binding in 4hi & lo...drivers side was clicking in 4lo.

[BigMeatVX]

This "y" type CV is a Tripod style, right...used mostly in Part Time 4x4 rigs....AWD usually getts the plunging CV with balls,race, and star...

Still, I have used other junkyard CVs, as well and most have smaller balls....no pun intended:happyface

Billy, thanks for jumpin in and being the tester on these...any pics of the tripod joint???

[Triathlete]

No pics of the tripod. I sort of put it back together. Since I can't return it, I will pull it apart and get some when I get dirty again putting the new one in. I figure I will hold onto it since all the other parts are the same (shaft, boots and the other joint) for spare parts. The boot are really nice thick silicone type.
By the way, ordering these through Amazon has been great. My original order was placed on a Sunday and with regular shipping I recieved them on Wensday. Ordered the other new one on this past Sunday and UPS just dropped it at my door!:yesy:

[RamAirZ]

Sweet deal, I'm waiting to order mine until you test them out a bit lol.