Front Diff drop help for 8" lift

[superstang460]

I need some help with lowering my front diff. How much is the max drop before front drive shaft stress is too much?...3" maybe?

I have custom upper/lower control arms with 5" of lift in them at "stock" ride height and no torsion bar cranking. Also have a 3" body lift, 919 springs(3" lift) with 2" spacers on top and bottom, custom length rear trailing arms and top link.

I am clearing 40x16-R16 super swamper LTB's on my firefox VX but my poor stock gears wont turn em too well, and as you can imagine, with the torsion bars cranked I get almost 8" suspension lift so my CV shafts wont even come close to reaching.

My front is currently torn apart and my VX is my winter vehicle, so time is of the essence. Looking to drop the diff as much as possible, change gear ratios, and maybe install BigMeat's super flexy IFS kit.

Please let me know if you have diff drop brackets, ring and pinion sets, or a super flexy IFS kit just sitting around, so I can get my rig back together within the next week or two.

Any and all helpful knowledge about the diff drop from experience is greatly appreciated

[superstang460]

P.S. I know you are all probably wanting to see pics of my VX with 40's and also the control arms....
Not to sound completely computer illiterate, but how in the heck do you upload pics on here that are saved to my computer???

[VX KAT]

P.S. I know you are all probably wanting to see pics of my VX with 40's and also the control arms....
Not to sound completely computer illiterate, but how in the heck do you upload pics on here that are saved to my computer???

Click on "Gallery" in the blue header above

Then click "Gallery Links" from the same blue header

In that drop down box you should see, second from the bottom..."Upload photos" - Click that.

Then it will let you select 5 pics (one at a time) from your computer. Click on "Choose File" and find the pic you want. If they're really big megapixels, I've found it bombs out if I do more than 2 at a time. So I'd hit "Upload/submit" after those 2, then just do a few at a time.

If they're smaller files, you can do all 5 at once.

Sometimes, after it's done uploading your pics, it will show another screen where you have to click at the bottom of screen..."Process".

[superstang460]

Here's the modified lower control arm with 5" of lift next to the stock control armhttp://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/1126001439.jpg

[superstang460]

Here's the modified upper installed with the lift built in
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/1126001451.jpg

[superstang460]

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/76364_499930056205_500671205_7661148_7298454_n.jpg

Firefox on 40's

[superstang460]

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/76364_499930076205_500671205_7661151_5053598_n.jpg

[Lizardmen3477]

May I Say Holy Sh*T Thats some Big Tires.

[superstang460]

Still not sure I'm doing the pics thing correctly, but at least now you can see what I'm dealin with. Any help with advice or having parts available for my reassembly would be awesome. Thanks in advance for the help, and thank you, VX Kat, for gettin me on the right track with uploading pics

[Mile High VX]

Man, that's awesome!

[VX KAT]

Still not sure I'm doing the pics thing correctly, but at least now you can see what I'm dealin with. Any help with advice or having parts available for my reassembly would be awesome. Thanks in advance for the help, and thank you, VX Kat, for gettin me on the right track with uploading pics
:thumbup: No prob!

Guess I coulda mentioned how to attach them in a post....:rollo:

Start a post

On right side -> it says "My Pics"...click Open

A new window opens with your pics. At the top of the window there's a a blue header with a drop down box for selecting what size/type attachment...select "Original Image"...it will make the full size pic appear in post.

You can put up to 20 pics in a single post.

Separate each pic by a RETURN/ENTER or sometimes they'll end up just displaying left to right, instead of scrolling down....drives some of our members crazy to scroll sideways..:p

You can go back to your post and delete your current attached pics....
and edit it to attach the full size pics:
hit EDIT
then "Go advanced"
then "My Pics"
Make sure it's "original Image"
select your pics by clicking on them.

[superstang460]

I think I got it. Thanks again. Now you're all in big trouble!!! haha for a year now I could not figure out how to post pics, lol.

[Ldub]

Nice welds...http://www.tacomaterritory.com/forum/image.php?u=278&dateline=1102295776

These here things from the main menu will help answer many of your other questions...http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u55/BJ_BOBBI_JO9/Work%20job%20computer%20TV%20and%20phone%20related/th_hillbilly.gif...:yesgray:

http://www.vehicross.info/modules.php?name=FAQ

http://www.vehicross.info/modules.php?name=FAQ&op=viewcategory&cid=7

[Marlin]

Wow, that is all I am starting with...wow.
Ok, for the technical stuff.
-What brake lines did you switch to? No way factory length will hold up to that much lift and be able to flex, especially with the IFS kit. I did + 2" on my brake lines...I would guess you need +4" or more.
-Did you put any kind of gussets in the extensions for the upper control arm drops? Thats a very tight angle to have no extra weight bearing supports.
-Did you get some super extended length shocks? Otherwise the first time it brings a tire off the ground, you may here some sickening pop as all the oil/gas comes out of your shock:)
-Be careful dropping your diff 3", that bracket is gonna have to be heavy duty. If you can fab that up, you can fab up the brackets. You just just cut out a rectangle, and weld in a new plate that moves the holes down the desired length:


http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMGP1698.JPG

I have to admit, it looks pretty sweet, not my cup of tea, but still pretty bad ***. As for finding these parts lying around, diff drops you will have to make yourself, as well as a new crossmember. IFS kit has to be ordered from BigmeatVX. Gears...Matt at Independent4x.

[VXorado]

Nice work superstang, I bet your CVs hate you :p

I've heard 3" diff drop max before the driveshaft angle is too much.

Good luck

[superstang460]

-What brake lines did you switch to? No way factory length will hold up to that much lift and be able to flex, especially with the IFS kit.

I ended up using some universal steel braded lines that I got at SUMMIT for a different project. They are a lot longer. I also had to disconnect the E-brake brackets to get enough slack

-Did you put any kind of gussets in the extensions for the upper control arm drops? Thats a very tight angle to have no extra weight bearing supports.

There is a cylindrical steel tube welded to the underside of the upper that has 2 gussets running inward and I also have it welded to the ball joint spacer. It is pretty solid

-Did you get some super extended length shocks? Otherwise the first time it brings a tire off the ground, you may here some sickening pop as all the oil/gas comes out of your shock:)

I actually used the Rancho RS5000 shocks that were for my F250 with a 6 inch lift. Just pressed in a larger 5/8" lower bushing so it bolted right on the VX-

Be careful dropping your diff 3", that bracket is gonna have to be heavy duty. If you can fab that up, you can fab up the brackets. You just just cut out a rectangle, and weld in a new plate that moves the holes down the desired length:

I was thinking of a way to drop the whole frnt cradle down 5" like they do on IFS chevy lift kits or with H2's, but this is my winter vehicle, we have 3" of snow, and I'm still driving a 5" lowered Ford lightning...I gotta hurry haha
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/IMGP1698.JPG


Gears...Matt at Independent4x.

I go broke everytime I log on Independent4x.com haha They just have all those litte odds and ends I always need.

[Triathlete]

For a worry free front drive shaft to match up to your diff drop you might give the guys at High Angle Driveline (http://www.highangledriveline.com/)a call.:yesy:

[RamAirZ]

I've got a solution for your diff drop woes:

http://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/RamAirZ/22Small.jpg

http://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/RamAirZ/23Small.jpg

http://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss272/RamAirZ/026.jpg


This is designed around a 7" lift. It's a thailand lift kit, my buddy just installed it on his 98' Rodeo over here, between it, his lift coils, and body lift, he's at 13" of lift, it's on 33's in the pic, right after install. That style of adapter could be easily modified for any amount of lift. There kits should work with our VX's but expensive. Oh and awesome work on your VX, that's some good fab work!! This Thai lift kit uses a spindle adapter that bolts to the factory spindle and keeps steering etc all at factory height/specs, really neat stuff

[vt_maverick]

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/76364_499930056205_500671205_7661148_7298454_n.jpg

Firefox on 40's

F*** me! :eek: Have you applied for BigFoot status yet? Or maybe follow in the footsteps of another beloved member:

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/501/medium/9air.gif

[superstang460]

Wow RamAirZ! That is awesome info on that lift!! I need more info tho. How do I contact them?

[Mile High VX]

http://www.4x4.in.th/mr/

http://www.weekendhobby.com/ad/sun.htm

Outer Limits forum discussion:

http://www.outerlimits4x4.com/viewtopic.php?t=14500

Discussion says it's about $2K plus shipping and 4 weeks to build before shipment.

[RamAirZ]

Not the same company MileHigh. His took about a week-2 weeks and 5 days to get to Mississippi. They have some kits ready to go but his was a new design, they had to modify some stuff. Here is the website:

http://btv4x4.com/

They are working on a Trooper lift right now that should bolt right onto the VX

[superstang460]

I sent them an email, but this damn language barrier may mess things up haha. I like that bolt in diff drop bracket design

[Ascinder]

All I can say is: Looks great, but how are you planning on dealing with the giant SNAP! Up front?:right:

[Ldub]

I sent them an email, but this damn language barrier may mess things up haha. I like that bolt in diff drop bracket design

Print it & bring it down to your friendly local Thai restaurant...:smilewink

[JoFotoz]

I'd love to see a side view...

Its a tad top heavy/high center of gravity for my taste..
....but certainly eye catching :thumbup:

I cant help wonder ...

A) How much cladding/metal you have cut out of arches..
..especially rear of front & front of rear ?

or

B) How much is going to rip off when those meats compress up into arches..:eek:

jo

[Marlin]

I'd love to see a side view...

Its a tad top heavy/high center of gravity for my taste..
....but certainly eye catching :thumbup:

I cant help wonder ...

A) How much cladding/metal you have cut out of arches..
..especially rear of front & front of rear ?

or

B) How much is going to rip off when those meats compress up into arches..:eek:

jo

In my preps for the superflexy, I removed what was in those arches, nothing but plastic, the rest is hollow. I imagine he had some major cutting at the front part of the body seam though, and cut the lip off of the cladding, there is nothing under there either, just the tabs that the splash guards mount to. The rear on the other hand...I hope he doesn't have any plans of maintaining the two feet of wheel travel, I already rub, and his tires are 6" bigger than mine!!!

[pbkid]

im sorry, but i have to chime in with a little voice of reason...

1. the VX has issues with 35's on a 4 inch lift, i completely agree with beau (ascinder), that your going to hear a huge POP the first time you try to roll.... or your going to make it half way down the block and run outta gas from flooring it to get your VX moving.

2. our transmission, t-case, and axles are not NEAR strong enough to handle that much weight in tires, its gonna cost you a LOT just to get it to roll...

3. and last, i have to say that it is extremely unsafe to drive a vehicle with that big of tires on it unless its a diesel pickup. (the VX braking just isnt going to stop that thing). and im actually a fan of bigger tires, but thats just rediculous.

i guess i say, to each their own...... but DAMN im glad it isnt my bank account or neighborhood. because i would be afraid to be rear ended by you.

[JoFotoz]

Hi Marlin.

I think you'll find that there is metal, and certainly at the lower rear of the front arches...
I removed a section of the "Mud" insert and had to trim back about 1 1/2 inches of metal...not structural, just bracing between outer skin and body.



In my preps for the superflexy, I removed what was in those arches, nothing but plastic, the rest is hollow.


Having changed to 35's some 5 months ago...I am still cutting metal and plastic everytime I go off road and flex/compress more than last time.

(I believe Dub found the same when he went to 35's..)

Not so much at back arches...but certainly front arches, front and rear.

As for clearance at lower front of rear arches...
As long as the rear wheel clears the front "at rest"..should be OK (ish!) when flexed as the whole deal swings back as it compresses.

IMO, back of rear arches and inside top & lip of all arches is gonna get interesting with those 40's..:smack:


FWIW..I envisage some serious cut and hack on the ORW at Moab next time..
... when I push it to the max.

:_steering

jo

[tom4bren]

I need some help with lowering my front diff. How much is the max drop before front drive shaft stress is too much?...3" maybe?

The diff drop kit that Welder Guy makes for us is a 2" drop. The one that Darlington OffRoad sells is 1.5"

But ...

I've been toying with the idea of spacers to go between the differential brackets and the frame. If you were to do the modified brackets and the spacers, that would get you 4" of drop. That may still not be enough for you but it's a start.

The other alternative is RCV. We've been working with them to build us a set of bulletproof half shafts. They're still working on it & they may be able to custom make you a set of extended shafts. It'll be pricey though. Search on "last cv you'll ever need" to find that thread.

[RamAirZ]

I don't think you could get 2" on the spacers on the frame, the diff bracket would contact your steering components

[CoastieCosta567]

Holy CRAP bro, Thats sick, i give you props, man looks like the VX Community has entered a new Mod era. From a 5 speed tranny, to a Monster truck, I like it.

[crotchrocket]

WOW! Thats a lift lol!! Congratulations on the work!!!! Have you changed the diff ratio's to account for the MASSIVE tyres?? :D

Looks awsome!

[superstang460]

I'd love to see a side view...
A) How much cladding/metal you have cut out of arches..
..especially rear of front & front of rear ?

or

B) How much is going to rip off when those meats compress up into arches..:eek:

jo

I have all the plastic and even the pinch weld and lower fender mount removed. Just turning stop to stop they hit....may have to go down to a 38" swamper :(

[superstang460]

WOW! Thats a lift lol!! Congratulations on the work!!!! Have you changed the diff ratio's to account for the MASSIVE tyres?? :D

Looks awsome!

Thanks Bud!! I have not changed gears yet...Still waiting to get the final ride height and tire combo. Since this is my winter ride, I was thinking of sticking to my 35's til springtime

[superstang460]

I'd love to see a side view...

Its a tad top heavy/high center of gravity for my taste..
....but certainly eye catching :thumbup:


http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/76364_499930071205_500671205_7661150_5953674_n.jpg
here's the side view for now. Stuff is just bolted on at this point. I am not driving it like this. Still needs brake lines bled and my shock adapters from Independent4x installed

[Marlin]

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/515/76364_499930071205_500671205_7661150_5953674_n.jpg
here's the side view for now. Stuff is just bolted on at this point. I am not driving it like this. Still needs brake lines bled and my shock adapters from Independent4x installed

Based on that photo, I assume you aren't going offroad in it. There is no way those tires can fit in the wheel wells,and we have like two feet of total wheel travel in the rear. No where for that tire to go.

Jo-I was referring to the tops of the arches, I too have removed all that bracketing and plastic in the rear of the front arches. I still rub sometimes on the trails, but not enough to matter, just rubber on metal:)

[Bob Barker]

W

O

W

[JoFotoz]

Thanks for the Side View Stang....

A picture is indeed worth a thousand words!


:thumbdn::smack::thumbdn::smack::thumbdn::smack:
.
......:whiteflag:

Jo

[crotchrocket]

Nah, it will be alright! just get a big saw! :D

OH, i've seen some hydrolic steering assists for Land Rovers for big lifts and tyres, you might need to look into something as you might find the steering box gives up with all the extra weight. Even a steering damper would help

[Solitude]

I think steel braces would work better then shocks.. let the tires absorb the vibrations like a hard-tail chopper

[BigSwede]

I don't think you could get 2" on the spacers on the frame, the diff bracket would contact your steering components
Yep, you'll get at most a half inch before hitting the steering.

[RamAirZ]

Ya I looked into that a LONG time ago on the Rodeo

[superstang460]

The VX is back together and rides better than it did with just the torsion bars cranked up 3" for my lift. I'm clearing 38x12.50 swampers on 8" rims and can turn stop to stop with no rubbing at all even close.
Installed cross drilled and slotted rotors and new pads all the way around and it stops on a dime with the 38's. She's a little slow from a stand still start, but gets up to speed pretty much like normal. Its weird driving this thing and clearly seeing the roofs of minivans haha.

Final setup.... FRONT
Upper and lower front control arms with 5" of lift built in

Indexed the torsion bars for about 2" beyond that for 7" total up front

STEERING
Sway bar extensions made
Rod end steering links made and flipped on top to decrease angle
4" diff drop with 5 degree rotation for perfect driveshaft angle
REAR
919 springs
2" poly spacer
2" drop of upper spring seat for 7" total out back
1.25" length added to upper and lower 3-link arms to center rear wheel
3" panhard bar drop

3" body lift on top of that, for a total of 10" over stock.

[Marlin]

Video and pics please...

[ibmx2]

Video and pics please...
X2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Ldub]

I'd like more details of the body lift...:naughty:

BTW...nice work...:thumbup:

[Bob Barker]

Yeah, what do people use to get a body lift? On other vehicle's it's pretty simple, I'm sure ours are over the top difficult!

[tom4bren]

You could contact Independent4X in Richmond (Ashland), VA. They are the ones that adapted a 3" body lift kit for Nerve_Gas. http://www.vehicross.info/forums/member.php?u=1735

Here is their website. https://www.independent4x.com/merchantmanager/index.php

I sent them a message asking if they could look up what kit was used and what modifications were required. I'll let you know if/when they respond.

He also had a 4" suspension lift that toasted his CVs which were never replaced. It's a shame his VX was wrecked since we could help him out with a diff drop now.

[tom4bren]

The VX is back together and rides better than it did with just the torsion bars cranked up 3" for my lift. I'm clearing 38x12.50 swampers on 8" rims and can turn stop to stop with no rubbing at all even close.
Installed cross drilled and slotted rotors and new pads all the way around and it stops on a dime with the 38's. She's a little slow from a stand still start, but gets up to speed pretty much like normal. Its weird driving this thing and clearly seeing the roofs of minivans haha.

Final setup.... FRONT
Upper and lower front control arms with 5" of lift built in

Indexed the torsion bars for about 2" beyond that for 7" total up front

STEERING
Sway bar extensions made
Rod end steering links made and flipped on top to decrease angle
4" diff drop with 5 degree rotation for perfect driveshaft angle
REAR
919 springs
2" poly spacer
2" drop of upper spring seat for 7" total out back
1.25" length added to upper and lower 3-link arms to center rear wheel
3" panhard bar drop

3" body lift on top of that, for a total of 10" over stock.

Were you able to use your original half shafts with this set up or are you running without drive to the front?

[RamAirZ]

Indy used a Trooper Body Lift that they modified if I remember correctly. Would make sense since our frames are Trooper

[tom4bren]

... a Trooper Body Lift that they modified ...

BINGO

That's the part I'm waiting to hear back from them about.

[Bob Barker]

The modified part?

[tom4bren]

yes

[tom4bren]

I finally got ahold of someone at Independent4X. They indicated that they sell a body lift kit for the VehiCross. Call them at:

(804) 550-0480

He indicated that the kit comes with all instructions for modification and installation.

Sorry, I forgot to ask them how much the kit costs.

Tom

[Bob Barker]

If it's made for the vehicross, why would part of it need to be modified? Unless they are talking about the VX being modified to fit it.


I'll try to call them this week.

[vt_maverick]

Take a look at this thread (http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?threadid=19406). Hope it's not superstang460.

Stang if you're out there you should check in...

[tom4bren]

If it's made for the vehicross, why would part of it need to be modified? Unless they are talking about the VX being modified to fit it.


I'll try to call them this week.

It's probably a kit for a Trooper so needs some modification. I'm guessing that it's the most 'user friendly' approach that we'll find. At least we know that it worked on Nerve_Gas' VX which is more than you could hope for ordering blind elsewhere.

BTW, I'm just throwing info out there. I'm not associated with Indy.

[superstang460]

Hey guys, Unfortunately that wreck was me and my firefox VX :(. I wrote details in regards to the accident on the thread link that VT MAVERICK posted above. I hope to rebuild myself and the firefox soon.

Bobby Roward

[BOARZHEAD]

This is my second body lift and they are easy. It is a trooper bodykit and you just dont use 2 extra pucks that come with it. Weld in 3" spacer for transfercase shifter and adjust auto trans linkage, longer tranny lines to radiator and trim cladding for gas tank and thats about it. Any questions about it ask Matt at independent4x or pm me. It is easy.Takes about 8 hours by self. Price is 199.99 and 37.31 shipping for total of 237.30. Plus 3 ft of tranny hose and 13 clips for rear cladding cause I snapped them

[Bob Barker]

The Trooper body lift listed on Indy4x's site is only for 1". Is that what you did? And it's listed at $95. Where did you find a $200 body lift at and how much lift did it give you?