Need ideas for a locking hitch pin WITH Ron skid in place

[VX KAT]

Want to put a locking hitch pin in WITH my "Ron" skid plate in place.
Looking for ideas & suggestions....
1st choice- WITHOUT cutting the plastic skid.

~Outside width measurement on receiver tube: 2 3/4", Receiver hitch hole: 5/8"

~Width of recessed area on skid for the pin 4 1/2"
~Will NEVER be towing, so pin strength isn't a prime issue, just the superbumper. It only needs something to keep it from falling out. It goes forward in rear impact, don't believe the pin plays into that safety dynamic at all.

~Traditional bent pin with cotter pin - can't get in due to the angle...recessed area would need to be cut out AND I THINK, so would some of the top part.

~Dub said drill a new 5/8" hole further away from the body, makes room for the wider pin.....downside...that involves removing the hitch.

~Shortest pin I could find was 5 7/8" wide....too wide.

~Wire lock pin? Able to get it in at the angle? Wire fit around the hitch?
http://www.wilsonmfgco.com/hitchpins/wirelockpins.htm

~Rowhard suggested a nut & bolt: Not a locking device, but it may be OK for my needs. But not sure it will go in due to angle.
http://www.fastenal.com:80/web/products/detail.ex?sku=19426&ucst=t

~Get a shop to fab a pin, at about 90 degrees, then use a thin airline/luggage type lock....Would have a problem removing the pin though.


:?::?: IDEAS ??

OR, GIVE UP ON FITTING A HITCH PIN, AND CUT OUT THE SKIDS?
SUGGESTIONS FOR WHERE TO CUT??

:thanx::thanx::thanx:

Skid plate actually slides down about another 1/2", I didn't have it completely seated when I took these pics. BUT, when it's properly seated, the upper corners of the receiver hit the skid plate....scratching it up badly.
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSCF3642.JPG

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSCF3641.JPG

[Bob Barker]

Take the pin to a machine shop that can cut a grove around the pin and use an e-clip, or snap ring of the correct diameter. E-clip would push in with your finger, and pull out with a flathead screwdriver, and snap ring would use a simple tool called "snap ring pliers" :haha: to take in and out, and the holes for the pliers and be pointed in any direction you wanted.

When you said "shorted pin i could find was 5 7/8" wide" did you mean 5 7/8" long? and too long?


And that wire lock pin should work, if I'm thinking the right way about your dilema.

[Bob Barker]

Example of an e-clip
http://www.google.com/search?um=1&hl=en&rlz=1R2ADFA_enUS396&biw=1362&bih=509&site=search&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=e-clip&aq=f&aqi=g3&aql=&oq=

examples of snap rings
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1R2ADFA_enUS396&biw=1362&bih=509&q=snap+ring+fastenal&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&wrapid=tlif130319775488810&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi

and some snap ring pliers
http://www.google.com/search?um=1&hl=en&rlz=1R2ADFA_enUS396&biw=1362&bih=509&site=search&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=e-clip&aq=f&aqi=g3&aql=&oq=


(bored at work... using Google to pass the time!)

[VX KAT]

Take the pin to a machine shop that can cut a grove around the pin and use an e-clip, or snap ring of the correct diameter. E-clip would push in with your finger, and pull out with a flathead screwdriver, and snap ring would use a simple tool called "snap ring pliers" :haha: to take in and out, and the holes for the pliers and be pointed in any direction you wanted.

When you said "shorted pin i could find was 5 7/8" wide" did you mean 5 7/8" long? and too long?


And that wire lock pin should work, if I'm thinking the right way about your dilema.

Thanks BB. Never heard of those before, so thanks for the new ideas.
Here's the shortest locking pin I've found (so far)...it's 5 7/8 from end to end (left to right) guess I interchanged "long"and "wide"...but that recessed pocket on the skid is only 4 1/2" wide.
http://www.amazon.com/Master-Lock-1480DAT-Stainless-Receiver/dp/B0000AXY62

The biggest problem I'm having is finding something to get through the hitch holes because it's entering at an angle....since the recessed pocket is so shallow. I'm not even sure if I could get the 3 1/4" Bolt through...

So I like the idea of the snap ring, but I've got to get some pin in there first.

The wire lock pin looked to me like it might work, if I can find one with the pin about 3", AND the wire long enough to go around the hitch tube (2 3/4" x about 2 = roughly 5.5")

Just found a cable lock for bikes/scooters, 2' x 5/8". Since it's flexible, I could get it threaded through the hitch holes, and it'd still fit within that 4 1/2" recess.....only thing is...2' is more than I need, would hang down, or I'd have to secure it with zip ties or something..
https://www.kryptonitelock.com/Products/ProductDetail.aspx?cid=1000&scid=1001&pid=1186

This product says it's 2.75" x .75"...:_thinking...really, is it that short?? Must be to lock a bike tire/rim.
https://www.kryptonitelock.com/Products/ProductDetail.aspx?cid=1000&scid=1001&pid=1184

So TOMORROW (I've got to get to sleep!) I'm going see if I can find some type of similar cablelock that's much short than 2'. I'll check bike and motorcycle places online. I'll bet there's a ton to select from. ALso, going to look into the wire lock pin.

This cable idea may be the best if I don't want to cut the skid plate.

[Riff Raff]

I'm thinkin' to just take your original chrome lock pin and hacksaw off the bent end. Then drill a matching cotterpin hole on the sawed-off side. Thus, you'd have a cotterpin on both sides of the hitchpin, and the chrome hitchpin itself would be at the bare minimum length just to barely poke its nose out each side of the receiver hitch (in order to barely get the other cotterpin through the drilled hole). Whatcha' think???

:bgwb:

[Bob Barker]

Sounds simple enough to me!

[tom4bren]

Sue,

I can get Welder Guy to make you a new hitch with a longer tube if you want to go that route. I'll do a no cost swap with you so you'll only be out the cost/effort to swap them.

Lemme know.

Tom

BTW, of course that means that your SuperBumper will stick out about a 1/2 inch further.

[etlsport]

Riff raff mades a good suggestion... I was going to say get two shorter bolts and then home depot sells internally threaded spacers that are meant for joining two bolts or threaded rods together. I would try to find a way to secure one of those inside the super bumper and Then you only have to use small bolts on each side. It doesn't matter if they connect because the strength of your hitchpin comes from the shear strength of the material at the joint of the hitch and whatever you are using the hitch for

I would try to get a pin that is as strong as possible, your super bumper will probably just push into hitch instead of compressing if the pin breaks, which would focus all of the energy of the crash on your gas tank or rear frame (it's been so long I forget what is behind the hitch)

[vt_maverick]

I'm thinkin' to just take your original chrome lock pin and hacksaw off the bent end. Then drill a matching cotterpin hole on the sawed-off side. Thus, you'd have a cotterpin on both sides of the hitchpin, and the chrome hitchpin itself would be at the bare minimum length just to barely poke its nose out each side of the receiver hitch (in order to barely get the other cotterpin through the drilled hole). Whatcha' think???

:bgwb:


Riff raff mades a good suggestion...

But if I understand that solution correctly, it provides no "locking" capability right?

[etlsport]

But if I understand that solution correctly, it provides no "locking" capability right?

right-o but if you use a snap ring or something to hold the end, who would bother messing with it to pull it off, would have to happen in a parking lot somewhere

[Junster]

Shortest possible I'm guessing would be to make a new stinger that had a 1/2" hole cross drilled then thread the hole so a 1"x5/8 bolt could be screwed in to each side instead of a pin. You'd need only 1 1/2" max on each side and it would never rattle.

Reading back I guess this is kinda what EDL suggested.

What if you get a wild hair and buy a Jetski? Wahoooo..

[tom4bren]

... would focus all of the energy of the crash on your gas tank or rear frame (it's been so long I forget what is behind the hitch)

The fuel tank shield would take the first impact but that's pretty thin. The fuel tank would probably get punctured if the hitch pin fails if hit from the rear on the SuperBumper (that's why I cut about 1/2 inch off of mine).

The other concern I would have is that if the internal threaded spacer were to get deformed, it'd be a real BEEEEOTCH to remove.

I'm leaning more towards the external clip ring approach with the pin being made as short as possible. Sue may have trouble getting even that to engage properly considering the angle it would have to be at during insertion.

[Mile High VX]

I've been thinking about this too since I have the Tone (RIP) hitch and need to lock my bike carrier on occassion. I don't have the rear skid plate (yet) and I still don't have enough room for a locking pin setup.

I think that the solution I have decided on is to install my bike rack and then drill another set of holes further away from the rear of the VX for the locking pin. I will still use the Thule threaded pin in the rear and the new locking pin closer to the collar. I don't think that this will cause any issues with the strength of the hitch or the bike rack.

Just a thought.

[Riff Raff]

But if I understand that solution correctly, it provides no "locking" capability right?

True, VT if using just the cotterpins on both sides of the hitchpin as I described. However, I've seen some miniture padlocks at both HomeDepot & Lowes with skinny shank loops that might be able to wiggle thru the cotterpin hole of the chrome hitchpin. If you get two(2) minature padlocks sold as a pair that are "keyed alike", then you'd have a padlock on each side of the hitchpin using the same one key. I'm sure the right minature padlock is out there somewhere that would fit in those tight confines at the hitchpoint.

I would try my recommendation first, and simply hacksaw the chrome hitchpin to the bare minimum length as required and drill a secondary cotterpin hole. As Eric indicated; it is the "shear" strength that is most important, and by using the original chrome hitchpin then that strength is maintained regardless of how stubby the sawed-off hitchpin might become during the retrofit. Plus, I think it may be the simpliest solution to the problem without damaging the rear skid plate.

:bgwb:

[vt_maverick]

MH - I'm surprised that you couldn't get a locking hitch pin to work with your Tone hitch. I bought a run-of-the-mill Reese pin from Wal-Mart for $15 that worked with no problems.

[vt_maverick]

True, VT if using just the cotterpins on both sides of the hitchpin as I described. However, I've seen some miniture padlocks at both HomeDepot & Lowes with skinny shank loops that might be able to wiggle thru the cotterpin hole of the chrome hitchpin. If you get two(2) minature padlocks sold as a pair that are "keyed alike", then you'd have a padlock on each side of the hitchpin using the same one key. I'm sure the right minature padlock is out there somewhere that would fit in those tight confines at the hitchpoint.


In that case that's the exact solution Sue and I discussed via PM. I might give this option a try, I've got two extra angled pins in the garage that would serve well for testing. Now to find the time. :rolleyes:

[Mile High VX]

MH - I'm surprised that you couldn't get a locking hitch pin to work with your Tone hitch. I bought a run-of-the-mill Reese pin from Wal-Mart for $15 that worked with no problems.

The pin for the Thule is threaded on one end and their locking pin is just too long. Not much room there...

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSCN0311.JPG

[vt_maverick]

Weird, my hitch sticks out further and the side pieces (sorry, not the greatest with terminology here) are rounded loops rather than flat steel with a hole drilled through them. I wonder if Tone changed his design mid-way through?

[Junster]

I noticed in pics before that her hitch is really tucked up in there. Did Tone build those or resell a existing part?

[tom4bren]

Luckly, Sue opted for the receiver without the safety chain hoops so that part won't be in her way.

I rekin the consensus is that any future hitches that Welder Guy makes should be about 1/2 inch longer tube with the hole commensurate.

[Ldub]

I always employ the KISS solution...:yesgray:

Drill a hole on either side, further aft of the original.

problem solved...:_wrench:

Then, for further protection, fill the old hole with a short gr8 bolt.

[Mile High VX]

I always employ the KISS solution...:yesgray:

Drill a hole on either side, further aft of the original.

problem solved...:_wrench:

Then, for further protection, fill the old hole with a short gr8 bolt.

Excellent idea...:smilewink:bwgy:

[vt_maverick]

No concerns that two sets of holes weakens the receiver? Or is the grade 8 bolt intended to solve that problem (if it is one)?

[vt_maverick]

Also, doesn't that mean you'd have to drill new holes in anything that you mount in there?

[Ldub]

No concerns that two sets of holes weakens the receiver? Or is the grade 8 bolt intended to solve that problem (if it is one)?

Since Sue's application is primarily for impact protection, not towing, the bolt should suffice.

Also, I've done this mod to mine, for the very same reason, & strapped more than a few vehicles from my hitch location.
Having designed & built it myself, with ridiculous amounts of triangular gusseting incorporated into the build, I'm not too concerned with regard to strength...:naughty:


Also, doesn't that mean you'd have to drill new holes in anything that you mount in there?

Nope...as long as it's in the same vertical plain as the original orifice, you just move whichever accessory you're using back the same distance & install the pin...which now clears...:smilewink

[VXjunky]

shouldnt the skid plate have been rolled down and under at installation to better align with the indentation....almost looks like the door will hit the skid plate in your pictures...seems if the receiver was centered ...well you get the picture

[Ldub]

Skid plate actually slides down about another 1/2", I didn't have it completely seated when I took these pics.


:smilewink

[VXjunky]

thanks...im a.d.d

[Luna X]

a quick easy fix.....

get (2) nut/bolt/lock washer set-ups... probably need what, just over an inch in length?

I would install w/nut/lock washer to the inside using an open end wrench.

I'm sure you don't take the hitch on-off every day, so that wouldn't be too much of an aggravation, but it would do the trick.

p.s..... you could even get black hardware, so they would barely be noticable... ;)

[tom4bren]

a quick easy fix.....

get (2) nut/bolt/lock washer set-ups... probably need what, just over an inch in length?

I would install w/nut/lock washer to the inside using an open end wrench.

I'm sure you don't take the hitch on-off every day, so that wouldn't be too much of an aggravation, but it would do the trick.

p.s..... you could even get black hardware, so they would barely be noticable... ;)

If I understand your approach, you are semi-permanently installing the SuperBumper in the receiver with the hitch removed from the vehicle & then installing the hitch/SuperBumper. Izzat true?

If so, won't work for Sue's application.

1. SuperBumper must be allowed to slide within the receiver (that's what absorbs the impact in the case of a rear collision).

2. To properly install a SuperBumper, the rubber bump stops inside the tube will be pressing on the receiver pin (or in this case, the nut/bolts you mentioned). You wouldn't be able to get a wrench on it.

[vt_maverick]

Nope...as long as it's in the same vertical plain as the original orifice, you just move whichever accessory you're using back the same distance & install the pin...which now clears...:smilewink

But isn't that moving the weight away from the rear cross-member by another inch or more? Wouldn't that increase the lean effect / decrease the maximum weight capacity of a hitch-mounted cargo box?

[vt_maverick]

For Junky... :) Fully installed with bent hitch pin. Sorry for the quality, my cell phone lens was blurry.

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/3282/IMG00278-20110419-1108.jpg

[VXjunky]

wonder if you could persuade this thing in place..... http://www.walmart.com/ip/Ventura-U-Lock/11065126?findingMethod=rr

[VXjunky]

have you mentioned your backup sensors in a thread....

[VX KAT]

Sue,

I can get Welder Guy to make you a new hitch with a longer tube if you want to go that route. I'll do a no cost swap with you so you'll only be out the cost/effort to swap them.

Lemme know.

Tom

BTW, of course that means that your SuperBumper will stick out about a 1/2 inch further.

How long do you think that would take, i.e. turnaround Tom? He could also modify that edge (that Dub tried to grind down when installing it for me), so the cladding tucks back down tight.


Shortest possible I'm guessing would be to make a new stinger that had a 1/2" hole cross drilled then thread the hole so a 1"x5/8 bolt could be screwed in to each side instead of a pin. You'd need only 1 1/2" max on each side and it would never rattle.

Reading back I guess this is kinda what EDL suggested.

What if you get a wild hair and buy a Jetski? Wahoooo..

We'd use Dave's FJ or my GX470. 5000 lb, 6500 lb rated respectively.



The fuel tank shield would take the first impact but that's pretty thin. The fuel tank would probably get punctured if the hitch pin fails if hit from the rear on the SuperBumper (that's why I cut about 1/2 inch off of mine).

I'm leaning more towards the external clip ring approach with the pin being made as short as possible. Sue may have trouble getting even that to engage properly considering the angle it would have to be at during insertion.

Dang I was hoping the pin didn't affect safety at all....



I always employ the KISS solution...:yesgray:

Drill a hole on either side, further aft of the original.

problem solved...:_wrench:

Then, for further protection, fill the old hole with a short gr8 bolt.

I've been leaning toward that too. Can could anybody drill new holes on the hitch tube while it's STILL on the truck?


a quick easy fix.....

get (2) nut/bolt/lock washer set-ups... probably need what, just over an inch in length?

I would install w/nut/lock washer to the inside using an open end wrench.

I'm sure you don't take the hitch on-off every day, so that wouldn't be too much of an aggravation, but it would do the trick.

p.s..... you could even get black hardware, so they would barely be noticable... ;)

Hmmm.....I like that idea Dan.

~To solve that problem Tom, wouldn't a barrel connector (internally threaded connector like Eric said) work if I could get the other bolt to thread into it?

~Outside tube is 2 3/4", probably use 1 1/4" long bolts on each side, plus the connector.???

[etlsport]

But isn't that moving the weight away from the rear cross-member by another inch or more? Wouldn't that increase the lean effect / decrease the maximum weight capacity of a hitch-mounted cargo box?

the hitch pin supplies support in a horizontal plane for towing and in the case of the super bumper, an accident.

in the case of tongue weight or a cargo carrier, the hitch pin would act as a fulcrum, the load is taken by the bottom of the front of the receiver and the top of the rear of the receiver. Now that I'm thinking about it though, having two pins would eliminate that rotational movement, and put all of the weight on the two pins, similar to how the carrier contacts the receiver.

putting two pins might cause issues with the superbumper though, its has a slot instead of a hole, so two hitch pins would reduce the length of travel/absorption it has

[vt_maverick]

I can see how the two pins stop the vertical rotation, but it seems like you're still putting more weight farther away from the fulcrum. Kind of like wheel spacers which everyone seems to think are bad for the same reason - pushing weight farther away from the axle (or whatever you want to say).

[VX KAT]

wonder if you could persuade this thing in place..... http://www.walmart.com/ip/Ventura-U-Lock/11065126?findingMethod=rr

No, because of the top curve, that's why I was thinking a cable lock might work...it's flexible.


have you mentioned your backup sensors in a thread....

Yes,he has. :p

[etlsport]

I think it would depend on how it was done, if you use both pins (make a new hole in your cargo carrier) the weight doesnt move any further from the frame which is the concern. It would put more stress on the hitch itself, but thats never been an issue to my knowledge, the weight is transferred to the frame in the same manner

if you re-use the existing hole in the cargo carrier and just use 1 pin, you will definitely increase the distance from the frame and increase the twisting effect.

the reason i have a problem with wheel spacers is not the stress on the steering/suspension components, its the stress on the wheel studs. a spacer which lets the studs pass through creates two shear points on the studs, and moves the weight farther down the studs. a wheel spacer that bolts to the hub and has its own studs reduces this and is less harmful to the vehicle. but as far as wheels with low offset vs wheel spacers, the stress on the suspension and steering is the same

[tom4bren]

[QUOTE=VX KAT;226827]How long do you think that would take, i.e. turnaround Tom? He could also modify that edge (that Dub tried to grind down when installing it for me), so the cladding tucks back down tight.

Probably not long ... he's currently underemployed (trying to get his shop to be his sole income). I'll give him a call.

[Ldub]

But isn't that moving the weight away from the rear cross-member by another inch or more? Wouldn't that increase the lean effect / decrease the maximum weight capacity of a hitch-mounted cargo box?

I wasn't trying to mount a cargo box in my scenario...:_thinking

If you want a cargo box, it should have wheels under it as God intended, be very short in the wheelbase dept., & also be nearly impossible (due to the short wheelbase) to maneuver in reverse...:yesgray:

A "ricer wing" is optional, for additional style points...:smilewink

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSC04323.JPG

[tom4bren]

I wasn't trying to mount a cargo box in my scenario...:_thinking

If you want a cargo box, it should have wheels under it as God intended, be very short in the wheelbase dept., & also be nearly impossible (due to the short wheelbase) to maneuver in reverse...:yesgray:

A "ricer wing" is optional, for additional style points...:smilewink

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSC04323.JPG

And should take priority over such mundane things like painting your house.:)

[samneil2000]

I wasn't trying to mount a cargo box in my scenario...:_thinking

If you want a cargo box, it should have wheels under it as God intended, be very short in the wheelbase dept., & also be nearly impossible (due to the short wheelbase) to maneuver in reverse...:yesgray:

A "ricer wing" is optional, for additional style points...:smilewink



Needs more skullz :bgwb:

[vt_maverick]

I wasn't trying to mount a cargo box in my scenario...:_thinking

If you want a cargo box, it should have wheels under it as God intended, be very short in the wheelbase dept., & also be nearly impossible (due to the short wheelbase) to maneuver in reverse...:yesgray:

A "ricer wing" is optional, for additional style points...:smilewink

Lol, no doubt Dub...

[Ldub]

And should take priority over such mundane things like painting your house.:)

Well DUH...:rolleyesg

In my defense, that's my X landlords idea of home maintenance...:laughing:

[VX KAT]

[QUOTE=VX KAT;226827]How long do you think that would take, i.e. turnaround Tom? He could also modify that edge (that Dub tried to grind down when installing it for me), so the cladding tucks back down tight.

Probably not long ... he's currently underemployed (trying to get his shop to be his sole income). I'll give him a call.

Even though patience is definitely not my strongest trait :rollo:, I'm kinda sorta leanin' this way, as my better judgement is telling me this is the best way to go in the long run. Whattya y'all think?

Tom, think he could make it so the 4 mounting holes match up exactly, so we can just take off old, bolt new one on??
If he can, get him to start on it ASAP so it could get to me by 5/12

1) the receiver tube could be made a little longer (maybe 1/2" -3/4"?)
2) The edge (that Dub tried to grind down in pic below) could be made a little more recessed....or maybe the longer tube takes care of that automatically?
3) the hitch pin holes be moved away from the body (maybe 1/2"?)
4) Have WelderGuy make the lip/edge that encircles the end of the receiver a little less prominent.
5) my rear cladding would then be able to snug up tightly, and therefore, the bottom cladding screws will "probably" line up...
6) so I can then install the rear skid using those 4 holes w/o any modification like a bridge
7) And then MAYBE use a conventional hitch pin lock (that's 6" wide, 7" when unlocked)???
(or at the very least the MasterLock 1480DAT which is 5 7/16" wide)
http://www.etrailer.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/pics/1/4/1480DAT_tn.jpg

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSC_4751.JPG

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSC_4727.JPG

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSC_4742.JPG

[Ldub]

3) the hitch pin holes be moved away from the body (maybe 1/2"?)


I'd go more like 3/4-1" aft if possible.

Because of the angle of the cladding/skid plate, you don't gain as much room as it would appear.

[VX KAT]

Good point, I see what you mean.:thumbup:

Think I'm being pretty rationale now going for a new hitch??

[PK]

Wow - nearly 50 posts in one day.

Sue, if you have not committed yet, there is a simpler way.

Carefully measure the total width of the outer tube of your hitch at the hole position.
Buy 2 off 5/8" socket head cap screws that have an plain shank (part above the thread) about 2" long.
Take them to an engineering workshop.

Have them cut one of the SHCSs off at half of the width of your receiver, and drill and tap a 5/16' thread x 1" deep into the newly cut end.

Have them cut the other SHCS to (3/4" + half the receiver width). Turn down the last 3/4" to 5/16", and tap a 5/16" thread all the way down to the shoulder.

Insert 1 SHCS in from each side of your receiver, and screw them together.

The main shank of the SHCS is twice as strong as a standard hitch pin and at the point where the shear load will be applied, if it breaks then it is the least of your problems - you have been hit by a train.
With the round head of a SHCS sticking out each side, no one will ever work out how to undo it.

PK

[Ldub]

Think I'm being pretty rationale now going for a new hitch??

You already know what I'd do...:smilewink

[Bob Barker]

Wow - nearly 50 posts in one day.

Sue, if you have not committed yet, there is a simpler way.

Carefully measure the total width of the outer tube of your hitch at the hole position.
Buy 2 off 5/8" socket head cap screws that have an plain shank (part above the thread) about 2" long.
Take them to an engineering workshop.

Have them cut one of the SHCSs off at half of the width of your receiver, and drill and tap a 5/16' thread x 1" deep into the newly cut end.

Have them cut the other SHCS to (3/4" + half the receiver width). Turn down the last 3/4" to 5/16", and tap a 5/16" thread all the way down to the shoulder.

Insert 1 SHCS in from each side of your receiver, and screw them together.

The main shank of the SHCS is twice as strong as a standard hitch pin and at the point where the shear load will be applied, if it breaks then it is the least of your problems - you have been hit by a train.
With the round head of a SHCS sticking out each side, no one will ever work out how to undo it.

PK

umm... I thought u said simpler... :_thinking

:p

[PK]

umm... I thought u said simpler... :_thinking

:p

LOL - well it would be simple for me to do.

PK

[VX KAT]

LOL - well it would be simple for me to do.

PK

:thumbup: when's your next trip??? :winko:

[VX KAT]

Larry & I chatted about it tonight a bit. Just drilling a second hole further aft as he suggests sure sounds like the easiest solution.

~There's 28mm from the aft side of the hole, to the beginning of the collar.
~If I center a 2nd hole (5/8" = 17mm) within that 28mm space, it leaves 5.5mm on each side.

~The new hole will be about 24mm on center away from the first hole.

~Is that safe enough?

~Can I bias it a few mm's closer to the collar? (wanting to max the space I have to fit the hitch locking pin?)

~Could I make a smaller hole to get it a little closer to the collar? and find a skinnier hitch pin? Or do the shear forces change too much for the worse?

[tom4bren]

Tom, think he could make it so the 4 mounting holes match up exactly, so we can just take off old, bolt new one on??
If he can, get him to start on it ASAP so it could get to me by 5/12

Do-able

1) the receiver tube could be made a little longer (maybe 1/2" -3/4"?)

Do-able

2) The edge (that Dub tried to grind down in pic below) could be made a little more recessed....or maybe the longer tube takes care of that automatically?

Do-able. He may even be able to locate stock with that edge already rounded. IIRC the stock that he used is common Lintle.

3) the hitch pin holes be moved away from the body (maybe 1/2"?)

Well Yeaaahh, ain't that what started all this PITA

4) Have WelderGuy make the lip/edge that encircles the end of the receiver a little less prominent.

Actually, he could leave that off entirely. We talked about that originally and decided to include it just because it's industry standard. Deleting that would make the build much easier (he said that was the biggest PITA on the fab.

5) my rear cladding would then be able to snug up tightly, and therefore, the bottom cladding screws will "probably" line up...

Fingers crossed; prayers answered; & Zeus don't drop any lightning bolts down our shorts

6) so I can then install the rear skid using those 4 holes w/o any modification like a bridge

See comment above

7) And then MAYBE use a conventional hitch pin lock (that's 6" wide, 7" when unlocked)???

Refer back to same comment above






Larry & I chatted about it tonight a bit. Just drilling a second hole further aft as he suggests sure sounds like the easiest solution.

Sounds like the KISS solution but I'm still willing to do the replacement hitch if you wish.

~There's 28mm from the aft side of the hole, to the beginning of the collar.
~If I center a 2nd hole (5/8" = 17mm) within that 28mm space, it leaves 5.5mm on each side.

~The new hole will be about 24mm on center away from the first hole.

~Is that safe enough?

It is

~Can I bias it a few mm's closer to the collar? (wanting to max the space I have to fit the hitch locking pin?)

Yes, you can go right up the the collar. You may need to grind down the collar so that the bulky part of the lock will clear

~Could I make a smaller hole to get it a little closer to the collar? and find a skinnier hitch pin? Or do the shear forces change too much for the worse?

I'd stick with the same size pin for the sake of the SuperBumper functionality. If you ever take a hard hit on the SuperBumper, that pin will take a lot of impact



:drama:

[Ldub]

~Could I make a smaller hole to get it a little closer to the collar? and find a skinnier hitch pin? Or do the shear forces change too much for the worse?

NO...because the the hole in whatever accessory you use in the receiver is still 5/8"...:smilewink

And I KNOW how much you would like a new rattle...:rotate:

[VX KAT]

Went to visit my new favorite store...Fastenal.....just lookin' for any possible option to serve as a hitch pin...off the shelf..

Well, I found this do-hickey....called a socket head shoulder screw or a stripper screw (hmmm, that just doesn't sound right!).
It fit, it's grade 8, it's strong, it's solid, it's the right length....was under $5 for both bolt & nut....
The shoulder is 5/8", which solves the problem Dub highlighted in the prior post. It spans the entire receiver tube, then the threads hold the nut, with a little more threads sticking out.
It's not a locking solution however.

I'm also getting a 2nd hole drilled Friday by my off-road guy....decided I/we don't have the power to do it horizontally...(that and I'm still a big chicken, bach bach bach baaaach!).

So with the shoulder screw, I at least have something to secure the superbumper just in case I don't have room for a conventional locking pin or even one of the L shaped ones. I know I couldn't get the skid on today with this screw...so I'm really gonna need every mm I can get on moving the hole aft.



http://img0.fastenal.com/productimages/26300_hr1c.jpg
http://www.fastenal.com:80/web/products/detail.ex?sku=26375&ucst=t

[Ldub]

Went to visit my new favorite store...Fastenal.....just lookin' for any possible option to serve as a hitch pin...off the shelf..

Well, I found this do-hickey....called a socket head shoulder screw or a stripper screw (hmmm, that just doesn't sound right!).
It fit, it's grade 8, it's strong, it's solid, it's the right length....was under $5 for both bolt & nut....
The shoulder is 5/8", which solves the problem Dub highlighted in the prior post. It spans the entire receiver tube, then the threads hold the nut, with a little more threads sticking out.
It's not a locking solution however.

I'm also getting a 2nd hole drilled Friday by my off-road guy....decided I/we don't have the power to do it horizontally...(that and I'm still a big chicken, bach bach bach baaaach!).

So with the shoulder screw, I at least have something to secure the superbumper just in case I don't have room for a conventional locking pin or even one of the L shaped ones. I know I couldn't get the skid on today with this screw...so I'm really gonna need every mm I can get on moving the hole aft.



http://img0.fastenal.com/productimages/26300_hr1c.jpg
http://www.fastenal.com:80/web/products/detail.ex?sku=26375&ucst=t

:thumbup:

[Riff Raff]

It's not a locking solution however.
http://img0.fastenal.com/productimages/26300_hr1c.jpg
http://www.fastenal.com:80/web/products/detail.ex?sku=26375&ucst=t

Very cool item, indeed. I wonder if a small cotterpin-sized hole could be drilled just above the threaded portion for the installation of a minature padlock. Thus, it would then be a lockable hitchpin. Just food for thought.

:bgwb:

[tom4bren]

Welder Guy is making a hitch for Bee Sting as we speak. He's going to round off (or chamfer) that sharp edge. He's going to move the receiver pin hole aft. He is NOT going to make the receiver tube longer yet until we find out that it's really necessary. I'll keep you posted. We did discuss the functionality of that collar at the end of the receiver tube. As far as we can tell it only serves the purpose that if you don't have anything in the receiver, and you take a bump on the tube, it will keep the tube from getting deformed. BLUF: on any future orders, you may opt to leave that collar off.

BTW, that sharp corner is because that's the way the stock comes. I was right, it's just cut from lintle (the metal brace that goes over doors & windows in brick homes).

[vt_maverick]

I know I couldn't get the skid on today with this screw...so I'm really gonna need every mm I can get on moving the hole aft.

You aren't trying to install the skid with the pin/bolt/screw in place are you?

[Ldub]

Kat,

Here (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=productsearch&cd=3&ved=0CGoQgwgwAg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.northerntool.com%2Fshop%2Ftoo ls%2FNTEChIntJump%3FstoreId%3D6970%26langId%3D-1%26url%3D%2Fshop%2Ftools%2Fproduct_200314953_2003 14953%26cm_ven%3DAggregates%26cm_cat%3DGoogle%26cm _pla%3DTowing%253ETowing%2520Locks%2520%252B%2520H itch%2520Pins%26cm_ite%3D178901%26ci_src%3D1411094 4%26ci_sku%3D178901&ei=lTewTfmYGcXEgQej_OyEDA&usg=AFQjCNHJdBXI3Pv2yLX2JcYsoOjXAOKRFw&sig2=I8tSlGOKjFXRTzcO4MSb-w) is what I was referring to when I mentioned a "sleeved" pin the other night.

Removing the sleeve, then inserting the pin from one side & the sleeve from the other, provides just enough increased clearance for me to get the pin into mine. (with the hole moved aft)

http://www.northerntool.com/images/product/images/178901_lg.jpg

[Junster]

OIC, Here all along I thought it was a real tow hitch receiver. Now from the pics with the rear cladding removed it's actually bolted to the body. I couldn't figure out how yall got it up so high. The one I put on my Dragon is a frame mounted receiver. I wouldn't be towing much with a body mounted hitch either. Sure looks a lot nicer tucked up there than mine does. However I have a 3 seater Polaris Jetski and a full size utility trailer I tow. Kinda have to have a frame mounted hitch. Wish there was was a plug avail for trailer lights. I hate cutting into the harness.

[VX KAT]

You aren't trying to install the skid with the pin/bolt/screw in place are you?


Kat,

Here (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=productsearch&cd=3&ved=0CGoQgwgwAg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.northerntool.com%2Fshop%2Ftoo ls%2FNTEChIntJump%3FstoreId%3D6970%26langId%3D-1%26url%3D%2Fshop%2Ftools%2Fproduct_200314953_2003 14953%26cm_ven%3DAggregates%26cm_cat%3DGoogle%26cm _pla%3DTowing%253ETowing%2520Locks%2520%252B%2520H itch%2520Pins%26cm_ite%3D178901%26ci_src%3D1411094 4%26ci_sku%3D178901&ei=lTewTfmYGcXEgQej_OyEDA&usg=AFQjCNHJdBXI3Pv2yLX2JcYsoOjXAOKRFw&sig2=I8tSlGOKjFXRTzcO4MSb-w) is what I was referring to when I mentioned a "sleeved" pin the other night.

Removing the sleeve, then inserting the pin from one side & the sleeve from the other, provides just enough increased clearance for me to get the pin into mine. (with the hole moved aft)

http://www.northerntool.com/images/product/images/178901_lg.jpg


Yes, actually Mav I've tried it both ways....but because with the skid in place, the pin has to go in at an angle..it doesn't work that way. So I thought, put it in first, then I could put the nut on after the skid is in place. The problem, I can't GET IT OFF without removing the skid.

Yesterday when I was fitting it/playing with it, while at Fastenal, I realized it IS equivalent to a locking pin...cuz you can't get that pin out without some major cutting of the skid, and fighting with the cladding as well, since it's so close.

Dub- I think you're saying with the sleeve removed, the skinner pin can be inserted at just a little bit of an angle and get through?
When you attach the lock barrel, is it touching your skid at all or does it just clear as well?

Can you give me a measurement...from the fore side of your 2nd hole, using the center of that hole as your horizontal marker, to where your cladding touches the tube?
I know cladding can be in different positions, but this would at least give me a ballpark.

[tom4bren]

Junster,

Our hitches can handle the draw weight just fine. It's just tongue weight that is limited. In my discussions with Welder Guy yesterday, we decided that we will go ahead and try to fab up the frame to frame version that is hidden behind the rear cladding. As far as I can tell, this hitch will replace that little tube bumper we gots behind the cladding so it'll actuall make for a stronger rear end & give us all the tongue weight that the suspension can handle.

Gotta help Welder Guy out a little since he got laid off & his shop is his sole means of income now.

As far as trailer light wiring, I just made all my connections inside the VX and keep the wire coiled up in the jack cubby. When I need the trailer lights, I just run the wires out the back door.

Tom

[Junster]

I bought one of the boxes that isolated the trailer wiring and converts it. Just running the pigtail out the door will work as well as any other solution I guess not like I have something back there all the time. I wasn't dissin on the more hidden hitch. I like the look. Where the real problem can come is if someone pulls out in front of you and you have to slam the brakes. That's what damages regular bumpers. Hard to tell from the pics if the hidden hitch will standup to that or not. I've been with two different ppl when that happened. One guy bent the frame in his Ford pickup, the other twisted the front A-frames on his Dodge Cummins from the torque on the disk brakes.

[vt_maverick]

Tom - Any idea how much this new super-Tone hitch will cost? I'd be willing to stake him...

[VX KAT]

Where the real problem can come is if someone pulls out in front of you and you have to slam the brakes. That's what damages regular bumpers. Hard to tell from the pics if the hidden hitch will standup to that or not. I've been with two different ppl when that happened. One guy bent the frame in his Ford pickup, the other twisted the front A-frames on his Dodge Cummins from the torque on the disk brakes.

That's one of several reasons I got a a"superbumper".....to have it take some of the force from a direct hit and absorb some of the impact forces transferred from the hitch to the frame....and then to our bodies/necks.
Thant and it "might" save the cladding and other parts back there in a low enough impact.

Although even with the best of planning, things don't always go as expected....:mado::mado:...translation for some of the newer members...the jerk cabbie that hit me in January, missed, MISSED! the superbumper completely!

Reminds me, I was going to order the slightly larger one, like you have Tom. You still happy with the 24"?
Anybody want to buy my 18"....I'll bring it to Moab.....all nice and clean and conditioned by Kat!

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSC_5979.JPG

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSC_5984.JPG

[tom4bren]

... Where the real problem can come is if someone pulls out in front of you and you have to slam the brakes. That's what damages regular bumpers. Hard to tell from the pics if the hidden hitch will standup to that or not. I've been with two different ppl when that happened. One guy bent the frame in his Ford pickup, the other twisted the front A-frames on his Dodge Cummins from the torque on the disk brakes.

Junster,

I went out & tested it for you:

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showpost.php?p=195164&postcount=38

Actually that accident happened last year. No damage to the rear crossmember.


Tom - Any idea how much this new super-Tone hitch will cost? I'd be willing to stake him...

Not a clue till we design it. Mebbe I can hook up with him one day next week.


Reminds me, I was going to order the slightly larger one, like you have Tom. You still happy with the 24"?

Yes I am. It suits me just fine. Of course the 72" version was actually my first choice.:)

[Ldub]

Dub- I think you're saying with the sleeve removed, the skinner pin can be inserted at just a little bit of an angle and get through?
When you attach the lock barrel, is it touching your skid at all or does it just clear as well?

Can you give me a measurement...from the fore side of your 2nd hole, using the center of that hole as your horizontal marker, to where your cladding touches the tube?
I know cladding can be in different positions, but this would at least give me a ballpark.

20.6248 mm...:yesgray:

Or about 13/16" iff'n yer a MerIkin (no, not a merkin (http://www.google.com/url?url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merkin&q=merkin&rct=j&sa=X&source=suggest&ct=res&oi=suggest_nav&usg=AFQjCNFjT0vECSdsLAnqkLP9mAG_pms8fA&aq=0&oq=merkin&aqi=n1g9g-s1)...:smilewink)

And yes, that's exactly what I'm saying...

It provides just enough angle to slide the pin in first, then slide the sleeve in from the other side. Nothing touches when locked in place.

Mine is different from the one I posted the pic of, mine looks like this:

http://www.4wd.com/aux_incl/images.ashx?i=1479DAT.jpg&partNo=MLC&w=200&h=200

[Junster]

WOW, Tom4 if that hitch survived that without seriously damaging the body. Like I said WOW I'm very impressed.

[VX KAT]

Tom- I talked to Jeff Mohr today at superbumper.com. I think I'm going to order the 24" wide. It'll only stick out 3/8" more than the 18", so that's no biggie. Also got an email from him (kind of like a mini newsletter type deal, talks about the latest testimonials). Said only 14% of rear end collisions will MISS the superbumper....oh gee, aren't I in an exclusive club! :rollo:

[tom4bren]

WOW, Tom4 if that hitch survived that without seriously damaging the body. Like I said WOW I'm very impressed.

Hitch was pointed down slightly after the accident. There was no damage to the hitch & the crossmember was easy to un-tweek.


Tom- I talked to Jeff Mohr today at superbumper.com. I think I'm going to order the 24" wide. It'll only stick out 3/8" more than the 18", so that's no biggie. Also got an email from him (kind of like a mini newsletter type deal, talks about the latest testimonials). Said only 14% of rear end collisions will MISS the superbumper....oh gee, aren't I in an exclusive club! :rollo:

Sue,

73.286% of all statistics are made up on the spot.