New member, isuzu's are for sale but I need help deciding which one of these to buy?!

[ThornWeaver]

Hi all!

(If I'm posting in the wrong place, PLEASE help direct me to the right place. Like it says in the title, I'm brand new on here.)

I need a second opinion by some of you more knowledgeable types (I'm a rookie at this)

I'm looking to put down the cash I have on hand into one of these asap.

All 3 are 1999's.

First one:
www.detaildrivenautos.com/1999_Isuzu_VehiCross_147063757.veh

Second one:
www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=218&ad=19268166&cat=&lpid=&search=vehicross


and third one. Although it's a bit far away, my next business trip takes me near there so I'd be driving it back to Utah:

http://www.modernsubaru.com/used/Isuzu/1999-Isuzu-Vehicross-1f1bd6dc0a0a00640077712ca2b3664f.htm

Please help if you can.I may be in the wrong set of threads, if that's the case: be kind, I'm brand new as of today :thumbup:

Cheers,
~ThornWeaver

[circmand]

we have not seen the actual vehicles just the few photos and the owners descriptions. So number 3 just doesn't have enough info. It is a dealer and everything written is sales talk or clipped out of a ready made ad. So while there may be nothing wrong with it the fcat that is farther away and did not have any detail I would skip. Number 2 has the advantage of a newer motor. However that along with the fact the hood is bondoed and you to to finish and paint it makes me wonder if it had an accident. A member on here is offering free vehicle historys I would suggest doing that on all 3 here. I would say be leery of number 2. Number 1 is also a dealer. However he is a member here and deals with alot of VXs. He has a rep for getting a VX and improving it as much as financially possible. That along with a $2000 discount would have me leaning towards this one.

Of course none of these is a Proton which is the most attractive, sexiest and fastest of the VXs, but only a priveledged few are owners of the best.

[vt_maverick]

Agree with circ on pretty much everything there except the comment about the $2000 discount - let's face it, that's a discount off of his original price which contained who knows how much mark-up. Go here (http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?threadid=22091) and ask for help running the VINs, then let us know what you find out and we can give you a more accurate assessment.

[ThornWeaver]

Thanks circmand for the (very quick) and thoughtful reply!

I pinged the member doing free vehicle histories, I'll be looking for his replies.

I spoke with Number 1 already, that's definitely the one I'm most interested in, and CO isn't too far to go for a VX that's been cared for. It's good to hear there's a dealer willing to go to lengths making a car BETTER for resale, not just a spit-shine and new tires ;-) thanks for the heads-up on his rep here, it's nice to hear a positive one about a used car sales place!

When I talked with Number 2, his price was firm. I'm intrigued by the 2WD conversion though... but it's not necessary for me. I ride my motorcycle most of the summer, so gas cost isn't as big an issue for me as for some. Though it still is a nifty sounding conversion to my uneducated ears...

It looks like number 3 will get scratched off the list of potentials, in favor of the other two on here.

Many thanks! This is a good way to welcome a new member into the tribe, I'm encouraged by it :-D

Anyone else have comments? I'm all ears for more opinions.

Cheers,
~Thornweaver

ps. I'll need to finance about half of it, have the rest spare and on hand. If there are decent places in UT or CO anyone knows, pm me? I'll be looking into credit unions around here today :-) I make okay money, but since I'm about to get married I'll finance this so I have something left to spend on the wedding :nod:

[ThornWeaver]

Thanks vt_maverick :-D that's two helpful members already. This is a quick group I'm joining. I've now pm'd Scott about running the vin, and after I saw your post I posted on that thread also just in case I don't know how to pm correctly yet (pretty likely).

Much appreciated!
~Thornweaver

[vt_maverick]

Meh, weddings are a colossal waste of money. Get married with just the judge and maybe a few close friends and family (thinking single digits here). Then take her somewhere really nice for a honeymoon. WAY better investment, and the bride (didn't pick up on a gender in your posts) will be a lot less stressed out.

[circmand]

But still as I said in the post it is by pics and descriptions still do the appropriate checks before buying.

VTMaverick glad you agree with me that the Proton is the best ;)

[ThornWeaver]

About the VX: More comments still welcome, I'll let you know what Scott finds for me on the VIN search so we have more info to work from.

----------------------
On a more personal note:
I'm the groom. It was going to be a smaller wedding... BUT: I wanted more family and friends invited to the reception, she wanted more family at the dinner the night before. At least the ceremony will be relatively small ;)

Thanks for the advice, planning starts in earnest this week for the honeymoon. A chance to get out of state together will be nice, usually she and I only travel separately for work.
------------------

Cheers,
~Thornweaver

[circmand]

BTW depending on where the VXs are there may be members on the site willing to go by and check them out for you before you have to make a trip and come to a final decision

[ThornWeaver]

Wait ... Wow, seriously? I would not have expected that... this must be a pretty tight group I'm joining up with. I'll shout out and see:

ANYONE IN COLORADO WILLING TO LOOK AT THAT VEHICROSS BEFORE I FLY OUT THERE?

reposting the url for the one in CO: http://www.detaildrivenautos.com/199..._147063757.veh

I'm so glad you're on today to introduce me to the group.

Oh, there's a post that just came up today. Consider this option number 4: http://www.detaildrivenautos.com/199..._147063757.veh
But I think it's outta my budget at $8500. Pretty low mile though. Thoughts anyone?

~Thornweaver

[rsteinmetz70112]

If I were you I look at the local one and if you think it's OK then buy it, unless you have some reason not to. KISS

[Bulldoggie]

Buy Newthings VX here in Oregon and enjoy the drive home.
BTW; I bought mine in Utah and drove it home to Portland.
Not that bad of a drive in one day.

[Bulldoggie]

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=21965&highlight=newthings

Ooops...He sold it.

[ThornWeaver]

I'm not worried about the cost of the flight. One way is about 100 bucks, so no sweat there. Looks like the boards get busier around this time :-)

[Riff Raff]

BTW depending on where the VXs are there may be members on the site willing to go by and check them out for you before you have to make a trip and come to a final decision


That's a big x2!!! Given that fact, you might even want to totally re-think your buying strategy and focus on perhaps a later model year (i.e. 2000/2001) with 18" wheels and the availability of the infamous Proton yellow color which was available only on the 2000 & 2001 models and has VT's solid approval according to Circmand. :yeso:

When you narrow your choices down, be sure and verify that the ABS Light functions properly B/4 purchase. The ABS Light should first illuminate briefy (a few seconds) at ACC pre-iginition turn-key to verify bulb function and then gently fade away/disappear. If the ABS Light doesn't first illuminate, it could mean the previous owner delierately removed the bulb/fuse (not good); if the ABS Light stays on continuosly and doesn't disappear, then that's not good either.

Given the amount of money you are willing to spend, you may want to wait and find perhaps a later model year with lower miles in perhaps a more preferred exterior color. Bottom Line-- don't rush your purchase, take your time and find the perfect one for your tastes.

Lastly and most important-- don't be afraid to buy "on-line long distance" and have the vehicle shipped you via www.DependableAutoShippers.com (D.A.S.). If you do buy "on-line long distance", be sure to use www.Escrow.com to CYA, as it will give you a 3-day inspection period to either accept or reject the possible purchase without fear of being rooked into a lemon.

:luck:

:bgwb:

[89Vette]

Even though you ruled out the 3rd one, I wouldn't. Mostly because it's got the least miles AND the original engine...probably.

The other two have different engines AND, unless documented, might be out of higher-mileage vehicles.

Still, ya gotta like the 18" wheels and price of the detaildriven unit. He'd probably be the type of guy to produce documentation for the engine.

Color is a personal choice. That should play into your choice.

That 2nd one -- touting 20-25mph with the TOD mod....I'm not convinced he's telling the truth on that. And, anyone who stretches the truth, might massage over other "issues". Like how many miles are on the rebuilt engine. Or, even the quality of the rebuild.

[vt_maverick]

VTMaverick glad you agree with me that the Proton is the best ;)


...the availability of the infamous Proton yellow color which was available only on the 2000 & 2001 models and has VT's solid approval according to Circmand. :yeso:

This is what I get for ignoring comments when I read... :rolleyes: ;)

Proton is a nice color. Not my favorite of course, but a good choice nonetheless.

[Gussie2000]

we have not seen the actual vehicles just the few photos and the owners descriptions. So number 3 just doesn't have enough info. It is a dealer and everything written is sales talk or clipped out of a ready made ad. So while there may be nothing wrong with it the fcat that is farther away and did not have any detail I would skip. Number 2 has the advantage of a newer motor. However that along with the fact the hood is bondoed and you to to finish and paint it makes me wonder if it had an accident. A member on here is offering free vehicle historys I would suggest doing that on all 3 here. I would say be leery of number 2. Number 1 is also a dealer. However he is a member here and deals with alot of VXs. He has a rep for getting a VX and improving it as much as financially possible. That along with a $2000 discount would have me leaning towards this one.

Of course none of these is a Proton which is the most attractive, sexiest and fastest of the VXs, but only a priveledged few are owners of the best.


Every think said is true...........................except the proton sentence....hey man don't fall for it :p

[ThornWeaver]

Thank you Riff Raff,

That's some solid advice. I'm a bit impulsive/ quick to action on occasion, which might be due in part to my age (in my mid 20's). Thanks for talking me down a bit.

What do you mean "Given the amount of money you are willing to spend"? I budget about 7 grand as my absolute cap, but is that actually enough to get, say, a 2001 Proton with 90k miles? When I look around they're looking much more pricey than that...

Also, as long as we're on the topic:

ANYONE: Why are Proton's yellow so much preferred? Mechanical reason? Styling? Rarity? I missed something there, methinks.

Thank you again to Riff Raff for the thoughtful reply :-)

Cheers,
~Cameron

[ThornWeaver]

I had liked the look of Number 1 (the one in CO, in black)....

89VETTE, part of the reason I had ruled out Number 3 was the distance to drive and what looked like rust behind those wheels. I could be totally wrong on that last part though...

[ThornWeaver]

looking at option 3 again though... spoke with my father and he had some words to say for sure...

[VXorado]

ANYONE: Why are Proton's yellow so much preferred? Mechanical reason? Styling? Rarity? I missed something there, methinks.



People deprived of attention like the Protons... you stand out a bit more sporting yellow :laughing:. Seriously, they're all the same other than the best ones which are Victory White Ironmans & actually have unique additions :)

...seriously again, all just individual preference depending on your favorite paint color, interior color and how much contrast you like between the cladding & paint. Personally I love em' all.

Pearl white is the only U.S. color choice that is really unique with a production of 1.

I know the owner Richard at detail driven autos & could possibly check out a VX for you. The dealership is about an hour away from me and I'm pretty busy but if you're very serious about one of his VXs, I can try to help out.

[Mile High VX]

About 1.5 hours for me, but if you find that it's the one you really want then I'll make some time and help.

[VX KAT]

Welcome to our forum, yes we are a rather tight knit group and a very friendly and helpful group too.

Start reading up and use the search function as there's a ton of very valuable info on this forum. :thumbup:

Since this is a group of enthusiasts we recently put together a pretty detailed checklist/questionnaire very specific to the VX and covers many issues that have arisen over time since the model is basically 10+ yrs old on average.
We thought a prospective buyer would be interested in this so you know what to ask about/look for.

Pick and choose whatever you want from this list....it's just a tool to get you started! :thumbup:

Good luck in your search! :wave:

DETAILED VX QUESTIONNAIRE /CHECKLIST FOR BUYERS OR SELLERS

*****************************************

ENGINE:

Is it the original engine?


Does it start easily/readily?


Does it run smoothly or is there any strange sounds or hesitation,choking, etc ?


Does it seem to idle smoothly, or is there any irratic racing on the tach, or other irregular idle, etc ?


Anything (noises/clinking/whinning etc...) noticed when it's under load?


Timing belt changed?


Evaluate engine bay- clean? dirty? Any evidence of leaking fluids of any type??
Evaluate fluid levels.


Evaluate air filter- excessively dirty? OEM or after-market?


Any known issues with it?


Any oil consumption noted, under ANY conditions?.....dripping, blowing smoke from exhaust or just consuming it
(some seem to consume a little when on prolonged highway driving)


What type of fluids (synthetic oil or regular, motor oil, diff, tranny, transf case)?



TRANSMISSION:


Is it the original tranny?


Does it shift smoothly between all gears? Both up and down?


Any unusual noises or clunking when shifting?


Is there a slight delay before the gear engages when shifting? (lash)


Any known issues with it?





MISC PERTAINING TO ENGINE & TRANNY:

Any fluids dripping, ever?


Last time & what fluids have been changed?


Any unusual /excessive vibrations in engine or tranny, etc... - very subjective of course


Any problems with motor mounts?


Any unusual flashing of any lights on dash or shifter? (Mode selection switch may be bad)





TOD / 4-WHEEL DRIVE SYSTEM:

Any problems with the TOD (Torque On Demand) system?


Any clunking in tranny when decelerating or accelerating?


BRAND, MODEL AND SIZE OF ALL 4 TIRES


Do all 4 tires match in brand, size, model & wear?


How long have these current 4 tires been on?


Estimate of how much tread remains?






SUSPENSION / BODY / UNDERCARRIAGE / ETC:



Are they still running the original OEM shocks? If not, replaced with what?


Has muffler ever been replaced? What's the status of the current muffler? Rusted, surface rust, etc? OEM, after-market? (Since, as I understand it, these mufflers are no longer available, so an aftermarket one with some modification to the pipes may be required.)


Has it had to go through emissions testing recently? (Some states require for registration, some don't)


Ever been lifted or had torsion bars cranked?


Condition of CV joints and CV boots? (Can be damaged after being lifted)


Battery- status, condition and age


Inspect thoroughly for rust!! Any evidence of rusted bolts anywhere?


Status of front bumper reinforcement bar? (Often rusts off completely)


Status of rear license plate light/socket/bracket -(often severely rusts) -will give indication if it was in a rust belt area.






WINDOWS:

Electric windows work properly or bind?


Condition of window rubber track/gaskets...(many have ripped or been cut)


Look behind door panels to see if vapor barrier is present - (may indicate previous work on windows)


Window regulator /motor been replaced?






BRAKING SYSTEM:


Any ABS issues, dash light illuminated, or other problems?


Original OEM brake pads or replacements?




INTERIOR:

Condition of leather seats...scrapes, rips, tears, wear, abrasion, driver's side seat bolster


Condition of leather steering wheel - (often heavily scraped up)


Condition of inside door opening levers & mechanism (sometimes broken)


Condition of levers that bring seat back forward to allow access to rear seats (often broken)


Condition of 4 screw knobs on interior rear door panel (often break off)


OEM CD player still work correctly or ERR3 code? Any jammed CDs?


Any odors inside, such as smoke or dank/damp?





EXTERIOR:

PAINT: Condition, scratches, dents, oxidation, matching panels, etc...


CLADDING: Evaluate/describe condition of all cladding - scrapes, holes, deformation, dryness, chalky appearance, any evidence of being "painted" or "treated" in any way? Includes Rhino-liner, Line-X, GatorBack, etc...


Are all cladding screws present? Any striped?


Ever taken off road?


OEM or after-market tail pipe?


Status of tail pipe - any deformation may indicate off road use


Status of rear lower cladding & rear gas tank skid plate- scrapes may indicate off road use


Status of undercarriage overall - scrapes, damage, etc... may indicate off road use


Does it have an OEM roof rack?


Are the 4 OEM rail caps in place and/or available?






REPAIRS / SERVICE HISTORY:

Any service history records?


Any known repairs?


Any extra parts on hand?




MISC:


For 2000 and 2001 model, OEM chrome wheels peeling on backside?


Determine the history of the car's physical location, if possible (i.e. East Coast, potential rust, desert, etc)


Any "mods" done not mentioned above?


How long have you owned it?



revised 3/5/12

[vt_maverick]

VXorado and Mile High are great guys, they both checked out my VX for me in Denver before I bought it and were a huge help in the negotiation and shipping process. Thanks again guys!

Btw, in case you didn't catch VXorado's joke above, the "unique additions" he refers to for Ironmans are just Ironman logo stickers.

[vt_maverick]

Nice work on the list Sue, it's not quite an eye-chart now that it's actually formatted with something other than "~" symbols. :thumbup:

[Vendetta]

And floor mats, Kat. Don't forget the Ironman floor mats.

[VX KAT]

Nice work on the list Sue, it's not quite an eye-chart now that it's actually formatted with something other than "~" symbols. :thumbup:

THANKS! think Mark will like it better?

[VX KAT]

And floor mats, Kat. Don't forget the Ironman floor mats.

oh sheesh :rollo:....we've got anudder nut brudder me thinks! :goof:

[Ldub]

Btw, in case you didn't catch VXorado's joke above, the "unique additions" he refers to for Ironmans are just Ironman logo stickers.

And Sony eXplod speakers...which have prolly exploded by now anyway.

And the Ironman logo, embossed into the supple leather of the Recaros...:smilewink

And "Ironman" floor mats...

Welcome to the Fam Thorn...:thumbup:

[vt_maverick]

What do you mean "Given the amount of money you are willing to spend"? I budget about 7 grand as my absolute cap, but is that actually enough to get, say, a 2001 Proton with 90k miles? When I look around they're looking much more pricey than that...

So herein lies the great paradox of used car buying: do you spend high and buy something newer and with fewer miles, or do you spend lower and use the difference to make it your own? I've been on both sides with the VX, as I bought my first one with 22K miles on it 4 years ago for $14K. Got a good amount of mods done on it before a drunk driver totaled it last fall, but most were just cosmetic in nature. When I went hunting again last fall I actually had more cash in hand than the first go-round due to the insurance pay-out, but I decided to buy a cheaper VX with more miles and use the money to do more serious mods (5-speed transmission swap so far, and at least one more this spring).

It probably will be hard to find a 2001 VX with 90K miles (regardless of color) for $7K or less unless it's on the rough side. On the other hand you're far more likely to find a 99 with a new engine or transmission (as you already have) for the same price. If you can live with 16" wheels (until you replace them), no automatic climate control, and a monotone color (silver, black, and white were your only options in 99) the latter may be the way to go.

[VXorado]

VXorado and Mile High are great guys, they both checked out my VX for me in Denver before I bought it and were a huge help in the negotiation and shipping process. Thanks again guys!

Btw, in case you didn't catch VXorado's joke above, the "unique additions" he refers to for Ironmans are just Ironman logo stickers.

Well thank you ;).

The Ironman additions are definitely not enough to sway a decision. The Ironman hood decal is usually faded and cracked which requires removal/reconditioning.

[Gussie2000]

If you can live with 16" wheels (until you replace them), no automatic climate control, and a monotone color (silver, black, and white were your only options in 99) the latter may be the way to go.[/QUOTE]

I don't think that the silver,the white and the black are monotone colors,they are the most popular colors up to today and that's why isuzu choose to offer back in 1999.

I neither see what could be wrong with the 16" wheels,these rims are more fitted for off roading then the 18" and i guess that's why isuzu also choose them over any other size.

The bottom line is that no matter what year is it do you best to find the BEST VX out there. 1999,2000 or 2001

[vt_maverick]

Thanks for the correction Gussie, I meant to say monochrome rather than monotone. I didn't meant to imply boring, only that "colors" were not available in that year. And poor choice of words as well on the 16's, should have said "if you like" them rather than "if you can live" with them. You are correct in that 16" wheels support a wider variety (and usually cheaper cost) of offroad tire. On the otherhand, if you're going for more of an on-road, "sport" feel a larger rim diameter (stock 18" or otherwise) may be a better choice.

Thanks for keeping me honest.

[VXR]

VTMaverick glad you agree with me that the Proton is the best


Proton yellow color which was available only on the 2000 & 2001 models and has VT's solid approval according to Circmand.

You two do realize you both drive a yellow car right???

:laughb:

[circmand]

You two do realize you both drive a yellow car right???

:laughb:

I drive two Yellow/Black cars. I got a 1974 Jensen Healey convertible that I restored (well my checkbook restored) That when it was stripped to bare metal I had painted Proton as well.

[ThornWeaver]

Hey VXorado and Mile High VX, I'll let you know what my decision is. Your offers are generous, and I'll only ask for that favor if I'm absolutely serious about that VX there.

Well well, I look away for a few hours and everyone lines up to help! I'm honestly floored by this group XD

Despite my mild paranoia about the internet, I'll give up my name as it's friendlier:
Hi everyone, my name is Cameron, and I'm an .... okay I'm not an alcoholic but I do like a good vehicle.

Even though this thread won't go on much longer (if it's like threads on non-VX forum) I have one more question: If Number 1 and Number 3 are equally preferred, and the trip back to UT makes them come out about even in price, and I care more about lower maintenance cost than the color--

Which one would YOU, personally, prefer for less repairs over the next couple years?

I'm assuming that the '99 in North Carolina, with 98k miles on it, will have less maintenance. Thoughts?
I'll be speaking with the dealers again today to go over that lovely list that was posted above ^ (good list, seems Very thorough).

Cheers,
~Cameron

[vt_maverick]

Let's hope they don't tell you to shove that list up your ***. :rolleyes:

[ThornWeaver]

UPDATE:

Boltz is selling his for $5,500, on this thread http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=22019&page=2

Compared with my other options, maybe that should be at the top of the list... except the miles are high.

Aw man! My head is bursting with a combination of my desire to buy one, and the right one.

Halp.

[ThornWeaver]

Let's hope they don't tell you to shove that list up your ***. :rolleyes:

Ouch! It's long list indeed ;oob;

[vt_maverick]

UPDATE:

Boltz is selling his for $5,500, on this thread http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=22019&page=2

Compared with my other options, maybe that should be at the top of the list... except the miles are high.

Aw man! My head is bursting with a combination of my desire to buy one, and the right one.

Halp.

I would go ahead and call the other dealers today as you had previously planned, then compare their condition to Boltz's VX. Make a list of things you would want fixed (or would likely go bad in the next X miles and need to be replaced, such as a 150K engine) and what that would cost per VX (we can help you with that calculation). Add the purchase price to the reconditioning price for each VX and then compare to see where you stand.

[ThornWeaver]

I would go ahead and call the other dealers today as you had previously planned, then compare their condition to Boltz's VX. Make a list of things you would want fixed (or would likely go bad in the next X miles and need to be replaced, such as a 150K engine) and what that would cost per VX (we can help you with that calculation). Add the purchase price to the reconditioning price for each VX and then compare to see where you stand.

Okay, I'll do that after work :-)

[mborodi]

don't be afraid to buy "on-line long distance" -
... totally agree! I bought my Proton VX from a dealer online.. never needed to test drive it, every tiny bit of information I ever wanted was there. I did spend a lot of time (ok, not a "LOT".. 4 days) researching the few that were out there for sale and picking the right one.. (I've been wanting one since 99) because all sellers are not created equal.. trust your instinct.. talk to the seller a 100 times if need be.. one seller I came across seemed a bit hinky.. had no idea what he was selling.. and he was asking too much in my opinion.. (7800 for a 99 with 133K on the odo) trying to rush the sale, asking me to pay before I would drive the 3 hours to the other side of Florida.. nah.. I bought mine from a dealer in MA, flew up, hopped in, and drove it back to FL.. 1500 miles ($250 in gas) .. it was a fantastic ride and great to just cruise along in my VX.... there's one joker on ebay currently who has a VX posted for a "buy it now" for $17,900.. yeah.. dude.. smoke another one.. it has a "new" USED/rebuilt motor.. yippee.. the tranny's prolly trashed. Def have to do your homework.. you'll find one that "speaks" to you.. and like any other VX owners (should be) completely in love with their VX.. Mine's going to need a few things (window motors are slow and crabby) add on's I want.. but there's nothing better in the world than looking in the garage or driveway and seeing my VX..

[Ldub]

but there's nothing better in the world than looking in the garage or driveway and seeing my VX..

That one sentence says a LOT...about VX ownership in general...:yes:

Here's 2 U mborodi...:_beer:

[mborodi]

seriously.. even with a kickass alarm system (motion detection inside & out w/perimeter alarm) and a GPS tracking device hard wired in.. Im sure I'd injure someone if they ever attempted to steal mine.. lol.. of course.. it does have a fresh coat of Proton yellow.. I'd have to think it would be seriously retarded to steal something so obvious.. but Im not obsessed with my VX or anything.. well.. ok.. a little.

[vt_maverick]

That one sentence says a LOT...about VX ownership in general...:yes:

Here's 2 U mborodi...:_beer:

x3 - So good he thought it deserved an encore! :laughy:

[Ldub]

I'd have to think it would be seriously retarded to steal something so obvious..

Most pus nutt'd(<I'm pretty sure that was a spelling error) little pieces of S###, who are out there stealing, instead of relishing the warm glow of actually EARNING an income/possesion...are seriously retarded...:yesgray:

But that's just me, I have some seriously twisted views on how things should be...:rolleyesg