Suspension Rebuild

[VX MileHigh]

I am at a crossroads; the front suspension components (upper and lower control arm, knuckle and calipers, among others) are very rusty. The question is do I take the front suspension apart and take a grinder to all of the parts and then spray them with rust converter. Or do I start looking for the parts in the local salvage yards clean them up and paint them? I have a small sand blasting cabinet that will handle most of the parts. I will replace bushings and ball joints as I put things bad together. I have been looking and it appears that Rodeo, Trooper and Ascender parts are interchangable. The only thing that I am concerned about is are there two different knuckle/spindles for 4X4?
I will very likely take the stabilizer off and clean it at the same time and put new bushings on at the same time. Basically, everything on the front suspension is going to be cleaned up. Then I will start to work on the rear suspension. So back to my question, does it make sense to spend a lot of time taking the rust off of the current parts are get ones that are not in as bad of shape. This by the way is more than simple surface rust, it is pretty scaled.

[VXorado]

This by the way is more than simple surface rust, it is pretty scaled.

I believe that's your answer. Used Isuzu parts are so cheap it's worth getting clean suspension parts for rebuilding.

I frequently visit the local pull & pay in Denver and they always have Troopers with VX matching IFS. I know the spindle should the be the same for the last gen Troopers (not sure for rodeos/axioms) and the only difference might be auto hubs vs. our TOD hubs.

Good luck. :yesgray:

[SilverBullet75]

Or, source your parts from the Southern-west states. (Desert climate).
I've been real surprised at how night and day the difference is in rust between the regions.

I can say I have almost NO rust on my VX.
:yesgray:

[VX MileHigh]

I had kind of come to the conclusion that I was going to go with "new" parts because I can probably take the old off and put on "new" before I could get the other parts cleaned up. Where is the pull and pay that you go to VXorado? I know where there used to be some but I don't know if they are still around. There some down around the National Western complex that I went to years ago.

[VX MileHigh]

I spent the weekend under the VX and got most of the stuff done I had planned. However, the rust on the front suspension made it very difficult at best. I did get the left side ball joints replaced and the control arms cleaned up and painted. When I was taking the suspension apart, I discovered that the shocks were the original type with the heat exansion chamber. The sad part is that trying to take the right one off, the top mounting bolt snapped. The left side is nearly done, I have the upper ball joint on and the lower is unbolted and ready to come off, I just was too tired to finish Sunday night. I need to get new sway bar bushings and links and I should be able to put it all back together this evening. Then I have the hood insert to sand and repaint. I will have a nice vehicle when I get through with all of this work. :yesy:

[VXorado]

I forgot to get back with you on the pull & pay lot. Its near the I-70 & US36 junction. Let me know if you ever want to make a trip, I'll join you if i'm free.

[VX MileHigh]

Another weekend working on my VX. When I replaced the ball joints and dropped it back down I discovered that I had a huge amount of negative camber. I spent most of this past weekend trying to remove the bolts from the upper control arm to remove shims and get rid of the negative camber. I was using a 25" breaker bar and I could get the bolts to break free, I could not get the bolts to come out. I tried using my impact wrench and that was about useless. I did get a few other things done that I needed to. I got the bumper brackets off and I have nearly gotten the hole in the front cladding done, I have to wet sand and put the final coat of bumper paint on it. I got the rear shocks installed and have the hood insert off, sanded, primed and painted. It needs a wet sand and a final coat of black satin paint. As I was taking the insert off, three of the studs broke off. I took the "daisies" off drilled out the stub and put news one. I am going to have the VX towed to the shop to have the alignment done because I wore myself out and smashed a couple of fingers in the process and without a bigger impact wrench I am not going to get the bolts out. The saga continues.

[Scott Larson]

Where did your VX come from originally? I'm assuming from the "Rust Belt". That damn metal-rot is a real PITA!

[VX MileHigh]

It came from Mississippi by way of Ohio. The frame and suspension are pretty rusty but the boby has almost none.

[H3_VX]

If you get new parts invest in some sort of undercoating before you install.

[VXorado]

I am going to have the VX towed to the shop to have the alignment done because I wore myself out and smashed a couple of fingers in the process and without a bigger impact wrench I am not going to get the bolts out. The saga continues.

I would flip the upper ball joints before getting the alignment. The flip causes positive camber.

[catskilljay]

I would flip the upper ball joints before getting the alignment. The flip causes positive camber. what do you mean by flip?

[VXorado]

what do you mean by flip?

http://www.planetisuzoo.com/articles.htm?id=78&Ball_Joint_Flip/Spacer_Howto

caused too much positive camber on my VX...

[Maddawg]

http://www.planetisuzoo.com/articles.htm?id=78&Ball_Joint_Flip/Spacer_Howto

caused too much positive camber on my VX...
Nice article. I was wondering how to get around the close to nothing clearance with the bump stop. I had considered removing and re-welding.

[VX KAT]

Nice article. I was wondering how to get around the close to nothing clearance with the bump stop. I had considered removing and re-welding.

Many of us have cut the rear bump stops in half to reduce that hard slamming effect on rough roads, expansion joints in the road, potholes, etc... Takes it from about 1/2" clearance to about 4"....dramatically improved the slamming. Can always get a set from a salvage yard if you want to go back to stock. They're also still available new from Isuzu, about $45 each.

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=19217&highlight=bump+stop


http://vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=21549&highlight=bump+stops


http://vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=19628&highlight=bumpstops


http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=20911&highlight=spring+helpers

[Maddawg]

Many of us have cut the rear bump stops in half to reduce that hard slamming effect on rough roads, expansion joints in the road, potholes, etc... Takes it from about 1/2" clearance to about 4"....dramatically improved the slamming. Can always get a set from a salvage yard if you want to go back to stock. They're also still available new from Isuzu, about $45 each.

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=19217&highlight=bump+stop


http://vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=21549&highlight=bump+stops


http://vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=19628&highlight=bumpstops


http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=20911&highlight=spring+helpers

Thanks Kat for getting back to me!! Nah, I removed my rear bump stops altogether when I did my 3 inch lift. Can't see how they can work when they limit the spring travel. Much better ride but still nothing to brag about. I think a lot of the harshness on pavement and off-road comes from the low profile tires, so they're going to be replaced by 15 inch wheels and 31 inch tires.
My earlier reference to cutting and rewelding was the front upper A-Arm bump stop. There's an article in here about moving the ball joint to the underside of the A-Arm to increase space.

[Maddawg]

http://www.planetisuzoo.com/articles.htm?id=78&Ball_Joint_Flip/Spacer_Howto

caused too much positive camber on my VX...

Does the ball joint "flip" cause any change in suspension height? If you have done this, was there any problems with camber readjustment. I have a 3 inch lift so, just asking.

[Triathlete]

Maddawg, the balljoint flip does not add any lift nor does it allow more travel. It makes lifted vx's easier to align.

[Maddawg]

Maddawg, the balljoint flip does not add any lift nor does it allow more travel. It makes lifted vx's easier to align.

My bad. I meant more space between the upper A-Arm and its stop. Space not travel. It does, doesn't it?

[Triathlete]

It MIGHT net you 1/8 of an inch but thats about it (I have mine flipped).
You can buy low profile bump stops for the front. I believe "energy" makes them. There are several people on here that have them.

[Maddawg]

It MIGHT net you 1/8 of an inch but thats about it (I have mine flipped).
You can buy low profile bump stops for the front. I believe "energy" makes them. There are several people on here that have them.
Thanks Triathlete, I already have the urethane reduced height stops your talking about. Yep, I measured the lug thickness of the ball joint base and your right, its about 5/16 of an inch. There was some mention in the linked article above about adding a spacer as well as "flipping" the ball joint to gain additional clearance. I'm afraid that might make adjusting the camber more difficult though as it may cause the adjustment to move too far into the negative range.

[VX MileHigh]

Well after spending a great deal of money, mostly due to rusted bolts, I got my VX back from the shop. It turns out that I made a very bad assumption and didn't double check. The upper ball joints will work with Rodeo, Trooper and VehiCross but the lower ball joints do not. :oI am sure that most of you already know that but that was causing the extreme negative camber on the front end. Those got changed out but in order to re-align the front end the two bolts that allow the adjustment of the upper control arm were nearly welded on with rust. I had them replace cotrol arm bushings since they were doing the rest of the work, that was a big mistake because it took a tech two and one half days to get them loose. The front end is almost completely new at this point. The other issue that occurred is while they were trying to set the toe-in one of the tie rods broke because of rust. So any of the new members that want to swap parts between the VehiCross and other vehicles, check first to make sure they are, in fact, inter-changable.

[Maddawg]

Hmmm, let me see, I think I got that? The upper ball joints of a VehiCross can be replaced with Rodeo and Trooper. But not the lower. Vehicross ball joints only?

[VX MileHigh]

Hmmm, let me see, I think I got that? The upper ball joints of a VehiCross can be replaced with Rodeo and Trooper. But not the lower. Vehicross ball joints only?The lower ball joints are a little longer from the mounting holes out to the joint. They have a different part number, hence feeling kind of dumb. The uppers are the same part number.

[Maddawg]

Ok, thanks Mike!

[samneil2000]

Can you tell me what part number the lower ball joints that WORK are? I have been sitting on a set of uppers and lowers and looked at doing them yesterday only to realize that the lowers I have are the shorter trooper ones that would angle the knuckle in at the bottom. I need to order some of the proper ones so I can get this knocked out.
Thanks

[Maddawg]

Can you tell me what part number the lower ball joints that WORK are? I have been sitting on a set of uppers and lowers and looked at doing them yesterday only to realize that the lowers I have are the shorter trooper ones that would angle the knuckle in at the bottom. I need to order some of the proper ones so I can get this knocked out.
Thanks


From what VX Mile High said above, they are Isuzu ball joints on the lower. I think you will have to contact Isuzu parts for the number.

[VX MileHigh]

The part number that I have is for Beck/Arnley is 101-4717 Lower Ball Joint. From what I was told MOOG does not carry a lower ball joint for the VehiCross. You do not want to use the lower ball joints from a Rodeo, Trooper or Honda Passport. Those three vehicles use the same lower ball joint.

[VX MileHigh]

Just an update about all of the work that I have done on my VX. I was finally able to drive more than a block last night. I drives great and has a fair amount of pick-up. I really like how it feels and drives. Now, I have many other little jobs to get it close to perfect. I had not tried the CD player until last night and I got an ERROR 1 when I put a disc in. If I remember what I have read this is pretty common error. I will do some searches and see what more I can find out.

[VX KAT]

Just an update about all of the work that I have done on my VX. I was finally able to drive more than a block last night. I drives great and has a fair amount of pick-up. I really like how it feels and drives. Now, I have many other little jobs to get it close to perfect. I had not tried the CD player until last night and I got an ERROR 1 when I put a disc in. If I remember what I have read this is pretty common error. I will do some searches and see what more I can find out.

Trash the CD player....it's toast, eats discs and removing it gives you a nice cubby area (buy a DIN that fits). Several original owners had it replaced under warranty and even the 2nd unit crapped out....not worth wasting a penny on or a minute of time.

[VX MileHigh]

Trash the CD player....it's toast, eats discs and removing it gives you a nice cubby area (buy a DIN that fits). Several original owners had it replaced under warranty and even the 2nd unit crapped out....not worth wasting a penny on or a minute of time.From the previous posts that I read, I came to that same conclusion. I have a head until and cd changer that I took out of a previous vehicle and I think it may be going into the VX soon. I am hoping that I can hook up and additional input for my iPod as well. Thanks for confirming what I had found from the site.

[catskilljay]

can someone please shoot me a link on how to go about adjusting our torsion bars. I know when I had my first tire rotation done, I was told my camber was off and they (Mavis) couldn't fix it. Will adjusting this help bounce as well?

[Scott Larson]

What the heck is a "DIN"??? I know what a DIN connector is (Deutsches Institut für Normung)...:_confused

:ot:

[Vendetta]

The same DIN that governs the connector standards also governs others related to size and shape. Among them was the standardized size of car audio head units. You'll hear terms like single DIN and double DIN (those are the double height ones). So basically, DIN just means standard head unit size in this case.

-V

[Scott Larson]

Gotcha...:fyi: :thanx:

[VX KAT]

Gotcha...:fyi: :thanx:

Double DIN cubby box
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSCN6158.JPG

[Scott Larson]

I tells ya, da tings I lern on dis site...:?: :_thinking :rotate:

[VX KAT]

I tells ya, da tings I lern on dis site...:?: :_thinking :rotate:

WAIT,....hold that thought.....I'm not sure if my cubby represents a double or single DIN?? Anybody know????

I thought when we see the Taurus thing that's half cup holder and half coin holder that was referred to as a double DIN, and since I thought that was the same size height wise as my cubby, it would therefore be called a double??

Come on Mav, this is content..help me out here.....:thumbup:

[tom4bren]

WAIT,....hold that thought.....I'm not sure if my cubby represents a double or single DIN?? Anybody know????

I thought when we see the Taurus thing that's half cup holder and half coin holder that was referred to as a double DIN, and since I thought that was the same size height wise as my cubby, it would therefore be called a double??

Come on Mav, this is content..help me out here.....:thumbup:

I'm not sure since the OEM CD changer in mine still works.

I do know that just because there is a standard, it doesn't mean the mfr follows it. I have a 2.5 DIN head unit in my RV. Go figure. The head unit that came in it was specially made for Coachmen by Unisonic.

BTW, the front end on the RV is an E450 so I blame Ford:)

[Vendetta]

Right, Kat, The cubby knockout is single DIN. ~2" x 7"

-V

[VX KAT]

Right, Kat, The cubby knockout is single DIN. ~2" x 7"

-V

Thanks V! :thumbup:

and to OP...I'm told you can buy these cubby boxes in places like BestBuy etc...just a couple bucks.

[VX MileHigh]

can someone please shoot me a link on how to go about adjusting our torsion bars. I know when I had my first tire rotation done, I was told my camber was off and they (Mavis) couldn't fix it. Will adjusting this help bounce as well?To adjust the camber on the VX you need to add or remove shims that are near where the upper control arm connects to the frame. There are two bolts that hold them in place, you can see them easily with the front tire off. As for the torsion bars they are going to adjust your ride height, among other things. Adjusting them may throw off your camber but I would adjust them first and then have the camber checked. As for a link, if you do a search on the site you should be able find several that will tell you about how to adjust the torsion bars.

[VX MileHigh]

can someone please shoot me a link on how to go about adjusting our torsion bars. I know when I had my first tire rotation done, I was told my camber was off and they (Mavis) couldn't fix it. Will adjusting this help bounce as well?You might want to look at this link
http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=738&highlight=adjust+torsion+bar

[tom4bren]

Here's a pdf of the instructions from out on the Planet (if you like archiving that stuff).

The only editing I did on it was to make the pix bigger.

[catskilljay]

wonderous! thanks VX HM & tom4 for links n help! love this site n its passionate supporters!!

[evillecutter]

Double DIN cubby box
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/500/DSCN6158.JPG

is that a tiny pink flashlight in the cigarette lighter hole?

[VX KAT]

is that a tiny pink flashlight in the cigarette lighter hole?

yup....and it's purple, not pink....flash washed it out...they come in a variety of colors, 12V charges it. It's an LED, pretty bright for a small cheapie.

[tom4bren]

I could convert that flashlight to purple LEDs for ya!

[Maddawg]

Gotta love that little flashlight!

[VX MileHigh]

From the previous posts that I read, I came to that same conclusion. I have a head until and cd changer that I took out of a previous vehicle and I think it may be going into the VX soon. I am hoping that I can hook up and additional input for my iPod as well. Thanks for confirming what I had found from the site.The original radio is out and I have put in a JVC head unit that I had. I also have a 6 disk changer for the head unit. A very simple conversion, I got a harness that would plug into the VX and connected it to the JVC harness. It was plug and play from there. I was hoping that the changer would fit where the original was but the JVC changer is much bigger, so I am trying to determine the best place to put it. I thought about under one of the seats but it is too tall. I am thinking about putting it under the "tool holder". I haven't even done any measuring to see if it will fit but if need be I used to do fiberglass repair so I could fabricate a box for it to fit in. I also swapped a mirror out of an Axiom with auto-dim and Homelink but I have not had the time to get it working yet.

[tom4bren]

Seat sliders may lift the seat enough to make it fit if that is your preference.

[VX MileHigh]

Seat sliders may lift the seat enough to make it fit if that is your preference.That's good thought, Tom but as it is my head is nearly to the headliner(very tall from the waist up). I was looking at pictures in the gallery to see if I could get any ideas and saw a photo of the "tool storage" area with out the trim. I quickly realized that I can not cut into that are below because that is the wheel well. I will have to keep thinking about it for awhile. I will come up with something or just blow it off and get an iPod adapter and go that direction.

[VX KAT]

I could convert that flashlight to purple LEDs for ya!

Huh :_thinking...they make tiny purple LEDs, eh? :_thinking
Whoda thunk it? ;)
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http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/photokat4/MISC%20VX%20PICTURES/DSCN1668.jpg


http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/photokat4/MISC%20VX%20PICTURES/DSCN1675.jpg

[evillecutter]

http://www.shockwarehouse.com/site/product.cfm?id=583546

anyone ever install one of these?

[Vendetta]

Mixed reviews. Amazon folks seem to love them, but anyone I've heard about who has had them for a while seems to have problems.

I opted to avoid for now. It can be added later to the 9000xls if I'm so inclined. Don't see it happening though.

[evillecutter]

ok one more question please: does anyone know what setting on the 9000's would be comparable to the unadjustable 5000 series?

[evillecutter]

anybody?... from what i understand the rancho 5000 is the same shock but just not adjustable

[evillecutter]

Huh :_thinking...they make tiny purple LEDs, eh? :_thinking
Whoda thunk it? ;)
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http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/photokat4/MISC%20VX%20PICTURES/DSCN1668.jpg


http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g386/photokat4/MISC%20VX%20PICTURES/DSCN1675.jpg

those look great kat wherejagetem?