Xmas Wishlist

[I_Wanna_Retire]

Is anybody really working on either a carbon fibre air intake or a carbon fibre hood insert (with a scoop)? If yes, any time tables? Not to be a pest, but I am trying to decide how much xmas money to set aside. :)

[tiggergreen]

I just thought I would reply to this as I think some people may be unaware of a few facts. When you write "xmas" instead of "Christmas" - you are taking Christ out of Christmas. For some of us, this is offensive. If you would rather not use the word "Christmas," you can use something like "the Holidays" or "the holiday that comes before New Year's Day" or anything else.

Since this holiday was instituted to celebrate the birth of Christ, it should be given due respect. If you do not believe in Christ, then by all means find some other term - just do not use "xmas."

As far as your other questions go, yes, there are some items being worked on. I believe Ron of www.vehicrossconcepts.com is working on a hood insert. Once you bought this, you could then have it coated with carbon fiber. But I wouldn't think this will come before Christmas. Most probably this will be late spring/early summer...

By the way, the other thing most people are unaware of is the peace symbol. This symbol is an upside down broken cross. The people who formed this movement in the sixties did not like organized religion or war, so they wanted to come up with something different. Their idea? "Peace without Christ" and thus the upside down broken cross. I often see people that display both the peace symbol and the cross and I have to wonder if they even know that these two symbols are a contradiction to each other...

Thanks for listening! Above all, I do not mean to offend anyone. I just believe that all people, races and religions should be respected no matter what.

Brent

[Tone]

Ease up tigger - it’s just a COMMON, accepted abbreviation unless YOU choose to take it another way.

[WyrreJ]

Originally posted by tiggergreen
Since this holiday was instituted to celebrate the birth of Christ, it should be given due respect. If you do not believe in Christ, then by all means find some other term - just do not use "xmas."The irony here is that Christmas, like most Christain-celebrated holidays is a co-opted holiday from an earlier religion. In this case, December 25th was a Roman holiday for their sun god, seems to be related to the winter solistice too.

On the other end of the timeline, I think that American culture took the Christ out of Christmas long ago. It is a sales event more than anything else today.


By the way, the other thing most people are unaware of is the peace symbol. This symbol is an upside down broken cross. The people who formed this movement in the sixties did not like organized religion or war, so they wanted to come up with something different. Their idea? "Peace without Christ" and thus the upside down broken cross. I often see people that display both the peace symbol and the cross and I have to wonder if they even know that these two symbols are a contradiction to each other...Not to be intentionally harsh, but that really sounds like a persecution complex. A couple of minutes with google brings up a TON of hits on this story, but the only one that has 1st person information to back it up is the origin as a sign for nuclear disarmament. The writings of Bertrand Russell who was a member of, and for a time, president of, the Direct Action Committee against Nuclear War. Some of his letters from that time period explain that the symbol was constructed from the Navy semaphore signs for the letters N and D to represent Nuclear Disarmament in the mid to late 1950's. Here's the site (http://www.peaceday.org/pcsign.htm) that uses way too big fonts. Corroborating information is here. (http://atlasgeo.span.ch/fotw/flags/pea-cnd.html)

[Heraclid]

I have never heard that about the peace symbol before. Wouldn't doubt it at all, though. I once heard that the swastika was originally a Native American sort of peace symbol, and it really meant peace. The Nazi swastika is very similar but upon closer examination is the reverse of the Native American symbol. Anyone know anything more on this? Could be, but I kinda doubt the Nazis were real up on their Native American culture.

I agree with Tiggergreen about the use of "Xmas" instead of Christmas. Like Tiggergreen said, there are several alternatives to Christmas that can be used without corrupting the word and possibly offending Christians. There is no need to take the Christ out of Christmas. Christians have every right to openly celebrate Christ whether anyone else likes it or not, and they certainly owe no apologies for it. Nor is doing so in any way an affront to any other faith or lack thereof any more than, say, someone's overt claim that they are agnostic is necessarily in any way an attack on Christians.

It's always odd to see Christmas tree lots with "Xmas Trees" signs. Seems to me that if you want to sell trees to people looking to celebrate the life of Christ, you may want to leave the Christ part in there. I bet those lots sell less trees, even if a lot of people have turned the whole thing into more of a presents thing than a Christian thing.



I don't get too offended by the use of "Xmas" because I do not believe all who do it mean offense nor do I expect all to be believers, but I think it is at worst greatly disrespectful and at best a lazy abbreviation. Nor is it a proper one, as X does not represent Christ. It usually is used to represent the crossing out of something or crossing in general, as in a railroad crossing, or our use of "VX" as an alternative to using VehiCross. And no, I don't really buy it that the X represents the cross Jesus died upon to those who use "Xmas". I do think it is more reasonable to think that, especially in the case of Christ, an omission of the name more likely represents a disagreement with the faith.

Also, ironically the Christmas tree tradition stems from ancient pagan traditions, as do the various Santa Claus/St. Nicholas incarnations. As the Roman Empire became Christianized in nature and self-proclaimed Christian emperors began to emerge, the Romans found it useful and convenient to make Christian holidays coincide with pagan ones in a bid to more easily assimilate non-Christians. Basically they co-opted the pagan holiday of Saturnalia, the celebration at the winter solstice. Thus we got the improbable placement of the time of Christ's birth at a season when, for instance, Caesar would not have been likely to have held a tax census requiring all to return to the town of their birth. Christmas is still obviously very much about Jesus Christ, but it borrowed a few things along the way (kissing under the mistletoe, hanging holly and wreathes, etc.)

EDIT: P.S.- WyrreJ, I see you hit on one of the same points while I was typing this.

[MZ-N10]

I believe the backward swastika is a buddist thing...
________
How To Roll A Blunt (http://howtorollablunt.net/)

[johnnyapollo]

The backward swastika exists both as an indo-chinese symbol and a native American symbol, though they have different meanings. It's been discovered in use by many cultures.

The assumption of Saturnalia was actually used by early conquering armies as they progressed into Pagan lands for easier assimilation of the local population. They found that it was much easier to replace the local holiday than to eliminate it (in some cases it was Saturnalia, but in most it was the "new year" type holiday widespread throughout pagan europe.

The term X-Mas was actually first commonly used by advertizers in the US - too lazy to spell-out the entire word, especially for signage. It became common with the advent of fast moving automobiles, as X-Mas is easier to see from a moving car than the word Christmas.

X was actually used for Christ as far back as Constantine (the first Roman Emperor baptized as Christian - albeit on his deathbed). He had a vision that if he placed the Chi Rho (first two letters of "CRist" in greek) on the shields of his men he would be successful in battle. He won the battle and this became popularized by later Christian armies as the white cross, especially during the crusades. When Constantine's troops were moving, their shields would tilt, causing the the X to appear as a cross. The quote "In Hoc Signo Vinces" or "In this Sign we will Conquer" comes from this event.

Although the X in X-mas may offend some Christians, I see it as a general over-commercialization of Christmas and this is cause to berate its use by everyone, Christian or not.

-- John

[I_Wanna_Retire]

Wow! I had no idea Xmas would cause such a stir. I have used it for years and years, and this is the first time somebody told me they were offended. Very sorry...

However, back to original subject, it sounds like there may be hope for a hood scoop. Ron, are you out there? Can you confirm?

Also, how about the intake? Tone, I believe you were looking at this, as well as some others. Any luck?

Thanks

[WormGod]

Just to add a note about tolerance....

Taking no side, but to play devils advocate for both, there are those that use Christmas and those that use Xmas. For one to "preach" to the other that "my" way is the way to use it, is simply hypocritical. I think, all things aside, both sides should just tolerate the use of the spelling. It's like a working relationship where both sides give 50/50 and everyone is happy in the end. :) Just my 2 cents.

Yes, carbon fiber intake and insert. ALWAYS been on my "Xmas/Christmas/Holiday" list. I would love to get them myself.... of course, I need my VX back in order to even be able to anything with them. :( I believe Tone and Ron were the drivetrain behind R&D for these products, but since they are a WIP, little can be said. Just ask for money for a gift and save it up for when they do finally come out.

[tomdietrying]

Hey what about a Kwanzaa list?
.
Celebrate whatever you want.
.
Remember this is a Vehicross Board.

p.s.
I think I'm going to treat myself and my VX to some new cladding.

[VCAMILO]

The English letter ‘X,’ which represents the Greek letter chi, the first letter of Christos ("Cristo") for Christ. Christos means "anointed one" and comes from the verb chrio (criw), "I anoint." So, It is not taking Christ out Christmas.

I'm catholic and I don't find the word "Xmas" offensive. It's just a faster way to spell Christmas and associated with the American made famous Santa Clause ( Coke started making him popular back in the day ). To each his own but I get tierd of people corecting each other on fanatic forums. Like my friend says "It is what it is..." So let it be. Making rules for people who post just makes it harder for us to post our true feelings and personalities on forums. From a single catholic spic that loves X-mas I say "Hakuna Matata" to everyone! ;Dr;

P.S. I want a hood insert also. Who is going to make them? I met Albert in Los Angeles last year and the reason that he was involved in making them in Hong Kong was the cost. Who has connections over here in the USA? Oop! Unites States of America. LOL! :-) I love dis contry! ;Db; I hope I dont upset tiggergreen ;eekg; Just my 2cnts ;Db;

[Anita]

For my list of goodies I want:

nerf bars
Rons' floor mat plates
4 "16 wheels

and a wonderful holiday road trip to go with it!

[Dallas4u]

Being an agnostic atheist, I will say that VCAMILO sums it up... besides the fact that this is all off topic, so I know I'm being a bit hypocritical by posting this. By the way, if you don't like the fact that I believe what I believe... then it is your problem and not mine.

That being said, a CF insert that actually does something positive is definitely something I would put on my list!

[Heraclid]

John, thanks for the info... I dig neat info like that and appreciate the enlightenment. I had no clue on a lot of what you said before now. But most people have never heard that either and I dare say the great majority of people using "Xmas" have never heard it.

I used to be more bothered by the use of "Xmas". Not so much any more. Just as an example, my wife had a strong religious influence in her upbringing and we have boxes of decorations in the garage that she wrote "Xmas" on. She certainly meant no harm by it and keeps trying to get me, a Baptist preacher's grandson, more active in church. So you have to take the "Xmas" thing with a bit of a grain of salt. I don't really like it much, but I'm not real upset over it either.

I don't think anybody is attacking atheists here. Heck, if you're an atheist and you end up being wrong, it isn't me who'll have to pay the penalty, so to each their own. :)

Tomdietrying, better watch out... you misspelled Kwanzaa. :)

My list of wants for the VX is too long to list, and growing all the time.

[Jolly Roger VX'er]

I've always spelled out "Christmas" just because I don't want to project the image of being too lazy to write/type it out.....lol.
Besides...if I can spell out Cambridge Springs (I used to only have to write "Erie"!) on every gosh darn return address I make out than by-golley I can spell out Christmas every time too....Lazy people offend me!...okay there, I said it.......lol. I don't want to be labeled just another "Razy American" or "Razy Roundeye" for that matter by the good people that built our trucks!

My Christmas list is:

1) OBX Tomcat Auto shift knob in carbon/red.
2) Ron's console shifter "plates" in a shade of red to match the red door panels of the VX.
3) Either a Valentine 1 or Beltronics 985 radar detector.
4) Remote Starter for VX.
5) Ron Popeil's rotissarie grill..."Set it and Forget it....Baby!!!!!"

P.S.---Things that offend Me:

1) Yosemite Sam saying "I'ze hates Rabbits!" I mean come on...clearly a predjudicial statement!
2) Elmer Fudd a.k.a. Ward Burton pronouncing most words as though they begin with a "W" (i.e. "Wabbit"). Clearly projecting a "verbally-challenged" character in a positive light thereby telling youths of today that it is "OKAY" to mangle the english language....the atrocity of it all!
3) Wile E. Coyote's continuous defamation of the Acme Comany by portraying their products in a manner which degrades it to the otherwise open-minded consumer so as to convey a subliminal statement of negativity resulting in poor sales thus creating a hostile environment for marketing of said products.
Just the tip of the iceburg!

[Apostle]

EDITED: by me, keep my views to myself

[Heraclid]

Apostle, I'm not trying to start anything here, but you made the biggest deal out of it so far with that post. You make a good point though in your own way - people are indeed way too worried about offending others to the point that they are too timid to stand for anything at all, and that's a real shame.

ADDENDUM: As you see, I saw it before you edited it, but I'll keep it all secret. :)

[Apostle]

HA too late Hera, i already edited it

edit: and i saw yours while you were. it just gets me all the politically correct stuff in this world. wasnt like this when i was a kid (way back when) everyone got along with everyone

[Heraclid]

And you're quite right. As a matter of fact I myself once made reference to a tree hugger, meaning an environmentalist wacko. But someone went off on me for offending them on account of their religion, which evidently involved worshipping trees. I hadn't said anything about worshipping trees, but you know how it goes. I am convinced there are tons of people running around just looking for a way to be offended.

By the way, the whole environmental movement is absurd to me, because I think we're all pretty much environmentalists in the sense that none of us are hell-bent on destroying our natural resources. There's nothing wrong with wanting to preserve and protect within reason (ya know, don't let firemen fighting forest fires die to save a minnow, and it did happen), but so much of that stuff goes way beyond any real concern for the environment. Heck, some of them are bona fide terrorists who get their kicks burning Hummer dealerships and ski lodges to the ground. Do a little search for the Earth Liberation Front website.

[WyrreJ]

Heck, if you're an atheist and you end up being wrong, it isn't me who'll have to pay the penalty,

Shades of Pascal's wager there. But he could still be wrong and you could still pay the penalty too.

[WyrreJ]

Originally posted by Apostle
it just gets me all the politically correct stuff in this world. wasnt like this when i was a kid (way back when) everyone got along with everyone Dunno what you said originally, but everytime I hear someone express that view it reminds me of my childhood as a minority white kid. There were plenty of situations in which my interests and values were not taken into consideration at all, both on the micro, personal scale and the macro societal scale. Plenty of non-white people didn't think there was a problem at all, they all thought everything was hunky-dory and everybody was just getting along. Truth was that I and others like me just didn't have enough of voice to get the respect that others took for granted.

[Heraclid]

It was kind of tongue-in-cheek. After all, you can blast some holes in Pascal's Wager. But you can in just about anything. Philosophy is kinda funny that way.

I don't think Apostle meant anything at all like promoting the notion that the majority should rule and to hell with the minority. That is precisely why democracy is bad. Democracy is having two wolves and one rabbit and asking them to decide what's for lunch. Our country was actually founded as a constitutional republic, and its founders were none too fond of democracy.

[WyrreJ]

I didn't mean anything so drastic an accusation as that, just that when you are "on top" it is pretty easy to remain ignorant of the conditions on the underside. Kind of like the famous, "Let them eat cake" quote.

[Heraclid]

True, but I just don't see how it ties in to the politically correct thing though.

[Dallas4u]

Originally posted by Heraclid
I don't think anybody is attacking atheists here. Heck, if you're an atheist and you end up being wrong, it isn't me who'll have to pay the penalty, so to each their own. :)

Hmm... I was trying to show that it doesn't really matter what your religious beliefs are, that the whole idea that you had to actually reply with this shows me that you have a bit of a hard time accepting others that don't believe in what you do. (Not exactly because of what you said, but because you had to say it).

And, I wouldn't mind seeing what Apostle wrote as it obviously had to either do with my statement or the replies there after. Besides not staying with the original subject and, as stated before, being a hypocrite, I think it's interesting what the religious folk would say when someone says they are a atheist.

I just came back from vacation in London. While there I paid a little visit to the house of Charles Darwin... interesting tour.

[Heraclid]

I guess I misconstrued your earlier comments by thinking you were interpreting something as being anti-atheist, and I just tried to cool your jets. You were actually just anticipating a negative reaction before you got one.

If you think I had to say it, well you had to say it first - you said if someone doesn't believe as you do, then it is their problem and not yours. Why then is my saying the same thing you said after the fact a problem? I'm not trying to be combative here. Just trying to point out that this need not be so adversarial.

I guess my earlier statement pretty much says I'm not an atheist. But the whole spirit of the comment in the first place was that it doesn't bother me if you are. In other words, whatever you believe is perfectly fine by me because I feel you have a right to believe it and it doesn't infringe on my rights, so that's perfectly cool by me.

As for the edited post, the gist of it is that Apostle is tired of political correctness, and that's the sum total of it. If he should ever wish to elaborate, fine, but it's not my place to do so for him.

[WyrreJ]

Originally posted by Heraclid
True, but I just don't see how it ties in to the politically correct thing though.

That the "good old days" before the PC movement weren't necessarily so good for people not part of the mainstream. Certainly there are plenty of cases where the PCness has swung to the oppossite extreme, but in many cases there is still plenty more ground to be covered in the name of equality. For example, plucked from today's headlines - gay marriage. :argue:

[Heraclid]

Ah, okay. I would just say that those who are not a part of the mainstream have always been at a disadvantage and I don't think it's gotten any better as a result of anyone ramming political correctness down our throats. I also think that many proponents of political correctness would have it so that the mainstream was defined by something that is actually on the fringes of popular thought.

It's all very mixed up. Political correctness is, at its core, opposed to individualistic free thinking. It's aim is to not offend anyone, and while on the face of it that may sound nice, it is fantasy and reality doesn't work that way. That is because in reality everything, however mundane, still offends someone and the only way to avoid that is to take no definite stand on anything. Perfect political correctness would require you to be a virtual vegetable with no independent thought processes and no concept of right and wrong.

[Dallas4u]

Originally posted by Heraclid
You were actually just anticipating a negative reaction before you got one.

First of all, I wasn't anticipating a negative comment, and yes, I did get one. I was hoping people here would take my comment (about it being the persons problem who has the actual problem with the situation) and see it as a more broad statement rather than a defensive one. I respect people's religious beliefs. I see the history behind Christianity and other religions. I think I can certainly comprehend why people would believe in it. I didn't grow up believing one way or another.

This is all pretty dumb since it has nothing to do with the VehiCROSS or the original subject, but you do get to see some of the truth behind people. Politics and reigion. Jeez

[TDAWG]

It amazing how 1 person make a comment and some people get upset and have to try and correct that person for it. We all make mistakes and not all of us are perfect. If I post the word SPIC or XMAS I understand that it maybe offensive well you know what sorry but the last time I checked America is suppose to stand for home of the free. Where you have the freedom of speech. Alot of my friends and family always ask me why do is it I don't get upset when a person calls me a SPIC there are 2 reasons the 1st being to me it only stands for Spanish, Person, In, Charge and 2nd is other than the 1st it has no real meaning in my vocabulary. I don't see how is it that instead of just letting it go and moving along we always have to bash eachother. We are all grown ups (I would hope) let's just drop it and move on. We are what we are and we say what we say. We all have different beliefs and different views. Their are more important things in this world to worry about then the fact that someone spelled XMAS instead of Christmas. The funny thing about posting anything is that since no one can see the expression a person makes when writting anything is thatit can always be taken out of text. with my .02 added let move on.

[VCAMILO]

I always thought that the word "spic" came from back in the days in NY. When the puertoricans did not speak any English. English speaking folks would make fun of them and ask them "do you speak any english?" so; thats how the word "SPIC" came about. I myself was born in Puerto Rico and I guess when someone uses the word around me I become the bigger person and let it slide. I can't change everyone; especially when people use words freely but w/out the direct intentions to hurt anyones feelings. My friends know better to have respect around others. If someone I know is ignorant; well I guess they won't be my friend for long. :)

Hum... I might want 33"s and a lift kit for xmas. LOL! :mbrasd:

[Apostle]

Sorry, was on a date.

anyhoo, yeah Hera summed it up. Im tired of political correctness and how anal everyone gets so they dont offend anyone else. Say what you want, if i want to hear it ill listen, if i dont ill ignore.

with me its simple, i hate everyone equally, and dont give a rats behind about what anyone thinks, says or does, as long as it don't hurt me or mine.
and if i think it will hurt mine, i will make sure they dont see, hear or are affected by it.

all well, im in a good mood so, ill end this "and god bless us, everyone"

[hchen]

thanks for keeping me entertained for a while reading all those posts. since we can say what we want...i wanna say that i think christianity and all those other european religions = the devils work...if there is a devil. and there probably isnt. let's add up all the mass killings and deaths resulted by those religions...yea...probably take forever to do. im not religious...even tho i went to a christian school earlier in my life...im not down with any religion but if i were to think of a perfect one...it would have to be buddhism or taoism or hindu or islam (yes islam is peaceful, advocates peace)...or any other PEACEFUL religion that doesnt have their believers SHOVING it down yoru throat. anyways...if tehre is a God or many Gods...there isnt one set of rules to worship him/her. it's all one's cultural upbringing and personal preference.

personally i just have less respect for those christians and simliar types that tell me that im going to hell (if there is one) if i dont convert and believe and i've lost many friends because of it. so STOP ENCROACHING ON OTHER PEOPLE'S TERRITORY AND STAY ON YOUR OWN. ok, now i feel better and i'll get back to studying HUMAN EVOLUTION. WERD

[dutchie]

Hchen,

People do bad things, religion doesn`t.
Religion teaches basic ways of living and basic principals, people take those out of context and use them for their own benefit.
There are no perfect people, not perfect christians(hitler was christian), no perfect buddhists(pol pot was buddhist), no perfect hinduists(the caste system is still kept in india), no perfect moslim(Osama) and no perfect atheist(idi amin). etc.

People have the tendency to use religion to explain their own desires and deeds, and use it as a slogan....... "it`s allah`s will",
and "god bless America", are beautiful true words...but become oh so dirty when they are used by people with their own agenda.:mad:

Religion is a great thing, as long as you never forget that religion lives for you and not you for religion!
As for the discussion on this board, great, why do we have to limit ourselves to VX discussions? We`re all old enough to have good descent discussion.
And what`s on my christmas list..nothing we celebrate Saint Nicolas on the 5th of December in Holland;Db;

[Apostle]

5TH of December? ;eekb;

YOU HETHEN!!!!! Dont you realize that throws off the marketing and inventory system of everyone else?

Dutchie Dutchie Dutchie. tsk tsk

[dutchie]

Sorry Apostle for upsetting the world order;)
But kidding aside, did you know that your santa claus comes from "our" saint nicolas?:)
He used to be a Turkish (..)priest, who gave presents to poor children on his birthday, so we figured, if we can steal a flower and make it our national flower (tulip), than we can make this priest a saint.;Db;

[VCAMILO]

Hey Serge! I knew that! I knew that! LOL! I will come visit you guys this coming year. I HOPE! Turbocharger would be nice too under my hood for Xmas! ;eekr;

[Dallas4u]

Ahh Dutchie, very wisely put!

I'm thinking of going diesel with the VX, so this is on my wish list:

My new diesel engine (http://www.bath.ac.uk/~ccsshb/12cyl/)

[Heraclid]

LOL! I wouldn't have it on my VX, but it maybe fun to put a whole lot of it on someone else's ride. :)

Dutchie, very well said!

On religion - I am not particularly religious in the conventional sense, and I do have a bit of a problem with organized religion for a couple of reasons, which is not so much about the doctrines as it is about some of the followers. I prefer to worship in my own personal way and not necessarily as part of a congregation. I do not care for anyone's approval of how I go about it and to a point don't think there is one right way to go about it. I think religion is full of good intentions and I admire those who have strong faith and are not afraid to say so. I see nothing wrong with trying to introduce others to religion as a means of improving their lives, but do disagree with heavy-handed tactics. I once visited a church and filled out a visitor card and then I got calls every night for a week or so at dinnertime, including this guy pretty much inviting himself to my house. That's a bit much.

A few thoughts about peace. Sometimes it is necessary to fight to bring about peace and stability, unless you believe that allowing mass murder and mayhem to go forward uninhibited constitutes peace. Peace does not come from doing nothing and it does not fall into anyone's lap. It takes a lot of work and some blood, sweat, and tears. Like it or not, the world is necessarily governed by the use of force. To do nothing and expect things to get better is kind of like asking a child not to do something and expecting it to do any good if there are never any consequences for disobeying.

[tiggergreen]

I just wanted to assure everyone that I was trying to be more informative than objectionable in my original post. I have a pretty thick skin and I tend to think of myself as non-PC. I had to endure a lot of foul language and smoking while I served in the US Army overseas. But whenever they asked if anyone objected, I always raised my hand. They would then say "Tough" and continue using the same language. But at least they knew where I stood.

As far as the story about the navy flags goes, I don't believe it - I think it is a great cover story. If you read the background of the peace movement, you will understand where I'm coming from. But in order to appeal to the masses, they have to tone down what the public hears.

I have to say that I have immensely enjoyed reading everyone's opinions on here. I feel that we have a very close knit group of people and I consider all of you my extended family. But a good conversation always includes a little debate. I have learned a great deal from reading all of the posts.

Personally, I feel there is an etiquette when writing for a public forum. If someone were to inform me that something I wrote offended them, I would say "I'm sorry" and try to not make the same mistake in the future. If you don't care that some words are offensive, then by all means, carry on. Life goes on and so will I.

Thanks for all the comments.

Brent

[Heraclid]

Great post, and I love the color of your VX too! :-)

[Apostle]

DOWN WITH PC, DOWN WITH PC

SPEAK YOUR MIND, SPEAK YOUR MIND

DUMBA$$E$ KEEP QUIET, DUMBA$$E$ KEEP QUIET


seriously though, everyone has their views and opinions. We wouldnt be human if we didnt, but everyone seems to have come to the same conclusion, dont force them on others.

Dutchie, yeah, know all about that, my mother is german, so i got to open presents early every year, germany xmas is the 24th. or something to that effect, i didnt care, i got to open presents WOO HOO.

as far as my wish list goes, i wish we would pull our troops out of iraq, nuke the whole damn country, and make Mall of The World in its place. "Plenty of Parking" can be its slogan. as far as mods go, need to get dude some cash for the full size spare im getting from him, and possibly tones trailer hitch.

[WyrreJ]

Originally posted by Apostle

as far as my wish list goes, i wish we would pull our troops out of iraq, nuke the whole damn country, and make Mall of The World in its place.

Of course that is Osama's wish list too, except substitute USA for Iraq.

[yal^]

Apostle,

I come from Poland and we always start celebrating Christmas on Dec. 24.
Tradition?
Not really, it has something to do with Catholic calendar, and I mean official calendar church uses to set their dates of certain Catholic holidays. It is not about presents, although we open them on 24th after the supper too.
It is something about U.S. - no offense please, it's only humble opinion of someone who had a pleasure to see different cultures "at work" - that those important holidays, like Christmas i.e., are stripped of any unnecessary extra days, to be simply lazy, eat like piggies, and celebrate their God's birthday. Anyone who comes to Poland around this time of the year gets stuck at the table for three days, because the whole country simply puts everything, even retail, on hold and celebrates, like it was supposed to be. They eat before and after church, nap, enjoy famillies, visit eachother, but most of all praise the Lord. Unfortunately U.S. lost the beauty of Christmas on account of sales revenue. Sad...


Going back so swastika, for those who are interested.
It is said the most interest Hitler had in this symbol is it's connection with god of sun in Aztec tradition - if I am not mistaken. Putrity was his thing, and what's more cleansing than ray's of sun?
I do remeber going over it in school in Poland circa 15 years ago, but who really pays attention in school?

There is interesting study of swastika nad it's meaning for Hitler http://www.intelinet.org/swastika/swastika_intro.htm

Sorry I came out with it so late. Like they say, better late than never.

[Dallas4u]

Originally posted by yal^
Unfortunately U.S. lost the beauty of Christmas on account of sales revenue. Sad...

I would have to agree with you on this for sure.

By the way, HERE (http://www.sabbatarian.com/Paganism/HolyRomanCross.html) is a little interesting bit of info on the history of the swastika.

[Jolly Roger VX'er]

By the way....I just saw an ad for a Christina Aguilera concert....she called herself "Xtina Aguilera"........I immediately thought of you guys....... oh the atrocity of it all!

;eekr;

[Panther_Black_VX]

This group, never ceases to amaze me! The sensitivity of this subject matter could have lead to mass dissention and hard feelings, but everyone was respectful in their disagreements. When I read the first couple of posts and saw that it was 4 pages long, I got nervous. But with the people in this forum, I should have known not to worry at all. Thank you for some interesting, insightful and spirited posts!

And heck, remember we're a cult!! A "VX" cult... :)

[Eckstream]

I think a carbon fiber hood scoop would be great..... Im looknig into having a shop lay my cladding in cf. Anyone have or know of anyone with carbon cladding? I saw something on a japanese site but I cant read japanese.... Also Im lookin for 16" rims and tires. O and a new alarm/remote starter to get rid of the junk factory one... Anyone know why you need to be less than 5ft for theirs to work?