EGR Valve

[mattferguson14]

I know this subject is played out. I read through other threads on it and have gotten some good info. However, I want to know what the main cause of the EGR CEL code is? I got P1404 I think?? Anyway, the guy at autozone tole me it could be something electrical, or the EGR itself. I have seen numerous posts here on the site just saying it needs a good cleaning and to clean the EGR tube? Is this the tube leading to the bottom of the EGR from the exhaust? or some other tube? How hard are these things to clean, what needs to be cleaned as far as the EGR itself, and do you think these things will fix the code? I have also heard that other fouled equipment could cause the EGR code, such as O2 sensors, TPS, etc. What are your experiences? What do you think is the most logical/easiest/cheapest thing to try first? Also, how much performance loss am I looking at with the EGR malfunctioning? Is it even worth messing with? She seems to be running fine.Thank you ahead of time.

[Leon R]

If you do need to get a new unit, you can buy the same aftermerket EGR valve for under $50 on ebay! Even 40% off coupon from Advance Auto can't touch that price!

There is no performance loss when you disable EGR (or if it stops working on its own). As EGR only engages at partial throttle, when you are crusing at constant speed. Some people claim that it gives you 5-10% improvement in gas mileage, but I do not buy it… Did I mention that I hate everything about EGR system? ;)

[mattferguson14]

If you do need to get a new unit, you can buy the same aftermerket EGR valve for under $50 on ebay! Even 40% off coupon from Advance Auto can't touch that price!

There is no performance loss when you disable EGR (or if it stops working on its own). As EGR only engages at partial throttle, when you are crusing at constant speed. Some people claim that it gives you 5-10% improvement in gas mileage, but I do not buy it… Did I mention that I hate everything about EGR system? ;)


Nice! Thanks for the info! Autozone want $150+. I'm gonna mess with it a bit and try to clean it up. But if it keeps throwing the code, I may replace.

[Cobrajet]

Oh, I hate my EGR valve!!! I'm on my third EGR and my code P0405 has just started popping up again!

Here is a nice video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HT4OnP4U0to)explaining your P1405 error code.

In my case, I had a couple codes originally, but after cleaning the OEM EGR valve pintle, I was able to eliminate one code, leaving just the P0405. My OEM and 3-month old NAPA EGR valve were returning the same error, which led me to believe it was something else. After months of troubleshooting, I took the VX to a local shop, who compared my EGR valves to a shelf unit, determining both of my units to be faulty. The NAPA was still under warranty, and they replaced it for free.

But, now the same code has returned (after driving in the rain) which makes me suspect that something is causing my VX to burn up EGR valve electronics. Interestingly, the code has only popped up when I moved the VX from one location to another when cold, maybe running for one minute. The code then popped up on the next restart. I've been able to clear the code each time. Today I have to do the same thing - move my car out of the garage into the driveway for garage maintenance, so I will be able to verify if the code is repeatable. If the code returns today, I will be calling the local shop for their opinion. I'm hoping they will bench test my EGR valve for free, and if it reports faulty I will have to either buy a case of eBay valves, or have them chase down an electrical problem in my VX.

Did I mention - I hate my EGR valve!! :)

[Leon R]

Your problem could be inside the manifold. Did you see this threat?

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=26148

If you have such blockage, replacing the valve can't possibly change the problem. You should be able to see it if you remove your throttle body.

[mattferguson14]

Oh, I hate my EGR valve!!! I'm on my third EGR and my code P0405 has just started popping up again!

Here is a nice video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HT4OnP4U0to)explaining your P1405 error code.

In my case, I had a couple codes originally, but after cleaning the OEM EGR valve pintle, I was able to eliminate one code, leaving just the P0405. My OEM and 3-month old NAPA EGR valve were returning the same error, which led me to believe it was something else. After months of troubleshooting, I took the VX to a local shop, who compared my EGR valves to a shelf unit, determining both of my units to be faulty. The NAPA was still under warranty, and they replaced it for free.

But, now the same code has returned (after driving in the rain) which makes me suspect that something is causing my VX to burn up EGR valve electronics. Interestingly, the code has only popped up when I moved the VX from one location to another when cold, maybe running for one minute. The code then popped up on the next restart. I've been able to clear the code each time. Today I have to do the same thing - move my car out of the garage into the driveway for garage maintenance, so I will be able to verify if the code is repeatable. If the code returns today, I will be calling the local shop for their opinion. I'm hoping they will bench test my EGR valve for free, and if it reports faulty I will have to either buy a case of eBay valves, or have them chase down an electrical problem in my VX.

Did I mention - I hate my EGR valve!! :)



Well, all I did was unplug the electrical connector on the EGR and plug it back in. Then on my way to work this morning, the CEL went off on it's own. Maybe I had a bad connection? If it pops back up I'll do a little more digging but it seems fine for now. P.S. I hate all emissions equipment. I'm all for saving the environment and the ozone layer and all that, but not at the sacrifice of my vehicle's performance :evil2:

[circmand]

I finally had the EGR valve and am getting 75 miles more per tank of gas

[Leon R]

I finally had the EGR valve and am getting 75 miles more per tank of gas

EGR can't possibly make THAT much of difference! We are talking about 30% here ...

I have had working and non-working EGR driving my VX over two years and never been able to notice the difference.

[circmand]

if you ignore it for a year and a half before changing it.

[Leon R]

I should have been more clear. For the first year and few months of owning my VX, EGR would do in and out of service (every other month). Then, just as I got my last inspection sticker, my EGT went permanently bad (P0405). I can reset it, but it comes back with-in 10-20 seconds. I has been like this for the last 10 month.

Oddly enough, I got my best fuel consumption (17mpg) this past summer (when EGR was not working). My typical consumption is 14mpg, but I attribute this great mileage to mostly highway driving.

I have inspection coming up in two more months, so I will have to fix it. And then, just might block it off until the next inspection.

[circmand]

I am no expert I just know my circumstance but I have read here that the EGR valve can get stuck open or closed or in between maybe this can affect whether you get more or less mileage. Perhaps one of our more learned members can chime in

[bartmanS4]

If your egr is working properly, then you should not have noticed ANY gains. The egr only operates during cruise conditions. It does not operate at idle because idle quality would be greatly affected. It does not operate at full throttle because Ford knew you want full power when you put the pedal to the metal. The reason they do it at cruise is because it has very little effect on performance when you are cruising down the freeway at a light load. when you smash down on the accelerator, the egr shuts off. In my 94 ranger the egr uses a DPFE (Delta Pressure Feedback EGR). In that, there is an orifice inside the tube that goes from the manifold to the throttle body. There is a silicone tube on each side of this orifice that goes up to what looks like a map sensor with two lines going to it. When the egr starts to operate, there is a pressure difference within the tube on either side of that orifice. This is how that 'map' sensor verifies that the egr has proper flow. In addition, when that sensor sees flow of the egr at cruise the computer knows that it is an inert gas and backs off fuel to keep a proper AF ratio, lower NOX, and save fuel. So if you noticed any power increase from blocking off your EGR it was not working properly. It most likely had a sticking valve that was allowing exhaust gasses back into the intake at all RPM. This would greatly affect power.

I found this write up that make a lot of sense to me.

[Cobrajet]

I should have been more clear. For the first year and few months of owning my VX, EGR would do in and out of surface (every other month). Then, just as I got my last inspection sticker, my EGT went permanently bad (P0405). I can reset it, but it comes back with-in 10-20 seconds. I has been like this for the last 10 month.

Exactly the same symptoms I have experience for the last year. I replaced my original EGR with a NAPA valve, and the P0405 code came back a few months later. I had that one replaced (under warranty) and now, a few months later, the P0405 code is back. I can clear the code, but it comes back after a couple miles driving. I'll be taking the EGR back to the same shop that diagnosed it as bad to see if I have another bad one. I'm not sure what course of action I'll take this time. I guess warranty exchanges until the warranty expires, then buy another new one... :)

[HeckaTrebeka]

I had the egr code come up once, so I cleaned it. It was super easy to do, takes very little time, and is am inexpensive fix. I'd recommend cleaning it out before doing anything else. There's a writeup here somewhere on how to do it. Literally takes 30 mins if you have the tools to do it.

[Leon R]

I have cleaned it several times now, by spraying several different chemicals down both holes and by cleaning the valve itself. It only worked for a while the first time I did it.

[mattferguson14]

Your problem could be inside the manifold. Did you see this threat?

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?t=26148

If you have such blockage, replacing the valve can't possibly change the problem. You should be able to see it if you remove your throttle body.

This video was very informative for the P1405 code. Long winded, but informative. It shows exactly how the EGR functions and gives you an idea of where problems can occur. I recommend watching it if you have a bit of free time.

[evillecutter]

easiest fix: take apart dash, remove instrument panel, remove check engine light bulb, reverse process

[AlexVX]

Had this code for few years changed and cleaned everyghing (EGR, O2) to no effect. Code went away after cleaning MAF

[mattferguson14]

MAF could be the answer for me too.. I have a Hotshot intake with an oil type K&N cone filter.There's a possibility that it's sucked some oil/dust/other crud past the MAF. I may try that if the light comes back on. But going on a week now with no CEL. :D

[Leon R]

When I was installing a new thermostat, I was able to clear out totally clogged EGR tube (right behind the throttle body). Not surprisingly, P0405 code came right back :(. I believe that I had TWO problems with my EGR system: a totally clogged tube AND a bad EGR valve. I just purchased one of the ebay special and should be able test my theory in about a week.

http://i973.photobucket.com/albums/ae215/grndsm/30880CF2-0C53-45B0-AC35-82C41EDBF650_zpsnokkipti.jpg (http://s973.photobucket.com/user/grndsm/media/30880CF2-0C53-45B0-AC35-82C41EDBF650_zpsnokkipti.jpg.html)

BTW, a quick shot of what EGR system does to your intake:

http://i973.photobucket.com/albums/ae215/grndsm/7476A165-5164-49C5-9DCA-503F9B1F9382_zpshz6cyixc.jpg (http://s973.photobucket.com/user/grndsm/media/7476A165-5164-49C5-9DCA-503F9B1F9382_zpshz6cyixc.jpg.html)

[Leon R]

With my inspection being due at the end of January, I finally purchased the CHEAPEST EGR valve I could find on eBay:

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=321641349038

It was $40 shipped and did not come with a gasket (no big deal, as my old gasket was fine). For the first time in a year my CE light was off! I now have the sticker, so I think I will now block it off until the next year... I just might have to unplug the CE light and occasionally scan my codes with my Ultra Gaude :)

BTW, there was no notisable change in fuel consumption...

[tom4bren]

I want to know what the main cause of the EGR CEL code is?

Remember too that if you have a copy of the shop manual, you can use cntl-F (find) to locate info on any of the OBD II codes you read. I'm just sayin:). I just learnt that little trick today (didn't remember that the manual had all that info detailed). Just put "P0405" into the search box (or whatever code you are looking for).

[mattferguson14]

With my inspection being due at the end of January, I finally purchased the CHEAPEST EGR valve I could find on eBay:

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=321641349038

It was $40 shipped and did not come with a gasket (no big deal, as my old gasket was fine). For the first time in a year my CE light was off! I now have the sticker, so I think I will now block it off until the next year... I just might have to unplug the CE light and occasionally scan my codes with my Ultra Gaude :)

BTW, there was no notisable change in fuel consumption...

I'm buying one asap!

[Leon R]

With my inspection being due at the end of January, I finally purchased the CHEAPEST EGR valve I could find on eBay:

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=321641349038

It was $40 shipped and did not come with a gasket (no big deal, as my old gasket was fine). For the first time in a year my CE light was off! I now have the sticker, so I think I will now block it off until the next year... I just might have to unplug the CE light and occasionally scan my codes with my Ultra Gaude :)

BTW, there was no notisable change in fuel consumption...

Well, this worked for almost a month… After a month of driving without any problems, I now have code code P1404 - EGR Valve Closed Pintle Position. I think the new cheapo valve might not be all that great. But I got the inspection sticker, so it did its job :).

Resetting it lasted 2-3 days, so it wasn’t coming immediately back (like was before with P0404 code).

As soon as it gets a warmer, I am installing the old valve with a block off gasket. Or I might just make a block off plate, until the next year’s inspection… So this will be my temporary EGR valve, installed just for inspection.

[mattferguson14]

A quick update, I have since replaced my EGR completely with a cheap one off of ebay. Just yesterday I cleaned out the EGR tube using this tool. Just wanted to let everyone know, it worked ok, but could have been better. If you can find a little bit thinner brush that can snake through the bends in the tube easier, you will be better off. However, this one fits really snug and for the parts of the tube you can reach, it cleans it very well:

http://www.amazon.com/Herco-HE78-Trombone-Flex-Brush/dp/B000EELFOM/

As soon as I replaced my EGR (about a month ago), it cleared the code P1404 (valve stuck open) but code P0401 (insufficient flow to EGR) popped up. Now that I've cleaned out the EGR tube, NO CEL!!! It feels weirddriving down the road without that light shining.. :D

[Leon R]

The cheap valve started triggering CE light every few days in four week, in two more weeks, it went permanently bad. When I took it off, I could see some exhaust leaks from the valve itself.

I ended up putting the original valve back on with a block off plate (made from soda can). I still have CE light, but I am CERTAIN that there is no exhaust gasses entering my intake. Gas mileage had improved from ~13.3 MPG to 15.1 MPG, I am not sure if this was from blocking off EGR or from warmer weather.

My VX will be 15 years old next year, so no more OBD2 inspections!

[mattferguson14]

Soooo, after cleaning the tube and clearing the code, the CEL came back on the next day, insufficient flow to the EGR. I may think about blocking it off as well. Did it make any difference in performance (idle, acceleration, power,etc.) other than the potential fuel efficiency? I get around 10-11 MPG right now so some improvement wouldn't hurt!