I maybe .. just maybe ... might be getting a Vehicross

[Thelgord]

After ponder this question for a very long time, I might be getting a Vehicross. I joined this forum a couple of years ago (JAN of 2015) looking for advice on the question of "if" I should get a Vehicross or keep my Tacoma. I decided then that to keep the Tacoma and moved on. But I always held out hope of one day getting a VX. I think I may have found one.

I was living in Colorado at the time, and now I live in Georgia. The Army is great about moving me around. Anywho, I have done as much I care to with the Tacoma without affecting resale value. However, what I want (really) is something I can have fun with without worrying about scratching the paint. Not that I dive vehicles offroad hard (I am getting to old for that anyway), but something I can enjoy taking out and not worrying too much about scratches from brush and the like. Oh, and I am keeping the Tacoma as well.

I have a line on a VX for $3995 at a dealership that isn't local. The dealer says it runs great, but they always say that. After looking up the vin, it would appear the electric windows have an issue of coming off track and more importantly, the engine was seized at least once back in 2006 when the motor lost all of its oil. I will be contacting the dealer on Monday morning for more info. I want to know if it the original motor was rebuilt or a replacement was found. I am thinking I may be able to use this to get the price even lower. As this is also a "project car", it really doesn't matter to me, but if I can make the dealer think that I think it matters, it may save me some money. We shall see.

Of course, the most important thing is that the wife is finally on board with the idea of a project vehicle since it was also her that convinced me to be more ... conservative ... when modifying the Tacoma. Really I am glad she did. It is a great vehicle, but not something that I want to modify too much.

Anyway, if this works out, what other questions should I be looking to ask about a VX before I buy? Thanks for any replies!

[ipd]

Where in GA? I"m in Warner Robins.

[ipd]

I'd see if you can find someone in the local area who IS a VX owner, or has owned one in the past--who can kick the tires for you. All VX's have the window issue. SBC still sells brackets for fixing this--so buy those & do the repair work yourself; problem solved. It they found a replacement (i.e. used) engine, lord only knows what condition it's in. It might even be a 3.2L instead of the 3.5L. A rebuilt engine isn't a bad thing at all. I'm almost positive mine had the engine rebuilt before I got it. It also doesn't burn a lick of oil--which is HIGHLY uncommon for the VX. I'd wager that they used updated internals to fix the burn issue.

This website has a lot of good info on what to look for (problem wise) on a VX. Some of the high points are rust (look at the condition of the crash bars as an indicator). ABS module inop. TOD not working properly (sometimes it's as simple as a fluid flush). Backlash adjustment (worm gears...of which I know very little about). U-Joints & bearings for the driveshaft (happens with all vehicles with age). Wet carpet (multiple causes--sometimes age related). Inside door handles splitting (poor design). Worn leather (all vehicles).

Let me know if I can help in any way. I highly recommend tint--especially on the hatch & rear windows. 20% will greatly reduce sun damage.

[MSHardeman]

I can't find it right now but VX Kat has put together an extensive list of things to review when buying a VX. Hopefully she will see this and chime in.

[Thelgord]

Where in GA? I"m in Warner Robins.

Currently in Harlem, GA, not too far from you.


I'd see if you can find someone in the local area who IS a VX owner, or has owned one in the past--who can kick the tires for you. All VX's have the window issue. SBC still sells brackets for fixing this--so buy those & do the repair work yourself; problem solved. It they found a replacement (i.e. used) engine, lord only knows what condition it's in. It might even be a 3.2L instead of the 3.5L. A rebuilt engine isn't a bad thing at all. I'm almost positive mine had the engine rebuilt before I got it. It also doesn't burn a lick of oil--which is HIGHLY uncommon for the VX. I'd wager that they used updated internals to fix the burn issue.

This website has a lot of good info on what to look for (problem wise) on a VX. Some of the high points are rust (look at the condition of the crash bars as an indicator). ABS module inop. TOD not working properly (sometimes it's as simple as a fluid flush). Backlash adjustment (worm gears...of which I know very little about). U-Joints & bearings for the driveshaft (happens with all vehicles with age). Wet carpet (multiple causes--sometimes age related). Inside door handles splitting (poor design). Worn leather (all vehicles).

Let me know if I can help in any way. I highly recommend tint--especially on the hatch & rear windows. 20% will greatly reduce sun damage.

Thanks for the info! I am aware of the issues with the window, I have been researching this buy for a very long time.



I can't find it right now but VX Kat has put together an extensive list of things to review when buying a VX. Hopefully she will see this and chime in.

That would be very helpful! Thanks!

[Thelgord]

For an update, the original deal fell through, someone else beat me to the punch. Oh well, let the hunt continue!

I found a few for sale on AutoTrader dot com. So far the only response back I have gotten is from a private seller (Florida) who is not acting like we wants to sell very bad. Understandable, I have wanted one since I first learned of there existence, which was actually in 2014. The paint could be bad, but the images are very small. Also lists a host of other issues, so I may just drop this one and look elsewhere.

[ipd]

adhuntr.com It won't find every listing...but it will usually pull a lot more from craigslist than you might otherwise find.

[ipd]

Here's a list of what I see at the moment:

https://worcester.craigslist.org/cto/6194647961.html

https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6172126483.html

https://daytona.craigslist.org/cto/6194188388.html

https://columbus.craigslist.org/cto/6194249028.html

There's one out in cali, but the dude wants 20 bills for it, so I didn't link.

[Thelgord]

Thanks! I found one on a FB group for $5500 by Joe Darlington. However, it has been extensively modified. TOD removed, Regular T-Case installed, Aussie Lockers, Lift and more. Kinda sounds great, but maybe not. Don't know yet. I have messaged him for more info, but I generally don't look for vehicles with heavy modifications already installed. From the images though, it looks like it was well maintained even if it was driven hard.

From what I have read about the TOD system, when in 4LOW the front end is fully engaged until you switch back to high range, then you are back in TOD mode. I think I would have prefered a selectable locker in the front that is wired through the transfer case selector switch so it could only be engaged in 4Low. That would allow me to keep the TOD and really, if you need a front locker engaged you are probably going to need 4Low as well.

[ipd]

If you'd like to drive or get a feel for a stock VX, you can come take mine for a spin. That might give you a better feel for what you'd like to have done.

[Thelgord]

Appreciate the offer. I am currently in the Agusta, GA area. Not sure how from you that is.

[ipd]

Like I said, I'm in Warner Robins. Don't think you'll probably find any VX owners closer...at least not that actually are active in the community. I saw a Proton one in W-R a month or so ago (posted it on here) but never heard a peep out of whomever it was.

[Thelgord]

That's about 2.5 hours from me. I could do that. This site does seem a little slow compared to when I first discovered it a couple years ago. Maybe more advertising is needed LOL!

[WormGod]

Thelgord, what are you willing to spend? Can you give me a good window of price scale and exactly what you are looking for, and NOT looking for?

[ipd]

That's about 2.5 hours from me. I could do that. This site does seem a little slow compared to when I first discovered it a couple years ago. Maybe more advertising is needed LOL!

It's not advertising. There's still a few back-end bugs it has. But the biggest problem is that FB is killing off car communities one by one--and this is no exception. FB sucks for technical knowledge; whereas this site is great. I see the same death knell on my other car's forum too.

Couple that with the fact that <6000 were ever made, and you have an impossibly small community with aging vehicles & an unknown number of copies of said vehicle still remaining. Oh, and younger people are too scatterbrained & have no attention spans--to ever want or enjoy older vehicles.

[Y33TREKker]

Appreciate the offer. I am currently in the Agusta, GA area. Not sure how from you that is.
Speaking of offers, if you happen to end up with any extra Augusta National Masters tickets in the future that you just can't find a use for, just let me know and I'll be happy to offer a self-addressed stamped envelope for your mailing pleasure. :bgwo:

[Thelgord]

I made a post about what I as looking for here: http://www.vehicross.info/showthread.php/27675-Looking-to-buy

Basically, I really like the "rally" concept style of this vehicle. I am not looking for a rock crawler. I think the VX does fine off-road stock, but could use some upgrades. So, if I started with a stock VX I would do the following mods:


All Terrain Tires (simple and cheap)
Rear selectable locker (not the Aussie Locker)
Front selectable locker wired through the transfer case selector switch for 4LOW use only
Front winch mount (hidden winch maybe?)
Maybe an off-road bumper, maybe just a brush gaurd (probably the latter)
A couple of radios (CB/GMRS) mounted inside
Rock Sliders
Skid Plate
Clutch Fan interrupt switch (keep the fan off durring water crossings to prevent breaking it)


Things I would keep stock:

TOD (really what is a VX without it?)
Ride Hight (seems to be just fine the way it is but go up 1-2 inches)
Most of the interior
Engine (should the Cummins R2 not work out)
Most of the electrical system (seriously, I hate chasing custom wiring and am a big believer in using aux fuse boxes to keep accessories as separate from OEM wiring as possible)


I have also been emailing back and forth with Cummins about their R2 repower program. So far things are looking favorable for the VX when it becomes available later this year. The real trick is keeping the TOD working after the engine swap, I may have to pay for some technician time (probably not cheap) but they seem confident they can keep it working. Also, just in case they can actually make it work, it will only be emissions compliment up to model year 1999 (for now), so there is that. Though you could put it in a new vehicle and just register in an area without emissions restrictions. The main reason for this is with a 22.5 gallon tank it works out to around a 600 mile highway range after the diesel swap. If you you fill up before empty (say you put in around 17 gallons each time) it still works out to a 500+ range.

The intended use case for a VX, if I can ever get one, is daily driver/adventure vehicle. I am sure you have heard the term overlanding. I have been doing that my whole life, long before the term became popular. The longest trip I have taken so far is a month long back country exploration from Colorado across Kanasas that ended in Kentucky that I did in my '13 Tacoma. The down side to the Tacoma is total cost of ownership. These things are uber expensive. Yes, there is massive after market support, but that doesn't make it cost any less. Basically the $500+/month payment is killing my adventure budget.

I had a buddy who was going to buy my Tacoma, but he didn't pass credit for the car note so the bank said no. I am thinking I will porobably need to go through a dealer to off-load the Tacoma so I can get a VX. I was going to keep the Tacoma, but the math in the budget just doesn't work as well as I would like if I do. Needs change, priorities change, life changes. It just happens.

As for budget, I am suprised that KBB list them for so much lower than most people seem to be asking. Of course, a lot of those have been "asking" for months without actually selling. I would like to keep it under $5k but could go higher. At that price range I could buy a VX before waiting to off-load the Tacoma. Above that my household budget starts getting too thin for my liking. If can get one for say $4500-5000 then I can make sure it is mechanically sound before dropping the Tacoma.

As for Masters tickets, I actually hate master week. Jams up traffic all over town. Most locals treat it like a blizzard. Stock up on supplies and only go out when absolutely necessary LOL!

[ipd]

Yeah, apart from perhaps the increased fuel economy...i can't think of any reason to go with an engine that will require custom work to even fit/operate--and then offer less power (if i'm reading those stats correctly).

Personally, I would probably go with a roof-rack & some 5 gal cans over swapping out the engine...but that's just me.

KBB has NO idea when it comes to vehicles that are nearing collector car status. There are certainly some that are worth 8k. there are others that would be overpaying at 4k. These are so old now that there's a LOT of variation between examples--because of multiple owners.

As far as sliders/brush guard--plenty have done it. Jo's is probably the gold-standard, imho. Keep in mind that any change to the rear end gear ratio is going to worsen fuel economy--but it is quite popular of a swap.

[Thelgord]

I plan to keep the gears stock, and the tire size, maybe go to a 31" maybe, but mostly the same size.

[Thelgord]

Oh, and the diesel will give me much better fuel economy when towing. Something I actually do fairly regularly.

Not sure if you have driven a small turbo diesel off-road, in my experience they far outclass petrol engines, especially on technical obstacles.

[WormGod]

Gotcha. Went back and looked at your original thread. On the same page now. :)

You have lots of drive and determination, not to mention project plans. Admirable. Sadly, it sounds like mine would be out of your price range and probably too far away. I've been keeping my eyes out for a very driven purchaser who could baby the hell out of mine, but I don't openly advertise, heh.

[Thelgord]

I am actually negotiating with a seller as I type this. Car is a decent shape, except the tranny started to slip so he parked it. Got him down to 1800. Body and motor are in good shape, but it will have to trailered from Virginia. Waiting on the call back from the bank. Should be another couple hours. Most tranny slips are caused by fluid/filter issues, so there is a good chance no major damage has been done to it. Even if there is, a rebuild kit is under $300.

[Thelgord]

The paint should be in good condition. It was vinyl wrapped some god awful carbon fiber pattern. As long as the paint was good when he wrapped it, should still be in good shape. In theory anyway.

[Thelgord]

I should probably note that this VX is going to be a small mountain of work. I know it is. It is 18 years old, has a slipping transmission, interior needs a complete make over, and who knows what else. That is even before I start the transformation.

Fortunately I know my way around a tool box, I can weld (even sheet metal), I am satellite technician so wiring/electronics is no issue (though I don't yet know enough specifics about the VX), and, probably most importantly, I have a vision for what I want this to be and a plan to get it there.

[Y33TREKker]

As for Masters tickets, I actually hate master week. Jams up traffic all over town. Most locals treat it like a blizzard. Stock up on supplies and only go out when absolutely necessary LOL!
I hear that. I just happen to live in a part of the country that's going to offer optimum viewing for this years total solar eclipse.

Most surrounding towns have been planning festivals/viewings for the last couple of years for people visiting for the event from different parts of the country/world.

I'll likely just drive out in the middle of the country and find a nice isolated spot, I just hope I don't wake up that day and find a bunch of "new" tents in my back yard.

As far as the Masters tickets go, I'd be willing to fight the crowds once anyway if I had the opportunity. After that, I'd likely just go back to watching it on tv. I say that because of the Indy 500 experience I had a few years back. My brother won free tickets, so we went...and the crowds/drunks SUCKED! Never again. You get better, more complete views and descriptions of the relevant action on tv anyway...although admittedly...as far as the Indy 500 goes, it could have just been the associated demographics, because we also went to Indy for the first US Formula One race in 2000 and it was an ENTIRELY different atmosphere.

I'm serious about Masters tickets though. If you or anyone you know in Augusta acquires tickets in the future and either can't or have no interest in going, I'd appreciate you keeping me in mind.

[Thelgord]

I did it! After a 7 hour drive (thank you North Carolina for the 20+ mile stretch of construction) I purchased my first VX, #0209! I then had to trailer it back to Georgia, and did it all in just under 22 hours. Talk about a long day! Totally worth it. I didn't drive the whole thing solo, my wife and switched out and we napped along the way.

It has a few issues, some could be a problem.


Still has original shocks from 1999. Those need to get replaced.
No stereo, or speakers, or speaker wire that I can see.
Wiring seems functional, but is a complete train wreck to look at, so mostly mostly just clean up there.
Front driver fender is going to need replaced. It is intact, just has a 2 foot long crush dent down the top that I am fairly certain I cannot repair. There is one spot were the metal creased, so I am not sure a shop couldn't do it without quite a bit of bondo work either.
Transmision (reason I had to trailer it). There is enough issues that I will probably need to create it's own thread. Grinding noise when engaging from park. 1st gear slips. Honestly, sounds very dry. I will drop the pans, change the gaskets, filter and fluids, and put some Lucas treatment in at and see if that works before getting a rebuild kit.


It is however, mostly rust free and the engine seems strong with little smoke (a little is expected after sitting for a few months). Just surface rust on the underside that I can clean up with some time and elbow grease. The steering is also strait and has decent tires, but they are unmatched. The little I did work the transmission (loading and unloading from the trailer) the TOD did engage, so that seems to be working well.

I got it for only $1800! Well, $2150 if you add the trailer and gas to go get it, but still! I think I got a great deal, even if I do end up getting the transmission rebuilt. Let the games begin! Hehehehe.

As for master tickets, if I should come across some (it has happened before) I will post here on forums before I give the next ones away. Last year I ended up with four that I gave away.

[PK]

Congratulations on your purchase.
Don't write the original shocks off just due to age. I still have the originals on my 1997 VX. 150k on the clock.
Test them for rebound etc, and if they are bad have them rebuilt. There are no after market ones that give the same stiff ride which is necessary to get the road handling that makes the VX so much fun to drive.


PK

[Thelgord]

Thanks!

Just spent the day trying to remove the carbon fiber wrap. What a PITA! It should have come off a long time ago. Now it is just brittle and keeps breaking into tiny pieces. It's like disassembling a puzzle one piece at a time, after it was glued to a table. The hair dry helps, but it is still too brittle to take off in large pieces. I did get the drivers door, drivers rear quarter panel, and rear door done before it got dark though. The paint ... well it need a paint job. I can see why it was wrapped now that I am removing it.

[Thelgord]

Oh! BTW! Cool story on the way home with the VX. I had it on the trailer and my wife and I had stopped at a truck stop in NC to let the dogs out and get some drinks. There were a group of 8-10 younger people, probably 16-19 years old, and there gathering of 6 jeeps. When they left, one of the jeepers and his (i assume) girlfriend pulled around instead of heading out with the rest and did a slow drive by of the VX. The girl was yelling at him to stop so he did. I just let them gawk at it as they didn't stay but a few moments, but I think she may have found something she wanted in her future.

The also begs the question, did I buy a chick car? LOL!

[bartmanS4]

Congrats on the buy! The first taste is free as they say.
My VX was a basket case when I first got it too. I had a plan though and the first things I did was to swap to a 5 speed since the trans was slipping but I kept TOD which makes a very nice combo. Put on some 31 inch tires. Third and fourth I pulled all the cladding off, had it Line-x'd and the body painted. At this point I had a reasonably "Kick ***" ride. And I paid almost double what you did as an entry fee so good on you! Let the mods begin, Lady and Gentlemen open your wallets!

[Thelgord]

Wait ... what? You can have a manual AND TOD? Now that sounds amazing!

[bartmanS4]

It is m'Man it is.

[bartmanS4]

Here's a good place to start:
http://www.vehicross.info/showthread.php/21729-VT_Maverick-s-5-Speed-Swap?highlight=buffy+ar5

[Thelgord]

That looks like a mountain of work! LOL! Unfortunately not in the budget at the moment. But now that I know it CAN be done ... ;)

[ipd]

I would recommend line-x as well. Might as well if your paint is already trashed. It's on my bucket list of stuff I want done...but just not in the cards for me yet.

Stereo ripped out = you get to go hog-wild on what you want to replace. :)

Good luck. You should have posted before pics so we can see progress.

[Thelgord]

I have the pics from the Craig's List ad, they are accurate, but they are on my computer at work. As soon the long weekend is over I will upload them to Dropbox so I can get them from my PC at home. I have also started taking more pictures as I work on the vehicle, though I didn't take any of working on the transmission.

Speaking of the transmission, I dropped both pans and changed the gaskets (serious PITA), added around 7 quarts of full synthetic ATF, and a quart of the "Lucas Oil ATF Magic Wonder Concoction"! LOL! Seriously, this stuff is amazing. When I drained the main pan, less than 4 oz. of black fluid came out. I got a few more ounces when I dropped the pan, but it was basically dry. When I dropped the sump pan nearly the same story, about 1/3 of a quart of thick black stuff. No wonder the transmission was slipping! LOL! Transmission now shifts like a dream! Spent a total of just under $250 on supplies, but $120 of that was a new group 27 battery. The original (group 24 that I think was too small for the VX at only 650CCA) would not hold a charge no matter how hard I tried.

Took it around the block to test drive it hehehe. Without plates! There are only two cops in my town (small town) and they watch Main Street for people passing through to give them a speeding ticket. They followed both me and my wife to the house a few times, but I think they know we live here now and they leave us alone for the most part. Don't really come into the neighborhood unless someone calls, which is very rare. I will be going to the county tomorrow to change the title and get plates.

So much done, so much more to do...

[Thelgord]

So, I started a build thread to keep track of everything.

http://www.vehicross.info/showthread.php/27679-Project-VXOverLand