Motor... Rebuild or replace?

[coachreed]

OK, from my previous thread, you should know that there is question of the fate of motor in my beloved VX... IF (and I'm not too sure its a BIG "if") the warranty company doesn't cover the motor... what does anyone suggest?

First off, its been a long time, but I have experience with popping motors out and rebuilding them... so I have the experience and the tools to do so. I'm sure there may be some added intricacies (sp?) to the VX motor over an old V8, but I have not doubt I can do it.

One question is, should I tare it down and THEN access my situation as to whether or not to rebuild it? Turn the crank and get the correct size bearings? Or will this be too weak? Should I just find a new short-block and swap that part? Or should I find a complete long-block? Should I go to a autoparts store to find the motor? Should I go to a dealer? If a dealer is the way to go, should I be talking to St. Charles Isuzu? Its not right next door, but I am only like three hours from St. Louis... could drive there if the price is that much better.

I recall seeing pictures of someones VX that says 5L on the side as opposed to 3.5L... is there a 5L motor that will drop in easily? or is this some kind of custom stroked motor, or what? If I have to completely replace my motor, I'd be interested in this as well. Any info would be great!

Anyway, let me know what y'all think. I hope to hear from the dealer today on my motor situation. Thanks in advance.

TTYL!

[VX_PA]

I looked into all the things you have mentioned. You can install another engine from another manufacturer but all the work would be custom and cost around the same $5000 or more. There are no mount kits for swaps or aftermarket plates to line the tranny up. The wiring would be a another issue along with the computer system. This is uncharted territory and you'd be the first to make a path should you choose it. I bailed on the idea because I didn't have the time to invest in the research and design. If my motor would have failed in the spring or summer I might have went that road because I could ride my motorcycle all summer. I needed the VX back so I could go to work in the snow and wintery weather.

I searched online to find an engine for cheaper than I could buy from the dealer but could not find any. I don't trust a used motor from a junk yard so I had to make a decision and just go with it. I don't regret my decision to have the dealership install the new engine. I have my VX back and it runs great. Also I now have a 2 year 24,000 mile warranty on the motor, that is if Isuzu would really back it should something go wrong. That's a whole different issue I'll have to deal with when and if the time comes.

I look forward to hearing ideas from others here about this.

[coachreed]

Thanks for your reply and experience. I'm just curious if you had a complete motor (long-block) replacement or if they just did the short-block (block, crank and rods)... I guess the warranty would 2/24K miles warranty would be great, but that would only realistically last me one year... I drive about 25K miles a year... so its not much of an incentive.

I just got off the phone with St. Charles Isuzu (http://isuzu.stcharlesauto.com/frameset1.asp?LINK=Parts&MAIN=Parts_department) about a replacement motor. Here is what they gave me...

Short-block... MSRP $4216... my price $3583
Long-block... MSRP $5163... my price $4389

The motor could be drop shipped to my door for those prices. Of course, then I have to find a way to dispose of a boat anchor when I'm done... not sure that there are any/many useful parts on the original motor at this point... especially if I go with the short-block route. I guess I'll wait and see what the dealer and warranty company say.

I look forward to hearing more... ASAP!

TTYL!

Coach

[VX_PA]

My new engine came complete. Meaning that it had the head and new valve covers already on it. They had to re-use my intake, exhaust manifolds, alternator, air cond. comp., fan, and wiring. Oh yeah, it even came with a new oil pan. That seemed pretty complete to me. I still have to pick my old engine up from the dealership, I kept it in case there may be any usable parts from it.

[mrtew]

Originally posted by coachreed
I recall seeing pictures of someones VX that says 5L on the side as opposed to 3.5L... is there a 5L motor that will drop in easily? or is this some kind of custom stroked motor, or what?

In case you haven't figured out the answer to that question yet, all they did is partially debadge the side of their car by taking the 3 and the 'point' off. The quickest easiest way to 'soup up' your VX!

Sorry to hear about your engine problem. I am sure that everyone reading this is having one of those "There but for the grace of God go I" moments. I sure hope that Isuzu end up coming thru for you. Stories like your could really end up turning a lot of Isuzu's most fanatical customers against them. It's becoming more and more common here to see people that love the VX but not it's parent company.

[VX_PA]

Coach,

Here's the link about my engine failure. I don't know if it will help or not.

http://www.vehicross.info/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2465

[AREA 51]

What to do with your old engine-

Have it rebuilt as a spare or sellable replacement for someone else, if it's not damaged beyond repair. All the parts are already there, only costs are machining, gaskets/seals and labor.

Sell the good parts off of it.

or

Take that mass of aluminum to your friendly local recycler for $$$.

[johnnyapollo]

How about sticking an Isuzu Turbo Diesel in there?

You'll need to rearrange the turbo intercoolers a bit, but I've heard of Trooper owners who have done something similar. You'll lose top end and gain more torque than you'll probably ever need, but think of the rock crawler you could build. I wouldn't recommend you going through the trouble unless you use the VX as an off-road rig (probably not worth it as a daily driver).

Just mentioning the possibility. This type of project is not for the faint of heart (Joe Black was the first to talk to me about this).

-- John

[tiggergreen]

Do us all a favor and get the new direct-injection engine for the Axiom. If all goes well, the rest of us will know that we have that possibility open to us.

;Dp; ;Dp; ;Dp;

Brent
www.xanderstudios.com

[AlaskaVX]

Originally posted by tiggergreen
Do us all a favor and get the new direct-injection engine for the Axiom. If all goes well, the rest of us will know that we have that possibility open to us.
:thumbup: exactly what I was going to say! Is the only other thing that needed to be changed the computer?

[AREA 51]

Isn't that a drive by wire throttle setup?

[VX_PA]

Yes it is a drive by wire set-up. And that wouldn't be a cheap upgrade. Not a bad upgrade but kinda expensive.

[coachreed]

Well, the removal of the "3." to make "5L" seems kinda rice to me... but whatever... I think it would be kick butt to get more motor in here. The other two suggestions sounded great... not that I'm familiar with the direct injected motor from the Axiom, but I'm sure it has to be good. The Turbo-Diesel would be AWSOME in my opinion. It would be possible to keep the gearing stock, add bigger tires and still have the power (or should I say torque) to turn them easily. I would have to question the ability of the tranny to handle this though. What tranny are they using with the TD? I would be intersted in knowing more if ya have it... I'll go check around and see what I can find. Thanks for the input guys.

TTYL!

[Joe_Black]

INTERCOOLED TURBO DIESEL! Yeah, Baby! Yeah!

Lots of options from Isuzu, the best diesel in the world. I believe you can get the 4.3L in there, plus there's no computer to sweat in the install. Best of all, not only are they on eBay regulary, you can get 'em from just about anywhere as it's the same variety of engines in Isuzu's NPR heavy-truck line.

Otherwise, if you're comfortable with rebuilding that's always the better and most economical way to go. Think about it: You isolate the failure point and replace with OEM or better components. At this point, depending upon the extent of the tear-down, you have the option to do performance enhancing maintenance. Everything from porting work to all-out blueprinting, you name it. The only down side is time. If you've got it, then great. If not, well, that short block looks better right away.

[AlaskaVX]

What kind of work is required to turn the VX into a turbo diesel? This would definately be the ideal setup for offroad! I would be driving out to the Knik glacier a hell of a lot if I had a diesel. Its just that some of those creeks will scare the hell out of ya, diesel...... no problem

[psychos2]

the dealer just saying the bearing was bad, and that was the cause is B.S.! the bearing failed because there is something else wrong. if it was because the bearing is bad then the other five bearings would have failed too.and the fact that it is #1 99% rules out bad bearings.you would also think weak oil pump? but from what i saw on the cd manual the oil pump is in the front ,which would mean the front bearings are oiled first.could be a lean cylinder causing detonation ,causing the bearing to be pounded to death? and another question is why are some failing and not others?i think isuzu has the answers.maybe andy from isuzu can shed some light.one last question is are the short blocks updated ,and if they are what is updated? shawn

[coachreed]

Joe-

I don't guess you have any physical dimensions on the turbo deisel, do you? I will do some research tonight and see what I can find, but any free info I can get would be great. The TD would be ideal in MANY aspects, but again, I would question the transmissions ability to handle it as MOST TD's put out hella torque! Of course, if it can handle it, HELLA TORQUE is GREAT! You said that there's no computer involved... whay is that? Don't tell me that the TD is carb'ed... that would take lots more stuff outta the loop too! The next question would be how much of my AC stuff can be adapted to the motor... is the TD a V-6?

The warranty company told me personally that unless I find more of my receipts, they aren't even going to LOOK at it. I will be tareing things apart on Sunday after I put my son on a plane to head down to FL to visit his mother for Christmas... anyway...

If they don't cover it, I'm gonna dig deeper into the TD subject... sounds like a possibility... anyway... MORE info please?!

TTYL!

[psychos2]

is there someone in your area that has some reciepts they could copy for you? shawn

[Joe_Black]

I don't have the TD dimensions but they are available from Isuzu's corporate site. They sent me a nice info packet last lear when I was compiling info for doing this with a Trooper RS. As for the computer, diesels use mechanical injection rather than electronic, minimizing the need for a computer. I have seen some use them, but not many. Keep in mind too that the 3.1 and 4.3L TD engine are 4 cylinder so room isn't much of an issue. You'd have to get a bit creative with the turbo and intercooler plumbing, but it's very straightforward. As for accessories, just simply fab or adapt the necessary brackets and make sure your cable runs are routed properly.

There was another post on here a while back about converting to a manual 5-speed tranny and retaining TOD. That would be ideal for the TD swap.

[johnnyapollo]

Here's one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=33615&item=2450840954

-- John