My SHOCK debate

[VR4-Quest]

Here is the deal.....I love the fact that our VX's come stock with the remote res. aluminum KYB shocks and love the level of firmness (IMO the firmer the better) , but the early need for replacement and the lack of my dealers ability to diagnos the shocks as being bad is starting to fustrate me. I took my 01' in because I new the left front shock was bad (did the bounce test, was diving and bouncing way too much), to make a long story short, the dealer told me there was nothing wrong, no visible leak, etc. but then I convinced the service tech after having him do the bounce test that it needed replace (it was). Ok, no my rear end is doing the same as the front was, excessive bouncing, terrible on bumps when cornering, etc. and the dealer again says nothing is wrong and the bump test doesnt really help this time (but I know something is wrong with the shocks, I drive the truck 100 miles every day). So they said to bring it back when it gets worse, but it really sucks driving it this way.

So, even though I like the stock shocks, I have only 10,000 miles left on factory warranty and like 7 months left, and if these things are gonna fail again, I might as well get some good aftermarket replacements.

What does everyone recommend? I tried one front Rancho 9000 when my left front was bad, but the firmest 9 setting wasnt as firm as the stock shocks.

I've been looking at Bilstein 5150 shocks, the new ones with the remote res. just like out stockers, anyone have experience with them?

I'm not sure what to do, keep bugging the dealer and wasting my time, or get some replacements (but I'm not sure what will be as good)!

[Navigator]

...Do as I did, replace your own shocks and have the satisfaction of knowing the job was done right. You can get RANCHO 5000's from www.summitracing.com for around $38 each plus shipping, which isn't bad. The VX uses the same shocks as the Trooper of the same year. I chose Gabriel Ultra's, and I must say the improovement over stock is amazing.

The stock KYB's are over rated and over priced. The gradual loss in dampning ability and the rugged look lulled me into believing they were the "shizNit". They'll fail like any other shock under the right conditions. The good news is shocks are easy to replace. My advise, get a new set of shocks and replace them yourself as needed.

[AlaskaVX]

Or if your low on funds you can try to spray them with WD-40 and make it look like they really are leaking ;) :eek:

[Hotsauce]

I put in rancho 9000's almost a year ago, and already they are shot. These things just eat shocks. Might as well be a cheaper shock.

I also like the stock settings better, but on a non-rebuildable shock, its too much to spend $2k/year on stock ones.

John C.

[MZ-N10]

wow...shocks every year...god...wat do u do?
________
MARGOSHA_ (http://www.girlcamfriend.com/cam/MARGOSHA_/)

[Hotsauce]

I've been through 2 sets of stock shocks, and now my rancho's are worn. All I do is drive to work, etc. I do not go offroad.

Maybe I'm more critical than others about shock wear. I suspect most of you have worn out shocks, and just don't feel it.


John C.

[psychos2]

hotsauce, I have been saying that same thing. I have had 2 pair of front and one pair of rear shocks in about 2 years. i would not have noticed mine being bad if it was not for the roads i drive every day. and as far as the dealer knowing if the shocks are bad or good,you might as well take your car to Hooters.the dealership has no clue what so ever, at least at Hooters they may be able to tell by the number of bounces they get per bump. lol shawn

[Jolly Roger VX'er]

I noticed at about 20k miles my fronts were shot. I got dealer to replace them under warranty with no hassles. I tried to get all 4 replaced by saying they were all bad...but, they said only the fronts were leaking. Maybe the key is to push for 4 new shocks and they'll gladly cave to replace what you really need replaced..LOL.

[VX_PA]

I'm wondering if I need new shocks. I have 65,000 miles on my VX and I have never replaced them. They aren't leaking and never have. They don't bounce or even feel like they're worn out. Other than those two signs, how would I know when I need new ones? Maybe I have good shocks to make up for the bum engine I had to replace.

[Jolly Roger VX'er]

You'll know when their bad...my front end would double-triple bounce whenever you came to a hard stop. My rear shocks have 34k on them and seem fine. I kind of laugh because I swear the hardcore 4-wheelers here don't seem to have problems and the mostly on-road people like myself have to replace them.

[VX_PA]

I've noticed looking through this thread that it must be the roads. All the posts are around the same area Maryland, New York, Ohio, and Pennsylvania. It's gotta be the poor road maintanance that is killing shocks. Or maybe it's the opposite, the roads are possibly too smooth? Mine aren't bad yet and I could probably ride through fields that are better than some of the roads in South Central PA. Just trying to figure out the common link.

[joe-yamma]

Western PA roads suck too! ;eekb; The streets in Pittsburgh can wreck a car.
I thought the VX has had some extra "bounciness" lately... I guess I'll have the dealership look at them when I take it in.

Joe

[Joe_Black]

You can get rebuildable Bilstein or Fox shocks with external resevoir for less than $200 each. If you're eating 'em that often it'd be a worthwhile investment in addition to giving a stock or better ride.

[Jolly Roger VX'er]

I kind of travel a mixed bag as far as roads...my street is a dirt-road out in (the sticks...the boonies...middle of nowhere....etc.) that gets grated regularly, however, sometimes it is so bad that I think a B-52 went astray on it's way to Baghdad, Iraq and accidently carpet-bombed my road! The other roads are tar&chipped which are actually quite smooth just not healthy for windshields...dope!
And, finally...I travel the Interstates quite regularly which are in good shape.


Originally posted by joe-yamma
Western PA roads suck too! ;eekb; The streets in Pittsburgh can wreck a car.
Joe

Just rent the movie "Striking Distance" with Bruce Willis....the Police chase early in the movie where they are jumping police cars was filmed in Pittsburgh! Nuff Said!!

[joe-yamma]

Originally posted by Jolly Roger VX'er
Just rent the movie "Striking Distance" with Bruce Willis....the Police chase early in the movie where they are jumping police cars was filmed in Pittsburgh! Nuff Said!!
:D Yeah, that was a good flick! It's funny when you're familiar with Pittsburgh and you watch the chase scene... it jumps around the city big-time. The end of the chase scene is in the South Side which is about 5 mins from my house.

Joe_Black - It interesting that you mention rebuildable shocks... Wasn't somebody here on the forum looking into the possibility of getting the stock shocks rebuilt?
It seemed like a good idea to me. My motorcycle (Yamaha R1) has KYB suspension on it as well and I know there are many places that specialize in rebuilding (as well as re-valving and improving) motorcycle forks and shocks.

Joe

[Dallas4u]

Mmmm... yummy Fox shoxs. I would definitely look into those (if I was in the market).

Being somewhat of a mountain bike slave, I'm usually of the mind that you ride it till it breaks... meaning, if I get a bike and it's components are ok for what I'm doing, I'll use and abuse till they quit or break. At least you get out of them what you can, and replace only when needed.

Now, on the other hand... I do like to have the best that I can afford. So, I bike shocks are usually one of the first things I replace.

[Joe_Black]

Yeah, I recall that thread about rebuilding the stock units. Rebuilding suspension components is best left to the experienced though. I was just talking with my Dad yesterday about a guy he knows that is now blind in one eye from getting nailed in the forehead by a part that flew out of a shock he was trying to rebuild... that wasn't rebuildable. In any case, you can link to some online retailers from Bilstein's website. I found the Fox units at one of the off-road places listed there. Pretty comparable to the Bilstein units, but I'm more familiar with them than Fox. I have an old Yamaha DT400 with a DeCarbon mono-shock I bounce around from time-to-time, but my cycle passions are with my roadracing past. Kawasaki GPz Uni-Link baby! ;Do;

On the VX figure $175 for each corner to get a true performance, remote resevoir, rebuildable gas shock. That's $700 or about the price of two OEM shocks. Now figure an average of $25 each for rebuilds for a total of $100. Being better quality shocks up front may mean a bit more mileage, but either way you're looking at a max of $100 each time you'd need to do anything. That sure beats buying cheap OR expensive shock each time they wear out, plus you've got something really snazzy tucked up in the wells you know you can count (and bank) on.

Plain, simple, truth.

[joe-yamma]

I would never want to try to rebuild the shock myself, VX or motorcycle. That is definitely something that is better left to the professionals (IMHO).

I just thought that it is something that is worth looking into that might be economical (assuming that our stock shocks are rebuildable).

Joe

[Dallas4u]

These don't look bad. They aren't adjustable, but are only $99

http://www.offroadwarehouse.com/store/bilstein/5150series.png

[joe-yamma]

Originally posted by Dallas4u
These don't look bad. They aren't adjustable, but are only $99
I was just looking at those on offroadwarehouse.com last night... pretty interested option, huh?

[Andrey]

I think the extra short weelbase of VX - thats what killing 'em. I also thought the KYB are awesome for VX "performance hype" Too bad they do not last. I had front left gone at 20K or so. Was replaced under warranty. Now excessive bouncing of rear. I guess I need to take it for repairs. Thats why when i was shopping for extended warranty I got one which covered shocks :naughty:

[Heraclid]

Ok, looking at the Bilstein site's 5150 specs... anyone know off-hand what version has the proper travel and valving we'd want to put on a stock VX?

[psychos2]

i think it may be the cold. it seems to be farther north were it gets real cold in the winter. shawn

[Navigator]

...And if so, Who does rebuilds? and How much does it cost? Just curious :rolleyes:

[VR4-Quest]

Well here is an update. I took both rear shocks off to convince myself one or both were bad, and sure enough, one was. No visible leaking, but if you shock it, you can here sloshing fluid, and then it was so easy to compress and then wouldnt extend back out like the other one. Showed the dealer, and they were all searching for what to say, one service tech said, "we dont get paid to remove the shocks and inspect them". The service advise was mad that a customer had to remove the shocks to prove they were bad and ordered me 2 new rear ones.

I should be good fo a while, but I'm still going to be on the lookout for some replacements for the next time they fail.

As for the roads in Ohio, Pa, Maryland, I dont think thats the issue, rather that most owners of VX's happen to be in these locations for some reason!

[Hotsauce]

5150's are all eye/eye mount, and we need top mount threaded for fronts.

Also, the rod comes out of the wrong end of the shock for out firment, so you couldn't just cut it off and thread a longer one. Bilstein appears to have tried to put the heavy part of the shock on the frame to reduce unsprung weight.

Turning the shock over would cause the fluid to aerate and bubble.

B46-1738 front
B46-1739 rear
These are the #'s for the Bilsteins that fit
John C.

[Joe_Black]

If you look to the remote-resevoir series in both Bilstein and Fox you'll find more options plus the ability to rebuild, all for about $50 - $75 more. As for who does the rebuilding, just check your local yellow pages or do an online search. Most suspension shops do it.

[Reg Hinnant]

Ok, HotSauce,those are the # for Trooper OEM replacements. ($60.00 ea)
Has anyone got any info on what # are there that will work in the remote-resevoir series in either or both Bilstein and Fox?
Think I'll give both company's rep's a call after the holidays to see what they say.
Any one know what valve equivlants the VX OEM would equal?
Educated guess, GramPa Bob?

[Hotsauce]

Isn't the VX the same suspension a Trooper, except for shocks and sways?

I thought all the running gear was interchangable?

Count me in if someone wants to get some custom shocks made up, but I'd want them at least as stiff on rebound as the OEM ones.

John C.

[edyavno]

Hey Nav,
I think you're the only one who went with 5000s, most people who replaced the stock shocks went with 9000s, but since I don't need adjustability, if I'm happy with what RS 5000 provides, I'm interested in them. What kind of improvement over stock are you seeing? Does it take the jaw-rattling out? If anybody compared them to RS 9000, do you know what setting does 5000 correspond to? I'm looking for a slightly softer ride, but still firm enough to remain nimble on turns.



Originally posted by Navigator
...Do as I did, replace your own shocks and have the satisfaction of knowing the job was done right. You can get RANCHO 5000's from www.summitracing.com for around $38 each plus shipping, which isn't bad. The VX uses the same shocks as the Trooper of the same year. I chose Gabriel Ultra's, and I must say the improovement over stock is amazing.

...

[Navigator]

I am currently doing a Gabriel "experiment" running on their premium heavy duty SUV shocks :eek: The original purpose was a bandaid repair while OEM or better shocks could be found. But, dayum if the ride ain't nicer!!! So nice I am replaceing the rears with Gabriels.

Granted my stock OEM shocks WERE shot to he|| (drivers side front busted with oil fully drained out and the other 3 so weak they don't bother to expand when compressed), just about anything new would be an improovement. The loss in dampning ability is so gradual with the OEM stock shocks that over the years I could'nt notice a thing until one OEM completely failed. The OEM rears have been showing their AZZ every since the fronts have been replaced. By that I mean, they act the same, but by comparison feel like crap giving into every contour of the road, with a vengance. The Gabriels give a smooth car like ride, no more bone jarring rattles. Even when I step into the VX, the feel is rock solid. Steering is nimble, the VX drives like new. Bottom line, that bucky board ride is not necessary, it's your shocks crying for attention.

I've tested these on some of the most battered streets in Baltimore A.K.A "B'MOab" :naughty:, doing my best to proove them worthy or destroy them before the 30 day no questions asked return policy is up. I must say for the money, under $120 to do all four corners, they are doing a fantastic job, the Vx glides and corners sharp as ever.

The Rancho 5000's were my choice, they'll cost you about $10 more each, and should be higher quality components and have cool red boots. I have noticed that most who got the 9000 ajustables set them to MAX anyways. I still may order a set to have on hand, none of the local parts stores had them in stock and I hate waiting for delivery of parts I need NOW.

I'll keep you all posted on how well the Gabriels hold up over time. So far, so good :luck: