Salvage Title - need advise please

[Yefim]

Was wondering if anyone has any advise on this situation.

As I mentioned, I recently bought an Infiniti for my wife and traded in her old Nissan Altima. I had a clear title for that Nissan and was not aware of any previous problems as far as I can remember. Well, the whole deal took about three days to complete and all the papers were signed. We had a new car in our possesion for another three days and suddenly my phone rings and it is a dealer and they tell me that they ran a Carfax (5 days after they originaly inspected it!!!) and it came up with a SALVAGE/REBUILT report. So they now want me to buy the car back or they will take some "legal" action. I did sign that I certify that my car is not salvage and rebuilt but I did it to the best of my knowledge and based on the clean title that I had at hand. So now I have no idea what to do... on one hand I am beeing bullied by the dealer that they will take some legal action if I don't buy the car back and my friends say "screw them, their fault for not checking" (easy for them to say) and on the other hand I am afraid since I signed that my car is clean when it turns out it is not. I bought that car about 4 years ago in a hurry... I have no idea what papers I signed for it but I do not recall seeing that it was salvaged or rebuild (not that I knew about what that means back then); all paperwork that I had was the title which was clean. Anyone can help with an advise? What are my options... :wtfr2:

Thanks

[SPAZZ]

my Fiance's sister and her sister's Fiance traded in a car and 4 days later the dealer called them up and said the car had a salvaged title from previous and they said they didn't care that her sister and her finace did not know and that they were going to take them to court unless they purchased it back.

Her sister was terrified and freaked out, but their mom said the dealer was stupid and should have found out before and researched it and it was not like they knew the car was salvaged and they were trying to dupe the dealer.......so they told the dealer to get lost and eventially the dealer stopped harrassing them.

[Dallas4u]

Just assuming here... the title is official and from the state. It said the auto had a clear title. By them (dealer) buying it from you, they are saying they know as much as YOU know about the car, with the title being passed from you to them showing a clear status.

I don't see how the fault is yours. What to do now... I don't know, but I just can't see how you would be at fault on this one.

[Yefim]

Thanks for all of your advice and this is how I feel as well.

However, my concern is that I don't have any paperwork on that car besides the title... I didn't finance it or anything. So I can not recall what I signed 4 years ago... yes, I know I should read what I sign, but at that point I did not even know what the hell that means. So to the best of my knowledge I was never aware that it had a problem... and I had an official clear title so I had no doubt that it is fine. When I asked the dealer how did it have a clear title if it was salvaged and the dealer told me "well, there is such a thing as title-washing".... well, yea... there are things like money laundering and drugs trafficking as well but I don't do them!!.

I guess I should call a lawyer and find out what I should do. My first thought was to tell them that they had three days to run this report before they signed the deal so it is not my problem now; but I do not want any legal hassle since in the long run it may cost me more money and time.

[lttlbddy]

In CA a car with a salvage title has salvage printed right across the pink slip.

If the dealer will buy back your new Infiniti, you should be happy to buy back your trade in.

I second the advice of the other consult an attorney and or the DMV to find out the scoop.

Steve G

[SGT.BATGUANO]

Try your DMV or Sec'y of State for title status verification. It may have been "washed" before you bought it.

Try a different vehicle history verification besides carfax or get a printout of their info and check it for correctness.

As you said, it was clean "to the best of your knowledge", so don't let them bully you into settling quickly.

Not certain, but if your contract included the old car, you may be able to return the infinity if you have to repurchase your old car.

An atty. might be your best resource for this matter.

[Moncha]

It really depends on the rules and regs in your state. In Colorado, a salvaged vehicle has a new state asssigned vin to replace the original factory assigned one to make tracking easier. I agree with the Sarge.. You need to discover your options and a speciallized attorney may be the best bet.

Lesson learned, never buy in hurry or impulse..

[transio]

My opinion on this matter is that if they'll "undo" the whole deal - reverse the entire transaction so that you get back the tax and title fees you had to pay for the new Infiniti, then you SHOULD do get your car back from them. You guaranteed to them in writing that the car was not salvaged. You didn't guarantee "to the best of your knowledge." They should not pay for your screw-up when you bought the car. If they will not or cannot reverse the deal, you should offer them a cash settlement to make good on the deal. Tell them that you will not buy the car back, though, because then you lose the tax advantage and have to title and insure two vehicles, and the trade-in was a condition of the purchase of their car. Do both in writing (certified mail), and explain in your letter that the trade-in of the nissan was a requirement for your purchase of the infiniti. If they reject both, or are unreasonable about the cash settlement, then let them take you to court.

Bottom line - they shouldn't have to pay for your mistake (bad title), but neither should you have to pay for theirs (botched transaction).

[Joe_Black]

As mentioned above the dealer will bully sometimes, especially if you got a better deal than they intended! ;pg; Look at it this way, and maybe present it to the dealer as well, to the best of your honest knowledge the vehicle you traded in had a clean title as certified to you, the original purchaser, by the state. I'd say the state title carries a bit more weight than CarFax, which is just a private reporting agency. It's the dealerships responsibility to verify all the pertinent info when engaging in a transaction, they're the ones licensed and regulated. You're a hapless consumer just trying to get a good product for your hard-earned buck. They want to bring legal action? Doubtful, they know they'll lose on the initial fees and then in covering yours. Best bet to put your mind at ease? Consult with your own attorney. A small investment for big peace of mind, plus the opportunity to snub the dealer. Just don't go there for service! ;Do;

[psychos2]

the paper you sign usually says "To the best of your knowledge" so if to the best of your knowledge was no , then screw the dealer.. shawn

[Dallas4u]

How long did you two have the Altima? I don't get it... the title, issued to you when you titled and registered the Nissan, after being run through the system by the DMV, came back clean. It was printed as a clean title and given to you. Your wife drove it for, I don't know how long... years maybe? You then traded it in and, somehow it has come up as "salvaged"?

I guess, somehow, someone can blame you for this... there was no way for you to know, and I would assume the dealer would have run the VIN before the trade just to make sure what they were getting, but come on! Surely there is a way out of this withOUT getting a lawyer... but even if you have to consult with one, I just don't see how the blame can be ultimately on you. In fact, couldn't YOU almost bring action against the state (or another party) for issuing you a clear title for a salvaged car?

[transio]

Originally posted by psychos2
the paper you sign usually says "To the best of your knowledge" so if to the best of your knowledge was no , then screw the dealer.. shawn Shawn,

Are you sure about that? Every legal document I've seen along these lines says something like "I guarantee that..." A guarantee is not to the best of one's knowledge. "To the best of your knowledge" wouldn't hold anyone to anything in court, because the burden is then placed on the dealer to prove that you knew about it. By simply making you guarantee a clean history, they make you liable whether you know about it or not, which is the way it should be, because they're buying the vehicle from you in good faith assuming that it's clean. They shouldn't have to pay for your ignorance.

[psychos2]

the paper is a seperate paper here in ny , like the odometer statement which says"I certify,to the best of my knowledge",etc.

first thing i would do is run a carfax report myself, and if it comes back salvaged then see a lawyer. if the dealer that sold it to you knew it was salvaged and did not tell you there would be some legal issues with them. shawn

[Yefim]

Originally posted by transio
Shawn,

Are you sure about that? Every legal document I've seen along these lines says something like "I guarantee that..." A guarantee is not to the best of one's knowledge. "To the best of your knowledge" wouldn't hold anyone to anything in court, because the burden is then placed on the dealer to prove that you knew about it. By simply making you guarantee a clean history, they make you liable whether you know about it or not, which is the way it should be, because they're buying the vehicle from you in good faith assuming that it's clean. They shouldn't have to pay for your ignorance.

Although it is certainly one way to look at it, I tend to disagree with the above. This situation is not due to my ignorance. What I had in my hand was a clear title with absolutely no indication that there is anything wrong with the car. I had a car with a clear title and this is why I signed the statement that the car is fine. It is not really “to the best of my knowledge” but rather according to an official state issued document at hand. I don't believe that anyone else would do anything differently. Are you suggesting that it was my responsibility to run the Carfax on my old car before the dealer took it? Taking into account the fact that the dealer had my VIN number three days before the transaction was completed I believe that it was the dealer's responsibility to run the carfax on the car that they are about to purchase. The manager told me that they had three previous cases like this before... this blows my mind... if something like this happened before, wouldn't you make sure that checking the car before the deal is done is the first thing you do? This has never happened to me before, so my "ignorance" can be explained as inexperience. I am not in a car selling business so I could not imagine it is possible. I learned my lesson now and it will never happen to me again. But I can not believe that the dealer did not check the car if this has happened to them before. I think the saying goes "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

With this said… the dealer did not return my repeated calls on Friday to get things straight. I left two voice messages asking to get back to me and discuss options. I will wait to hear back this week and in the mean time I will probably consult the attorney.

Thanks

[Vasha13]

I know that Carfax reports aren't always accurate. My brother-in-law purchased a used truck from a dealership that Carfax said was fine. It turns out that the truck had been totalled. My brother-in-law found the car repair shop and original owner to certify it. Maybe discuss with the attorney/dealership which document should have the highest 'belief' factor. Maybe carfax is wrong again.

[transio]

Originally posted by Yefim
This situation is not due to my ignorance. What I had in my hand was a clear title with absolutely no indication that there is anything wrong with the car. And therefore you were ignorant (lacking knowledge) of the fact that there WAS something wrong with it, right?


Are you suggesting that it was my responsibility to run the Carfax on my old car before the dealer took it? No, but you should have run a carfax before you bought it, or at some time during your ownership of it. It's your property, so it's your responsibility to know its history.


Taking into account the fact that the dealer had my VIN number three days before the transaction was completed I believe that it was the dealer's responsibility to run the carfax on the car that they are about to purchase... The manager told me that they had three previous cases like this before... this blows my mind... if something like this happened before, wouldn't you make sure that checking the car before the deal is done is the first thing you do? ... I can not believe that the dealer did not check the car if this has happened to them before. If there's no liability on their part, why would they? You signed a piece of paper guaranteeing the car is not rebuilt. They made a sale that might have otherwise fallen through. It all works out in their favor in the end.


With this said… the dealer did not return my repeated calls on Friday to get things straight. I left two voice messages asking to get back to me and discuss options. I will wait to hear back this week and in the mean time I will probably consult the attorney. If they won't work something out with you or are unreasonable in what they want, let it go to court. Meanwhile, I suggest you don't put too many miles on the new Infiniti, just in case.

[psychos2]

do you have a copy of the papers you signed? does the paper say to the best of my knowledge or i guarantee ? if you are not the original owner then they cannot guarantee anything. how is it written on the paper you signed? shawn

[Yefim]

Originally posted by psychos2
do you have a copy of the papers you signed? does the paper say to the best of my knowledge or i guarantee ? if you are not the original owner then they cannot guarantee anything. how is it written on the paper you signed? shawn

I don't have a copy of it with me at work now, but I remember very well that it did not state "to the best of my knowledge". The statement said "I guarantee....etc." I am not the first owner of that car, I bought it used. I am not sure how many owners it had before me.