VX car audio redesign & system build

[biju]

PART I

I just finished the car audio redesign & system build in my Dragon and thought I’d share the results with anybody who's interested...

My mission? I set out for more power, a better front stage, and low end that had the capability to produce both ground shaking deep bass yet sound quality (SQ) on demand. Finally, I wanted this to be presented as cleanly as possible (granted my novice skill set with car audio fabrication, etc.).

My old set-up included the following:

Alpine CDA-9835
Boston Acoustic Pro 6.5 (Front)
Boston Acoustic Pro 5.5 (Rear)
Precision Power A404
Precision Power A600
10” Kicker Solobaric

If you take a peek at my gallery you can see this old set-up. For the new configuration I added the following components:

2 – MTX 8410-44’s
Precision Power A100
Precision Power A1200
Precision Power A600
Alpine SBS-05DC DIN center channel
Optima Yellow Top

Everything in the old set-up was kept except for the Kicker and the PPI A404.

After researching various enclosure types for my subs I decided to go with the DBK10-II "Deathbox" by Decware (www.decware.com (http://www.decware.com)). So I purchased the plans online and got started on the build. As any good build starts off I gutted my baby:

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db14.jpg

The build quickly grew out of control as I held my house hostage with various ‘zones’. The backyard, living room, garage, etc., were all consumed with various ‘stages’ of the build. It was a mess for WEEKS!

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db03.jpg

The boxes weren’t too hard to build, but I did take my sweet time with them. Lots of sanding, and making sure everything was accurate and precise.

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db.jpg

I went through quite the debate with myself on what to use to finish the Deathboxes in. Carpet, vinyl, paint, etc.? I eventually decided to get them rino lined, which worked out just perfect. Very clean, strong, and tough as nails! Plus I like the look.

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db04.jpg

[biju]

The amprack on the other hand did prove to be a bit of a challenge. Making everything clean with hidden inputs, holes, assembly, etc., was a pain in the arse. It was also tricky to make sure that the amprack was securely mounted to the vehicle – however I was able to resolve that issue with some ingenuity and a few special order bolts…

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db02.jpg

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db07.jpg

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db08.jpg

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db06.jpg

I mentioned the amprack was a pain in the arse, right? Well, I should also preface that with the fact that I’m a novice at this stuff. Playing ‘installer’ proved to be a little hazardous as I lost a battle with a utility knife carpeting the amprack (ER room visit with stitches!)

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db05.jpg

Power is provided by Stinger all the way around. 0/1 gauge supply to a distributor that splits into 4 – 4 gauge power wires (placed between the DB’s). The old-skool PPI’s have standard 8 gauge inputs, so to accommodate this I bought eight 4 gauge to 8 gauge reducer adapters. They look sweet in addition to being functional.

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db09.jpg

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db10.jpg

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db11.jpg

After wiring everything I was more than happy to power her up. Gently turned up the volume 1/4 of the way and heard sweet sweet sound. (everything flat, no processing). I was pleased with what I was hearing. However, a little intimidated to turn it up until xover and tuned, etc. Played with the settings a while, and came up with settings that I felt really pushed the Deathboxes. (I was anxious to hear them both in concert pushed to the limits!). Here are the settings:

# Crossover #
[Frequency(Hz)/Slope(dB/oct)/Level(dB)]
Front:160.0/24/-1
Center:160/24/-1
Rear:160.0/24/-1
SW:63.0/24/-1

# Parametric-EQ #
[Frequency(Hz)/Level(dB)/Width(Q)]
Band1:40.0/+6/3
Band2:125.0/-3/3
Band3:1.0k/+4/3
Band4:2.5k/+5/3
Band5:8.0k/+6/3

I’ve got the ability to set six parametric configurations, as well as six xover configurations – so I’ll be playing with those more in the future to accommodate various musical genres. But for now, the above is what I went with to initially hear the system pushed. With the gains set properly I finally cranked her up! LOL, OMG, WTF?!!! PURE INSANITY!!!! There was nothing but crystal clear sound as loud as I could take her (or stand it). The sound was full, rich, deep, crisp, pleasing tones from across the spectrum. Bass tones literally blurred my vision and took my breath as the Deathboxes executed them effortlessly. A friend who came over later to watch the Nuggets game with me sat in the VehiCROSS as I cranked it up. With the same blurred vision I was experiencing he looks and tries to yell over to me, “I can feel the bass crushing my nuts!”. My labors are validated. LOL… I wanted the ability to enjoy DEEP clean bass as well as overall SQ - I’m pretty sure mission accomplished!

Here are the final pics of the build with everything installed:

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db12.jpg

http://www.bijulab.com/images/biju_db13.jpg

-biju.

[Ldub]

VERY impressive...nice clean job on the finger... :p :p :p

OH, & the system turned out good too!!!

Couldn't ya find any BIG subs ?

All kidding aside, very well done. Hope to be giving it a listen soon. :cool:

Ldub

[Locomigo]

What processors did you utilize? Trying to determine what crossover filters they employ (Linkwitz-Riley, Butterfield, etc) 24dB roll off is pretty good.

Did you RTA to find the dips n bumps to achieve your parametric EQ curve?

Curious, but decent set up, those death boxes look to be an adjustable 4th order bandpass. Do they move as built, or was that three different options for placement within the sealed portion of the enclosure?

All in all looks pretty decent. Is the dragon your wheelin rig, or the street pounder?

Hafta hook up and take a listen. Its been a few years since I was in that industry. Probably 10-12 years now. Do commercial A/V now.

[Hotsauce]

I have a single Deathbox in mine. Port pointed to the rear

http://www.decware.com/newsite/dbk10.htm

The insert is intended to slide to tune the box for the speaker you put in it. Yes, its an adjustable 4th order

Some of you at the first Mohegan Sun, or the BBQ at Bantan's place heard(felt) it play.

2 of these would be no joke.

John C.

[biju]

Thanks Scott for merging the two... I didn't think about that!!

Loco - The Dragon's my wheelin' / everyday driver rig. It's the one I'll be using for the trails at Zu. The Proton's coming with, but she's going to stay safe and sound on pavement.

Currently I'm kind of 'slumming' it by using the active crossovers built into the Alpine head unit. I plan on going with the Audiocontrol DQXS later this summer (after I recoup from the sticker shock of what I just poured into this project!)

Same situation with the parametric settings - all from the Alpine currently. Note, the parametric settings listed above were set that way to 'push' the system initially. I just wanted to get a wee bit crazy I guess and see the side walls of the VX FLEX!. The other settings I'm using (not listed) came about simply from what I can hear (spent the day tuning, listening, tuning, listening, tuning, etc.) I know what an RTA is, but not sure where to find one. I competed (once) as a young buck in IASCA in 1993, so it's been a while for me also... (I just couldn't outgrow this hobby I guess). Can I just go to a car audio shop and have them spec out my set-up so I can find those dips/bumps in the spectrum? How does that work now-a-days?...

The enclosures were very cool to build. If you poke around Decware's site, you'll see the info on the Deathboxes. They're 'tunable' to the specific driver and environment, etc. I was able to listen to the enclosures in the VX as I 'tuned' them. The design allows you to move the inner insert up and down to adjust the sealed chamber's volume, etc.) to find the best possible sound for the interior of the VX, and nature of your sub. What a great concept, huh? :)

-biju.

[Locomigo]

Excellent... I competed in Sound Q and actually judged wuite a bit in the '92-95 range. Did installs from 88-96 professionally and still do some on the side. Whether it's car, home, or business, I have the triple threat knowledge, and add to it the video, networking, computer, control systems, telecommunications, and power and I suppose that just about anything is possible with enough money, time, and creativity. >; -)~

So back to the topic at hand... I dont have a mobile based RTA, but I do have one of these in the shop and we utilize it when setting up theaters, conference rooms, board rooms, lecture halls, etc.
http://catalogs.infocommiq.com/AVCAT/images%2Fproducts%2Fdetail%2FSP295.jpg
I would imagine if you would have the ability to meet up soe evening/weekend I could gain access to the unit and we could play aroud with it, your settings, etc. It also has ability to measure SPL, polarity, and some cool little tests.

Those deathboxes are pretty sweet, much easier for a GOOD result than the MANY formulas, analysis of the vehicle, driver specs, and determining the style of box. That is always fun designing your own enclosure but a HELLUVA lot of work.

Best I ever did was 2-10s in an 8th order push/pull configuation in a second gen Probe. Before we blew the rear glass out of its seal, onto the road, we were able to hit 148dB. Powered with an old RF Power1000 amp in a 2 ohm load, bridged.

I look forward to hearing your setup, it sounds nice and Im a HUGE fan of Bostons!

[mbeach]

I have stereo envy.

[Triathlete]

So I guess we know who's supplying entertainment at the campground this year. I'm going to have to check this out when we get to Moab.
Where ya going to put your stuff?

[kpaske]

Looks like an awesome setup, Biju. I love the Line-X look on the boxes. I too never really outgrew the monster system desire, but the small VX interior really limits what you can do unless you're willing to give up your back seat and all of your cargo room.

[Ruflyf]

I feel like such a noob reading this thread, bottom line is it sounds good and thumps...and looks good too. :)

[biju]

Thanks, all. It's not a 'professional' set-up by any means, but darn good considering I'm just a hobbyist (if I do say so myself). AND, I finished the install with only 9 of 10 digits! :eek:

Hotsauce - I think you said it best... So far the two of these things have proved to be no joke indeed. I'm certain I could have gotten away with just one Deathbox and been just fine! (and by 'just fine' I mean *crazy* low end). But then again, I’m sure this is something you’ve known for a while now!

Loco - I'll have to take you up on that offer! Anything to measure, and consequently improve, the sound is fine by me. That contraption you've got has got to be better than just 'winging' it with just my ears. I wasn't going for SPL, but it would be kind of cool to see what it's at.

Billy - good question. Not sure yet. :p I'm actively (FRANTICALLY) scouring the U.S. trying to find a roof rack system of some sort. Anybody willing to part with one? I’ll pay top dollar! LOL...

Kpaske - I hear ya. I was really torn about having to make the seats disappear, but figured what the hell. This set up will last only a while until I get bored with it and want to change, or somebody wants it more than I do (a.k.a. the car audio gremlins of the world).

Ruflyf / mbeach: TAKK (Icelandic for ‘thanks’).

-biju.

[Locomigo]

Go to Rack Attack. Get you a Thule Load Warrior, and some Thule towers. I may know of a source for a load warrior.

[IndianaVX]

Biju,
sounds like an awsome system. It has been so long since ive had any power in my ride, other than factory. anyway, when i USED to mess with stereo equip, i always kept flymn and the bb's "tricycle" on hand to test the range of epuip. and its always good to have varity, when you have great sound in your vehicle. congrats on getting it all to work....lol
david
'

[thedutchguy]

Can you turn it up a little?
I still can't hear it over here! :p

[Cobrajet]

...i always kept flymn and the bb's "tricycle" on hand to test the range of epuip... Whoa, I thought I was the only one who listened to Flim & the BB's. I've got TriCycle, Big Notes, Tunnel, Neon and The Further Adventures of Flim & the BB's in my CD case. Don't listen to CD's much since installing XM radio. Small world.

[morgan-tec]

That looks very clean and tidy, job very well done. Comming from someone that installs high end audio/video you did a top rate job you should be very proud of your self.

[WormGod]

Nice, but around here, once that VX comes out of the garage, kiss your system goodbye. Around here, they even take your alarm too. My advice.... REALLY dark tint.... or leave it in a garage. ;)

[biju]

I mean, enough to the point where I don't worry much. I park in a garage at work, and at home. And when I go out shopping or to the mall I drive the Axiom...

I know it's not impervious, and the gremlins are out there, but I can't hole up and let that fear keep me from all that I enjoy...

I'm not planning on it being stolen, but I expect that I'll have to take measures to protect the VX more so than without the system - Proof that I'm not ignoring that possiblity (thus the extra insurance!).

As with all things, it's fun while it lasts.

Dark DARK DARk tint is in order, though.

-biju.

[Navigator]

Yes, that will get your ride "noticed" :smilewink. Big sound with all the components in plain view Mmmmmmmmmm :naughty:

[Ruflyf]

Biju, if you dont already have one, the 2-way alarms are very nice and the new fm ones have a nice range on them. Thats one of the first things I did was go 2-way on my alarm. I didnt get the fm versions, but I didnt really need that type of range either.

[WormGod]

Whadd'ya say Nav.... wanna take a "road trip" to Colorado? ;)

Biju, tinting from the driver passenger window would be perfect ya know. Luckily, here in MD, window tint on SUVs is more overlloked by law. Just about every wondow but the windshield and front side windows can be tinted. With the rears all tinted dark, that system is as good as stealth.... until you drive through Anacostia with the volume turned up. ;)

Nice system though. Layout is a little, odd, but the equipment sounds like it will be quite the in-car playground. My advice.... get Cinematic Orchestra's "Everyday" album. Albums like THAT are what good systems are made for. ;)

[biju]

you mean 'odd' like our VX's? :p

Hmmm....

yeah, come on down. i'll sit in my lounge chair and supervise as you try to gut my set up. :p

-biju.

[VehiX]

Nice set up, I like the work you've put in to it.

Couple of things:

1. I like your coffee table :cool:

2. Get the best damn alarm system on the market today!!!

[biju]

Got the appointment on Wednesday @ Cartoys after your concerned 'nudges'. Thanks.

Between the new alarm on Wednesday, garage, my 'little friend' (*calling tony montana*, *calling tony montana*), and the Colorado 'Make My Day' law - I think she's covered.

-biju.

p.s. - Thanks for the kudo's on the table. ;)

[Locomigo]

Got the appointment on Wednesday @ Cartoys after your concerned 'nudges'.

NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!
Not Car Toys... ;puke2; or any other chain place for that matter.

I would much rather see an independent place or something of that nature. I have heard so many stories about those chain places that would make your head spin... In general, I dont trust them.

Good luck.

[biju]

I trust my fellow boardmembers...

Where to, then? Know of a good place around these parts?
-biju.

[Locomigo]

I have heard good things about these have and used to know some of the guys. Been a while, so I dont know if they are still there:

Western Radio
278 University Boulevard, Denver, CO 80206
(303) 320-4913

Same goes for these guys:
Sbs Electronics
6201 West 44th Avenue, Wheat Ridge, CO 80033
(303) 424-7032

And a buddy got his with remote start/security system (CompuSTAR) put in in Longmont.
Perhaps here:
Accent Auto Sound & Accessories
633 Kimbark St
Longmont, CO
Phone: (303) 772-3222

I would go to any of those and that Compustar is ROCKIN! One of the best alarm packages I have ever seen.
www.compustar.com

[biju]

Keith,

(Tried to PM you, but your mailbox is full).

Just wanted to say thanks for the advice on the stereo install joints, and the heads up with Compustar. I did spend lots of time tonight comparing various brands of security systems, etc. - and Compustar did seem excellent.

In short, I just purchased one of the high-end systems from CompuStar on eBay. Among a plethora of features, (remote start, 2-way paging, etc.) it comes with a dual zone impact sensor. In addition, I purchased two additional aux. sensors (dual zone motion and tilt sensors). I canceled the date with CarToys (found other forums that confirmed your feelings on CarToys). I'll take it in to one of the joints you listed and get it installed sometime next week.

Thanks again. See you, and everybody else, in a few days...

-biju.

[Ruflyf]

Biju,

Not sure what happened with the mailbox, it says I only have 8 in there currently and it holds 50, so might have to get with admin on that one.

Grats on the alarm system I am sure you will be very happy with it, mine is audiovox, (mainly went with that because its the brand Tad had installed, so upgrading to the 2-way paging was a pretty easy install) but i am sure you'll be very happy with it as well. If its not too late, you may want to see if they offer vehicle specific wiring diagrams for it, installation isnt that bad when you have the car wiring colors and locations. And if they dont, and you would still like to install it yourself, there are websites that will sell just the car specific diagrams for $5-10.

[Bill Brown]

Thanks, all. It's not a 'professional' set-up by any means, but darn good considering I'm just a hobbyist (if I do say so myself). LIAR!!! :madr2: Just a hobbyist you claim?!? Looks like one heck of a top notch professional job in my opinion. I was most impressed by the quality of your work on this. Plus you earned a Purple Heart for getting painfully injured during installation. Glad to hear your finger was healing alright.

[Locomigo]

Keith,

(Tried to PM you, but your mailbox is full).

Interesting, it says I only have 10. Methinks we need to page Mr. WSG. :p



Just wanted to say thanks for the advice on the stereo install joints, and the heads up with Compustar. <snip> I canceled the date with CarToys (found other forums that confirmed your feelings on CarToys). I'll take it in to one of the joints you listed and get it installed sometime next week.

Thanks again. See you, and everybody else, in a few days...

-biju.

No worries. The Accent joint is the only certified CompuStar installation/service/sales within CO.
Glad you did, and definitely! I cant wait, this time two weeks from now, I will be on the road to Moab BABY!!!

[Ruflyf]

Ohh, Biju..I almost forgot, since you have the extra batteries already installed (if I remember correctly) for your system, you might consider having the alarm installer run a backup power wire to your other battery. That way if your car does get hit and they cut the battery cable under the hood, it will still function.

[biju]

The Accent joint is the only certified CompuStar installation/service/sales within CO.

Locomigo: Called the accent place several times and couldn't get anybody to answer or call me back. Strange...

I ended up going with the Western Radio reference ( no longer called Western Radio, they're now called 'speed of sound'). Glad I did - as the guy's mobile and comes out to your house to do the install. PERFECT! He'll be here on Tuesday.

Ruflyf: Sorry, but I don't have a spare yellow-top. The yellow-top is my only one! However, I do plan to upgrade alternators so maybe I'll have to do a spare batt. in parallel at the sametime? We'll see...

Bill Brown: LOL - thanks! There's no fib here, tho. I'm a professional graphic/web designer and have only 'tinkered' with this stuff since I was a young pup.

-biju.

[biju]

I'm going to use my blown amp as an excuse to go in another direction with my audio system - so I might be parting with the Deathboxes... (that was a short-lived system, eh?).

Just posting to see if there would be any interest from anybody on this site...? If so, PM me and we'll chat. (just interested in 'indications of interest' at this point).

Thx!

[nfpgasmask]

Dang dude, I can see why you haven't gotten to the windshield just yet. You wanna do my Ebony up for me??? That shiz looks tight!

Very nice indeed. I'm jealous of your mad skillz with the saw. Not so much jealous of your skillz with the utility knife though! That prolly hurt pretty bad.

:)
Bart