Any home audio geeks out there? [Text View]

biju

07/10/2006, 01:54 PM

Hello Family2.0...

Priorities, priorities... First came the car audio project, and now I'm in preparation for the home audio project. I'm a self admitted car audio hobbyist, however, when it comes to home audio, I know very little... :bgwo:

The time has come to, *eh-hem*, 'invest' in some home audio. I want a very quality set up, but not too gadgety. Meaning, I just want a tad more than the basics. Music comes first, theater comes second. My ideal components? Plasma, solid all in one A/V receiver w/ front monitors (for the music) and complementing surround sound (for movies).

The HD plasma's a check. That's outta the way. Front monitors and sub are a check also (bought the Paradigm Monitor 9's w/ PDR-12 sub). I need help/input/opinions about the surround speakers and this 'all in one' A/V receiver I seek. Anybody have any good experience in this area, or own either that they'd like to share an opinion or recommend?

SURROUND SPEAKERS
They need to be small, as the room they're going in is not that big (Paradigm didn't have smaller speakers that I thought sounded like they should...) Budget 1,000

A/V RECEIVER
I'm thinking for my budget on this one (1,200) I really liked the Yamaha RX-V2600. However, I'm just not sure if that's 'too much' for what I'm looking for... or what their reputation is as a home audio company.

Thanks in advance for any and all input...

-biju.

Triathlete

07/10/2006, 02:05 PM

Might check into in-wall type speakers for your surround...take up 0 space. Plus lend to a clean look in the room.

nater

07/10/2006, 02:55 PM

I think you should reconsider on the Plasma. Since you live at altitude, as do I, your new plasma TV will likely have a high-pitched whine when on, as well as a shorter lifespan.

LCD panels do not suffer from these issues.

Plasmas in general consume large amounts of electricity; I've heard as much as $1 per hour by some estimates.

If you are dead-set on owning a Plasma, try to find one that is designed for high altitude (rumored to exist, but I have yet to see one).

As far as Home Theater in general, a lot of folks are building Home Theater PC's to serve as their media center. No DVD player or anything, the whole system consists of a high-end TV, high end receiver, a digital cable box, and a PC in a cool case. The PC can even control the cable box as a slave over the firewire:

http://replayguide.sourceforge.net/dct6412/

As for speakers, there is no limit to how much you can spend. I have a set of polk RM6600's that cost about $1200 in 2000. They sound awesome hooked to a $200 Receiver. I also have a set of $229 JBL's downstairs hooked to a $300 Receiver that sound just as good:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=352557&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

Frankly, I bought them just to prove to my wife that they wouldn't possibly sound as good as my Polk's. I was astonished at how much I like them, and am pretty smug about the price. I ended up keeping them and am quite happy with them. Basically, speakers are a matter of personal taste. My only advice is don't pay above your own taste.

If you are looking for a multi-DVD changer, there are a few 300 and 400 DVD changers on the market, some with serial ports that can hook to your PC for awesome control over the collection.

As far as Yamaha goes, their musical instruments are world famous. (Heck, their logo is three tuning forks!). I really like their electronics as well, but I'm sure you can find a few haters out there. I for one am extremely fussy about things like an easy to use remote and menus that make sense. I think I would be quite happy with the receiver you picked out.

Nate

9tinyfingaz

07/10/2006, 03:08 PM

dont forget your "friendly associate" @ CompUsa. you find something on my website you like message me or email me and ill give you my price. Alot of margin on home entertainment. As far as a tv is concerned. love Zenith 50' magnificent and samsung 42 lcds beautiful.

iamjacksadrenalgland

07/10/2006, 04:19 PM

i never knew about the altitude issue with plasmas, of course i've lived near sea level my whole life. regardless, my next investment in a big screen will definately be DLP, rather than plasma or LCD. i've been very impressed with the new 1080p chips.

as nater said, speakers are a matter of personal taste. after a lot of auditioning i've determined that i like dynaudio's audience series for music and klipsch's reference series for theater. though i admit that it's difficult to justify spending a lot more for a marginal difference in sound quality.

your observation that the smaller speakers don't sound 'like they should' is common among the audiophile crowd and seems pretty consistent regardless of the brand or model. if it were me, i'd just stick with paradigm and live with having larger speakers. i don't like to mix speaker brands within one system.

Hotsauce

07/10/2006, 04:56 PM

Check my gallery for some serious audio stuff. I'm a hardcore 2 channel analog junky though. And it must be tubes.

This is my computer system...

http://members.aol.com/audiostorage2/CompterSystem.jpg

http://members.aol.com/audiostorage/speaker2.jpg

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/3105/medium/speaker3.JPG

John C.

MSHardeman

07/10/2006, 06:16 PM

I'll say it loud and proud....BANG & OLUFSEN!! I have a set up from 1978 that still looks better, and outperforms, anything being made today. Yeah, it's a little pricy, but WELL worth it. Go see Shea at the Cherry Creek North store, and he can educate the bejezuz out of you.
I sat in their theater room at the store and just about pee'd myself. UNBELIEVABLE sound and picture quality with the ability to blow the roof off of anything without your ears ringing. I'm listing to a pair of their headphones right now and you'd swear I was at the concert.

etlsport

07/10/2006, 06:33 PM

i love my bose speakers, i have a pair of 901 series that my dad bought in 1985, and they still sound better than any other speakers ive tried, but they only do high range natural sound, so i needed a good sub to handle lows........ moral of the story.. i love bose speakers!

for the price ive always been very impressed with JBL speakers

all of my sound processing was yamaha.. i was very happy with the sound quality, but the amp died on me in very smokey fashion (it did last 5 years) and i sold the rest, i definately like yamaha's sound... but am not so comfortable with the way the amp died (couldve been a fluke though) so my next setup more than likely not be yamaha

WyrreJ

07/10/2006, 08:17 PM

If I were putting together a new system today, I would be seriously considering the use of digital amps. They break the old rule of "you can measure the quality of an amplifier by its weight" - they are light and tiny with amazing accuracy.

In particular I suggest looking at the Panasonic series of receivers with "full digital amplifiers" - the SA-XR57 is one current model, but not much has changed from the earlier versions which may still be available at certain locations.

These units are "wolves in sheeps clothing" - Panasonic uses the digital amp technology to make them cheap instead of emphasizing their high-quality. In fact, since they market them to the "louder is better" crowd, they quote the specs like S/N and THD poorly - they overdrive the amp to get the most volume and quote the specs at that level. When you back the power off by a few watts, the sound quality measurements jump up to the neighborhood of $5000 component amps. No joke - when Panasonic shipped their first digital amp models audiophiles were going nuts over the fact that a $200 receiver could compete (not necessarily beat, but at least make a respectable showing) against $5K component amps.

There are some other receivers with full digital amps out there too, but the Panasonics are probably the best "bang for the buck" currently available. Here is one thread that talks about digital amps in general: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=417894

Locomigo

07/11/2006, 10:28 AM

Bill,

Check these out:

Arcam AVR250 - FANTASTIC, and WELL worth it. Ive installed several.
Integra DTR-7.6 - New model of a SOLID performer

Marantz SR7500 - Hard to go wrong here (rebadged Denon)
Denon AVR-3806 - Again, decent unit.

the Arcam/Integra are a little more, but worth popping for the additional capital.

For speakers, check these out:

Axiom Audio - M2i

There are so many solid performers in this range that it is hard to steer you in a direction. Also everyone's ear is slightly different.

Give me a buzz and I can give you additional information.

The plasma thing is VERY true w/altitude, and consumer units dont typically have the high altitude option. The commecial units do, but there are a bit more utilitarian in nature and oriented with BNC connections rather than RCA style.

I prefer a nice DLP to either Plasma, or LCD as you can get bigger for less with a better picture.

A nice DLP front projector/screen combo would be the way I would go, but a lot of other considerations would need to be accounted for in this area.

Curious what else you listened to prior to deciding on the Paradigm? not as though its a poor choice, but I would be happier with a matched set left to right, front to rear as the timbre is important to me, and the subs... I know of some real house shakers that still sound fantastic.

Talk to me...

VehiGAZ

07/11/2006, 11:02 AM

I thought I qualified as a "home audio geek" until I read the thread - I'm not in the same league as you guys, although I do like what I have - Yamaha CD player into a Proton D940 amp driving a pair of ESS AMT-1 speakers - the poor audiophile's home system!

Although I am keeping the audio system as is, I am also going big-screen soon. leaning toward a 50" or 60" LCD with DLP. Costco has some great deals on them right now. I will replace our much-heated Philips home theater system when I do, and was thinking of going with something from Cambridge Soundworks. Anyone have any experience with them?

nater

07/11/2006, 02:35 PM

More on plasma's at altitude.

http://www.plasmatvbuyingguide.com/plasmatv/plasmatv-altitude.html

nater

07/11/2006, 02:47 PM

A few more notes on TV's, be sure to buy 1080p with HDMI and HDCP compliance. DVI is adaptable to HDMI, but you typically lose your HDCP, and the display may go dark.

Also, if you expect to get Cable HD directly into the TV, (with no box), be sure to get CableCard 2.0, otherwise known as M-Card (multistream).

CableCard 2.0 is not yet a finalized standard, so there seems to be no point to buying a tuner in your new TV at all, unless you just want HD locals from an Antenna and nothing else (no Dish, no Cable). So, save a few hundred $ and get the "monitor only" style television; then hookup your cable or dish to that.

Nate

Hotsauce

07/11/2006, 04:10 PM

Turntable? No one plays records any more? Soo much more musical than a CD.

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/3105/medium/Wilson_Benesch_TT.JPG
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/3105/CF_Tonearm.JPG

http://members.aol.com/gtspec/krellfront.jpg

My Krells.

http://members.aol.com/jchristou/845glow.jpg
845 Single Ended Triode

http://members.aol.com/habaneroholic/cardasposts.jpg
MG20's with AG2 cables

http://members.aol.com/audiostorage2/MG20.jpg

John C.

biju

07/11/2006, 09:06 PM

I too am quite humbled by the spendy equipment peeps on this board have... (Home audio envy...).

Thanks for the replies all...

TRIATHLETE:
Great idea, but unfortunately in this particular room the couch is literally up against the wall opposite the HD Plasma. The surround separates will need to be 'aimed' towards the couch (I know it's not proper, but given the amount of space I have to deal with I dunno if I have a choice...)

NATER:
Too late on the Plasma... A friend of mine purchased the Dell HD. I was so impressed by the quality/price I had to follow suit. I too heard that at high altitude there was a 'buzzzz' sound with Plasmas, but unless my car audio system has made me deaf I simply don't have that problem. Call me lucky I guess.???

9TINYFINGAZ:
I haven't forgot! I'll need loads of accessories (cables, wires, etc.) and have your contact info in case I can't find it cheaper on fleaBay...!!

IAMJACKSADRENALGLAND:
Mmmm... Dynaudio... (Insert drool *HERE*). I only wish I could afford that kind of quality!!! I agree though, I too had a hard time trying to justify spending a LOT more for a marginal difference in sound quality. I think that's why Paradigm appealed to me. Great value, yet still 'higher quality'. I can't wait to hear these puppies in my own home!!!

HOTSAUCE:
That's stuff's insane!! If you EVER need to get rid of that turntable because, oh, say... because you just *want to*, PLEASE contact me. I'll be sure to give it the nicest of homes!!!

MSHARDEMAN:
Dooood! I love B&O! Who wouldn't? Only if I didn't have a budget... *sigh. It's funny you mentioned "Cherry Creek" as it was "Cherry Creek Audio" where I purchased the Paradigm's...!

ETLSPORT:
BOSE! I keep coming back to that brand for the small surrounds I seek - however, not too sure about their power handling? Are there any other small speakers like BOSE (quality/rep/price) that could handle more power if needed? I'm a little spooked by the smokey death of your Yamaha however, like you said it could have been a fluke. What did you end up replacing it with? (or what do you plan to replace it with?)

WYRREJ:
Good link. Thanks. I like the idea of digital amplification, and the technology sound extremely promising. Know of any good A/V receivers with digital amplifcation that offer HDMI out?

LOCOMIGO:
The Integra DTR-7.6 and Denon Denon AVR-3806 are serious contenders to the Yamaha I'm looking at. All three have pro's and con's - however, you probably nailed two of the top three on my list! Before the Para-dig-em's I did give the following brands a listen: Infinity, Axiom (a buddy bought a set of monitors), Klipsch and Polk. In the end physical size, price, and sound quality (what I thought sounded best) won out.

VEHIGAZ:
LOL... I feel ya. Everytime I step into an audio joint to 'talk shop' with the sales folk I'm always humbled by how much I *don't* know about home audio. There's just sooo much technology out there, and sooo much to keep on top of.

-biju.

etlsport

07/11/2006, 09:34 PM

ive been looking around for different components... i keep coming back to yamaha though, nothing else is really appealing to me, ive looked at a few sony units... but i despise sony car audio, so id rather not put sony audio in my home (but i loooooooove sony tvs)... so more than likely ill be going yamaha again

as for surround speakers.. ive never heard any complaints about bose power handling... a friend of mine works at a bose store and when he saw my 901s he told me about the demo they do with them....apparently they take a 220v outlet and run wires directly from the outlet to the speaker and the speaker doesnt blow!... ive got pioneer satellite speakers right now 100 watt power handling, they sound good (especially for the under $200 price tag) if i upgrade those ill be upgrading to the JBL Studio Series

Triathlete

07/11/2006, 11:31 PM

Mount them in the ceiling!

WyrreJ

07/12/2006, 02:39 AM

I like the idea of digital amplification, and the technology sound extremely promising. Know of any good A/V receivers with digital amplifcation that offer HDMI out?

The JVC's D-series (presumably the D is for 'digital') appear to have switchable HDMI, including upscaling from analog sources too. However, for the price difference, I would just buy a 3x1 or 5x1 "learning" switch and use that with the Panasonic - here's one company that sells a 5x1 for $200 -
Octava. (http://www.octavainc.com/HDMI%20switch%204port.htm) There are others too, that's just the first that came up in google.

The only technology that I see in any other receivers that is worth a damn (e.g. is not just marginally useful tech to justify releasing a new model each year) is DRC (digital room correction). Denon has licensed Audssey's MultiEqxt for their current 3xxx models and up, and Pioneer has their own MCCAC stuff which, last I checked, was not quite as sophisticated as Audssey's software.

DRC is really good stuff - it works through use of a microphone to get "a map" of the way your speakers sound in your room at the places where you sit and then it uses fancy signal processing (the better versions of DRC do more than just equalization because they take into account sound-wave cancellation and reinforcement in the time-domain) to change what comes out of the speakers so that what eventually gets to your ears is closer to the original sound. It ain't perfect, but it can make $100 speakers sound like $1000 speakers.

Early DRC equipment by companies like TacT used to cost $10K, or you had to use a PC with specialized software that is not too user friendly. But that's changing with companies like Denon and Pioneer and if I were to pay a premium for anything beyond the Panasonics, it would have to have DRC.

Another alternative is partial DRC for bass-only, most of the worst room problems are in the lower frequencies because they have longer wavelengths making interference patterns more pronounced. The cream of the crop for bass-only DRC is the Velodyne SMS-1 - here is a review of the SMS-1 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=7488316#post7488316) I myself have a jerry-rigged home-brew bass-correction system I put together long before there was anything like the SMS-1 on the market and it really does make a huge difference in the quality of the bass. The room graphs in the review are typical of the kinds of problems have with bass in their systems and it really does make an audible difference.

BOSE! I keep coming back to that brand for the small surrounds I seek - however, not too sure about their power handling? Are there any other small speakers like BOSE (quality/rep/price) that could handle more power if needed? I'm a little spooked by the smokey death of your Yamaha however, like you said it could have been a fluke. What did you end up replacing it with? (or what do you plan to replace it with?)

Bose has one of the most well-known, and well-thought of brands on the market. But that's only because they spend tons and tons of money on marketing. I'm sure you've seen more tv and print commercials for bose than for any other speakers by at least a couple of orders of magnitude - who else besides bose even advertises speaker systems on tv? No one. All that advertising costs beacoup bucks - and then there is the cost of those dedicated mall stores - that real-estate is ex-pen-sive. All those costs come out of your wallet when you buy Bose.

Because of all that wasted money, they are universally reviled by people who have gone past the "average consumer" stage of home-audio purchasing. Just read the discussions on any serious home-audio/home-theater website and you will see that Bose is everyone's favorite whipping boy. The whole "better audio through better marketing" approach really tends to piss people off when they realize how badly they've been had.

In less emotional terms - Bose is like Monster Cable - a decent quality product that is hugely over-priced. If you go with any of the less-advertised brands in the market, you will get significantly more bang for the buck. FWIW, if you want a shock, ask 9tinyfingaz how much mark-up there is on the Monster Cable products that CompUSA carries.

Locomigo

07/12/2006, 08:04 AM

Ugh... lots of information and such to digest...

Take this FWIW, I see most of this stuff all day everyday, while moreso commercially than residential. The concepts, applications, and products are similar enough.

For the receiver, while Integra, Yamaha, and Denon (list in order) are good products, The Arcam is SO much better standing heads and shoulders over the Denon, a head above the Yamaha, and a bit over the Intergra, why look further? I really think you need to go audition it and give it a run. Also I will search and see where has both products (Arcam/Integra) so you can listen back to back. not knocking Yamaha, they make a quality product, but I have seen far less issues with either Arcam or Integra. And with the Arcam, hard to argue British quality when refereced to audio.

Speakers... Those are a decent selection of entry level speakers, but going with the Paradigm, I would think you are in a level higher than what you have been looking for.
Have you ever considered B&W (http://www.bwspeakers.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/products.ranges/label/Range%20600%20Series%203)? They are incredible, and I was very pleased with how they turned out, and we outfitted a high profile client's home in Aspen with them. HIGH bang for the buck here.

How about:
JosephAudio (http://www.josephaudio.com/)? They are decent and sound good, worth a listen.
NHT (http://www.nhthifi.com/p-ht-superaudio.html)? Great sound for a lower price point.

Taking me to B&O, while not a bad product in quality, function, design it really isnt for me. Biggest reason is you can get SOOO much more for less, why bother with them.

Next up is Bose, the old monniker is VERY true "No highs, no lows, it's gotta be BOSE!"
These guys are living off a reputation buoilt in the 70s and 80s when they HAD a decent product. Not the case anymore, and much like Sony, living off a reputation from the past but have really cut corners in the mass production realm. Like B&O, WAY overpriced for what you get, not to mention the speakers are NOT effecient at ALL!
Takes way to much power to even come close to driving them anywhere near a level where they might sound good, on a day that the planets align, with the wind coming from the south east @ 10MPH, with a relative humidity of 69%, with a 20% chance of precipitation...
but I digress. These "big name vendors" that are in every mall, etc in the country have to, like the previous poster implied, pay their rent somehow and who do you think pays for it? thats right, you do.

Which brings me to Monster cable and the other interconnects that you pay 1000 times more than you need to. Ill tell ya, the raw cable, and connectors I use on a daily basis not only looks no different, it tests out no different than the monster, et all stuff. So, why pay $50 for a cable when it could be done for $5?

The in-wall stuff, while it is good for stealth looks, and you can do so in a way that it is imperceptable to the human eye. Very trick, but very expensive. There are products that exist for in wall that are aimable, and directional. For my money, I would just get some decent cup and ball mounts from either the ceiling hanging down and in, or the wall. Either way, with the ball mount, VERY easy to aim the speaker for optimal imaging.

With the plasma, it doesnt buzz right away, it develops after a few hours of use. Typically within a month of install I have been called back. Havent dealt with the Dell much, so I cant say, I suspect that they are rebadging a Samsung anyway. Which BTW, has been better than that LG/Zenith brand. Have had HUGE issues with them. What size did you end up with?

I really can go on and on, but I think I have spewed enough info for now. As with all things YMMV. I can only share what experiences and opinions gathered from those experiences.
Let me know if you need assistance or additional info.

9tinyfingaz

07/12/2006, 08:15 AM

FWIW, if you want a shock, ask 9tinyfingaz how much mark-up there is on the Monster Cable products that CompUSA carries.

50-80% mark up on monster cable 20-30% mark up on BOSE. Good thing i can give discounts huh?

WormGod

07/12/2006, 08:50 AM

Biju, with a budget like that, just get one of those full surround sound kits. They usually come with at least a 5.1DD/DTS reciever, a dvd player, and a full 6 speaker set. I have seen some pretty decent ones at even Best Buy. It is in my nature to knock those kind of kits since my audio/visual setup at home runs about $18k in total, but I have a buddy who spent $900 of a Yamaha kit at Best Buy and he grabbed a 40" LG LCD tellie for about $1400, and it nearly rivals mine! Simply amazing stuff out there that you DONT have to pay a lot for. Just keep that in mind.

I am thinking of giving my mom my 48" Mistubishi HD widescreen since her tv just popped and getting myself a 65" plasma finally. Can get my hands on one under $4k finally so it may be a fun purchase.

BTW, just to get the geek factor going strong.... we are having a custom 16 FOOT digital widescreen put in at work. Along with a 160 person theater seating for it. Isnt supposed to be ready until Xmas-next year, but man, if that isnt incentive to WANT to stay and work late nights, heh.

TechnoPope

07/12/2006, 08:54 AM

While not perfect, here is an option that might work in your situation:

http://www.yamaha.com/yec/YSP1/idx_ysp1000.htm

Locomigo

07/12/2006, 09:16 AM

BTW, just to get the geek factor going strong.... we are having a custom 16 FOOT digital widescreen put in at work. Along with a 160 person theater seating for it. Isnt supposed to be ready until Xmas-next year, but man, if that isnt incentive to WANT to stay and work late nights, heh.

Yep, we installed a 25 FOOT (22'x11.5') HD front projection set up last year at Denali National Park for 150 seat theater.

That was AWESOME, and the HD player source we utilized was sweet. Fully automated with the black out shades, lights, start/stop, narration etc.

Crestron is your friend. That had about 15,000 Watts of power. Couple 15" driver towers for the L/R with a matched center. 10" drivers for the surrounds (12 in all), and dual 18" subs.

During testing we hit 145dB in the center of the seating area. It was loud, they are not even utilizing 30% of the available headroom on the system. The projector was pretty kickass, we had to turn it to 50% lamp power (dual lamp @ low poer setting).

Fun stuff we play with...

Tobert

07/12/2006, 12:15 PM

BTW, just to get the geek factor going strong.... we are having a custom 16 FOOT digital widescreen put in at work. Along with a 160 person theater seating for it. Isnt supposed to be ready until Xmas-next year, but man, if that isnt incentive to WANT to stay and work late nights, heh.

I had a lot of fun helping design and install a 3x2 Clarity DLP wall at my current employer's campus for the IT command center. They got screwed on the video controller and ended up going with a PC with 3 Nvidia Quattro's instead. It would be great for video nights but they got weird about the idea and wouldn't let me set all the gear up. Oh well. Maybe I'll finish designing my controller idea anyways ;)

There's some cool technology in that space if you're willing to deal with the bezels. It's only really useful in a commercial setting though.

Locomigo

07/12/2006, 12:25 PM

I had a lot of fun helping design and install a 3x2 Clarity DLP wall at my current employer's campus for the IT command center. They got screwed on the video controller and ended up going with a PC with 3 Nvidia Quattro's instead. It would be great for video nights but they got weird about the idea and wouldn't let me set all the gear up. Oh well. Maybe I'll finish designing my controller idea anyways ;)

There's some cool technology in that space if you're willing to deal with the bezels. It's only really useful in a commercial setting though.

What controller were they trying to use?
While the solution you ended up with isnt bad, it just has some limitations that a standard controller would not.

Did a 4x8 matrix wall a while back and that was pretty cool, albeit a lot of work 50" cubes, Yeah a full image was insane!

But anyway, we are getting off track, where IS Bill anyway? :p

Tobert

07/12/2006, 02:02 PM

What controller were they trying to use?

It was a Jupiter 950 somebody got off the back of a truck, as far as I can tell. We even bought a warranty and had it to Jupiter and back and it STILL didn't work. Junk. I hear their more modern stuff is better, but I wouldn't buy another product from them.

While the solution you ended up with isnt bad, it just has some limitations that a standard controller would not.

Yeah, I know. I wanted to build something much more sophisticated (could handle full-screen video and arbitrary partitioning/positioning), but it would have taken me a couple months to build from scratch. Still, it would be MUCH cheaper to build than even the low-end controllers on the market cost.

Did a 4x8 matrix wall a while back and that was pretty cool, albeit a lot of work 50" cubes, Yeah a full image was insane!

I'm envious. This is just a medium-size company that was already over budget on the system. It'd be fun to work with a fully tricked out system.

But anyway, we are getting off track, where IS Bill anyway? :p

Locomigo

07/12/2006, 02:24 PM

It was a Jupiter 950 somebody got off the back of a truck, as far as I can tell. We even bought a warranty and had it to Jupiter and back and it STILL didn't work. Junk. I hear their more modern stuff is better, but I wouldn't buy another product from them.

The Jupiters are the controller of choice for us, although Christie isnt a bad choice.

For the Jupiter, we have only had one out of 150+ that we've put in flake on us.
I am pretty happy with them and their support they provide.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand, waiting for Bill to reply to some of the questions. etc I through out there.

I dont claim to be the be all end all to this stuff, but between car, residential and commercial, I have been in A/V for a long time and seen a lot of different things. Happy to help anyone.

biju

07/12/2006, 02:39 PM

Hey fam:

Just haven't had the time today at the salt mine to respond. I'm crazy busy today... I'll be on tonight tho. Sounds like a good opportunity to use the chat room?!!!

-biju.

Locomigo

07/12/2006, 03:55 PM

nope.. wont be around....

biju

07/13/2006, 07:52 AM

Arcam offerings looks excellent, but extremely expensive!! If I went that route, I'd have to nix the surround speakers all together just to afford one of their receivers. I don't wanna do that...

Remember, I'm going for 'dabbling' in higher end (yet affordable) components.

All in all I have/had 4k to purchase a receiver, cd player, front stage (monitors & center), subwoofer, surrounds, accessories. The Arcam receiver that offered HDMI output is being offered at $2999. Way too much for my situation.

After seeing that, I went ahead and purchased the Yamaha RX-V2600 (http://www.yamaha.com/yec/products/productdetail.html?CNTID=200003&CTID=5000300&ATRID=1020&DETYP=ATTRIBUTE) just last night. Got a good deal on it ($950 which includes an extended 3yr warranty). After the monitor/sub set up I picked up (roughly $1400), I'm left with roughly $1,650 to purchase the surrounds, CD player, and accessories... (I already have a solid Samsung DVD player w/ HDMI upconversion, etc.)

Can it be done?

-biju.

MZ-N10

07/13/2006, 11:41 AM

this really doestn add anything to teh original topic but since so many ppl want new tvs, theres a panasonic 56" DLP lcd projector at frys for 1499. not sure how good it is but i picked one up for my parents

TechnoPope

07/13/2006, 02:09 PM

A good cd player!!?
http://www.highdefforum.com/showthread.php?t=25018

Locomigo

07/13/2006, 03:01 PM

Good luck with the Yamaha. I hope it lasts.

Yes, Arcam is pricy, but the HDMI... well I just dont know that is the be all end all, and I perfectly happy going optical/coaxial on the audio and component on video. With that situation, the Arcam model I referenced would have worked out for you. Not to mention that I do have a LOT of connections and may have been able to work something out for ya.

No worries though. I am sure the Yamaha will be an acceptable choice, not the one I would have selected due to quality issues i have experienced, but not bad.

You shouldnt have any issue getting surrounds, CD Player (do you really need one? Does the DVD player not function appropriately? :P), and accessories (read my previous post RE: cables. if you pay for monster, even with the homeboy hookup, you need your head examined. If you want to just throw money away, I will gladly accept it. :D)

Good luck.

BTW, you freakin guys ever gonna come out wheelin or what???? :confused: :cool:

Sorry, I am in a bit of a cantankerous mood today.

biju

07/13/2006, 04:01 PM

So for anybody paying attention, if you have anything less than the Yamaha RX-V2600 for a receiver you have equipment that's 'unacceptable'. LOL... :rollo:

Just jarin' with ya...

Good point. The Samsung could pull double duty as the CD player. Never really gave that any thought until now... strange. If that's the case, then I'd like to use the money saved for an upgraded sub. The PDR-12 is Paradigm's bottom of the line sub... And I do love me some crisp, clean, low bass...! :razo2: Have any good hookups for Paradigm? Preferably the PW-2100! If you do, then I'll talk to the rep about a return as it's (the pdr) still brand new in the box~!

-biju.

etlsport

07/13/2006, 04:10 PM

i put low powered (25w) bass shakers in all the couches in my living room.. doesnt add any sound, but you really feel the movies, i love it! it was cheap too, i think 40 bucks/ sofa (2 in each)... thatll help out with your 'low end' sub haha

Andrey

07/13/2006, 04:30 PM

Well, I am having setup for several years Sony pre-amp and amp TAN9000ES and TAE9000ES, 9000ED DVD player, NEC 50MP1 plasma, 2 PV-HD1000 hdtv d-vhs vcrs, TU-DST50/51 hdtv tuners. Bose acoustimass 10 III. JVC 30000 d-vhs vcr. I am very happy with everything I have... I just need more time to enjoy it as for the most of its life it was sitting not doing anything :)

PS check out avsforum.com lotsa good advice and knowledge there.....

Locomigo

07/13/2006, 05:49 PM

So for anybody paying attention, if you have anything less than the Yamaha RX-V2600 for a receiver you have equipment that's 'unacceptable'. LOL... :rollo:

-biju.

You got it. Anything else (not at that 'minimum standard') SUCKS! >; -)~

Um, not sure, I will have to look and see about Paradigm, but in the meantime check out.

www.velodyne.com
Freakin AMAZING subwoofers that ROCK! Only thing I like ALMOST as much as B&W speakers...and Arcam receivers.
DLS-4000R is a great choice.
VRP-1200 is not bad.
DPS-12 is somewhat better.

If money were no object, the DD-12 is the BOMB!

www.sunfire.com are also great subs but pricey!

For the surrounds, did you look at the:
Boston Acoustics - VR-MX?
EAW (Eastern Acoustic Works)?
KEF Audio?
Wharfedale?

Some of these came to mind after the other recommendations I provided.

Hotsauce

07/13/2006, 06:43 PM

The rest of the main system:

http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1152837358.jpg

Tweaked Wadia 20, my CD transport.
http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1152837433.jpg

Audio Note 3.1X signature DA Canverter

http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1152837541.jpg

Canary dual mono preamp.

http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/i/f/1152837659.jpg

Marchand tubed active crossover.

Magnum Dynalab MD-102 tuner

Sunfire Signature sub

Several RGPC power conditioners

Lots of silly wires.

John C.

WyrreJ

07/13/2006, 09:35 PM

Bass Shakers are AWESOME. Nothing special for music, but for movies they are great - especially if you live in a condo/apartment/duplex instead of a detached because you will get to really feel the bass in those scenes with explosions and dinosaur stomps but your neighbors will never even notice.

You can buy them from here: http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=299-028

You will need an amp to drive them, but no need for anything fancy, just get the cheapest thing you can find that has enough juice.

Meanwhile don't bother even looking at a Paradigm sub. Unlike speakers - where you want them all to be from the same "family" so that you get atleast semi-consistent timbre across all of them (particularly noticeable in pans) - subs don't share many frequencies in common with regular speakers so there is no issue of timbre matching.

For subs it is always best to go with companies that specialize in sub-woofers - the speaker companies usually treat their sub-woofers as a check-list item so that consumers can "feel good" that they bought all dem noise-makers from the same company. Some brands with a reputation for good bang-for-the-buck are Hsu, Velodyne and SVS.

WormGod

07/14/2006, 08:37 AM

Not to go off note, but simply to plug some zesty Pioneer video info....

http://news.teamxbox.com/xbox/11363/Pioneer-50-1080p-Plasma-Arrives-at-Retailers-Nationwide/

Pretty slick.... yet pricey.

AnalogVX

07/16/2006, 07:26 PM

Damn Hotsuace, you got me drooling! Dared has some really nice stuff. I like my VP-16 integrated, but it has devoloped a hum in the left channel :( So I am forced to have to listen to my Marantz 8B. Oh the agony!

biju

07/21/2006, 07:07 AM

Hey fam2.0. Got an update. I did some reswizzling of funds, some further 'pondering' as to what I should do regarding surrounds - and here's what I came up with. I've decided to hold off on the surrounds until I'm absolutely certain the brand/model is what I want. There are some really good brands mentioned above, and until I can demo/hear them in person, I don't think I can make an informed decision quite yet. Kind of like when I heard the Monitor 9's - I knew without a doubt those were going to be the anchors to my front stage!! I want that same feeling when I decide to purchase surrounds...

So with that said, here's a breakdown thus far:

Dell 42" HD Plasma = Check.
Yamaha RX-V2600 = Check.
Paradigm Monitor 9 = Check.
Samsung DVD-HD860 = Check.
Paradigm PW-2100 (Upgraded from the PDR-12) = Check.
NAD C521BEE (http://www.nadelectronics.com/cd_players/C521BEE_framset.htm) CD Player = Check.

There's a new addition to the list - that being the NAD CD player. I decided that the DVD player would probably suffice pulling double duty, but went for a dedicated unit that had better technology specifically intended for CD's.

Now for the monkey wrench!! (LOL - I said 'monkey'...) I've got a modest LP collection I started with 45's & 33.3's. The collection contains everything from old school Petshop Boys to Mogwai. I began the collection back when I inherited a cheap Pioneer setup from my grandfather who passed (the system is long gone/broke). Since I'm putting off the surrounds, maybe I could snatch up a decent turntable? By decent I mean under $400. Here are the brands I came up with:

Music Hall (http://www.musichallaudio.com/)
Pro-Ject (http://project-audio.com/main.php?list=turntables&cat=turntables&lang=en)
Goldring (http://www.goldring.co.uk/)

Anybody have an opinion/experience with these particular brands when it comes to vinyl? Or, better yet, know of another quality brand that has a table under $400?

-biju.

WyrreJ

07/21/2006, 11:29 AM

Can you hear the difference in vinyl versus a CD? With your level of equipment, I would not expect you to be able to discern an improvement. In which case you would probably be better off skipping the turntable and spending the money on rebuying the CD versions.

Plus, a lot of classic albums have had new releases on CD recently that were completely remastered. Even if you can hear the difference between vinyl and CD, the remastered versions often blow away the original releases regardless of medium.

Hotsauce

07/21/2006, 10:43 PM

Vinyl is the original high definition format. Digital symply doesn't have the dynamic range that a record does. Digital is a jagged edge that approximates an analog waveform. It doesn't have the secondary harmonics that a real analog recording has.

Its the same difference between a poor quality MP3 recording and a CD, ecxept a record doesn't have a sampling rate, its a real analog waveform.

Biju: I think the choice of turntable wil not be as much difference as the cart you use on it, and those 2 not as signifigant as what phono pre you use. A $20 garage sale turntable and a tubed phono stage will kill $1000 table/cart combo fed into a solid state pre.

Remastered usually means ruined. In most cases there is less background noise, but all dynamics are gone because of the compression used to supress noise. The wort 2 examples I can think of are Billy Joel - Glass Houses, and Jethro Tull - Aqualung. probably the worst 2 CD's ever made vs the record.

This link may help you understand.

http://www.xanga.com/sonickGQ/501878133/item.html

John C.

WyrreJ

07/22/2006, 02:05 AM

You are talking about first gen masterings to CD which were often crap. I'm talking about double and triple dipping by the record labels where they RE-master from the original studio tapes and have FINALLY got it right. Just because a recording is on CD does not mean it must be over-compressed.

The record labels are pursuing this route because they can't sell their new artists to anyone who is not brainwashed by MTV, so in order to keep milking that market segment they keep releasing the same albums again and again. Except for artists like Jimi Hendrix who are constantly recording new tracks from beyond the grave, the only thing they can offer to convince people to rebuy CDs that they already have is with improved sound quality.

For example, just about the entire Rolling Stones catalog has been remastered (for SACD, but the same masters were used to make the CD layers on the same discs that only golden ears with solid-silver cables can distinguish from the DSD versions). Similarly most of Yes, Rush, Sabbath (Ozzy Years), Steely Dan, AC/DC, CSN(Y), Simon & Garfunkel, Dylan, etc name almost any great group from before the 80s and their stuff is getting remastered the right way. Even the Tull catalog has received a make-over, yet somehow they still can't get Aqualung right - at least not mainstream CD releases - DCC did a good job, just about indistinguishable from their vinyl edition.

So, for those albums, the difference is no longer equivalent to a poor-quality MP3 vs a CD, it is more like a high-quality MP3 - say 220Kbps VBR Joint-Stereo and the CD it was ripped from. Which is to stay, indistinguishable for 99% of the population.

And to take it one step further - there are plenty of crap-quality vinyl pressings - 'fixing' them is how boutiques like DCC and MoFi got started. Unless you've got an audiophile label pressing or an expectionally well engineered mainstream release, the correctly (re)mastered CD versions won't just equal it, it will greatly surpass it. Super-22Khz harmonics just don't mean jack when the base frequencies are lo-fi - and for those frequencies a properly mastered CD does not just approximate a waveform it exactly reproduces it. Nyquist's theorem is for all practical purposes an indisputable law of nature, just like the laws of gravity and electromagnetism.

biju

07/22/2006, 04:23 AM

People, people...!

Great info, but to be honest - my interest in vinyl might disappoint some. See, I happen to think vinyl's just 'fun'. Yes, fun. It's a good conversation piece, takes a little more involvement and, yes, it sounds good too (warmer).

Sorry for the ingnorant question Hotsauce, but what do you mean by "pre"? Also, what kind of "cart" do you recommend?

Thanks.

-biju.

Hotsauce

07/22/2006, 08:00 AM

There are 2 basic types of cartidges, not counting exotics like strain gauge carts. Moving coil, and moving magnet. I feel the MM are better on rock, and the MC show more subtle details on complex music. Until you become an audiocrackhed stick to MM carts. The music Hall TT's already come with a cart thats well matched to their arm.

Neither type of cartridge has enough output to be connected directly to the input jacks of a standard reciever or preamp. Some preamp or recievers will have a specific set of inputs marked 'phono' and they will have an additional gain stage inside.

So, what you need is a phono preamplifier to bring the low level signal up to the voltage that the inputs expect to see.

John C.

AnalogVX

07/23/2006, 06:38 PM

The record labels are pursuing this route because they can't sell their new artists to anyone who is not brainwashed by MTV, so in order to keep milking that market segment they keep releasing the same albums again and again.

The only reason the record labels aren't selling any new artists is beacuse most of them are crap. :goof: Seriously, doesn't it suck when you buy a CD and there's only one good song on it?

There are some remasters that sonund good, the Rolling Stones on SACD that you mentioned, and some that sound like crap too, Van Halen's remasters, to me, sound horrible.
I love vinyl. Yea, it's fun, yea it takes work on the set up and maintenance, but that's half the fun! As far the CD vs vinyl debate, it's all subjective. I have CDs that sound good and some bad and vinyl that sounds good and some bad.

Triathlete

07/23/2006, 08:14 PM

WyrreJ

07/23/2006, 08:30 PM

Something like 90% of all media (tv, print, movies, radio, etc) are owned by just 5 companies. The new 'artists' are crap because they are not chosen for their music - they are chosen for their cross-marketing potential. If they actually produce music worth listening too, that's just icing on the cake as far as the MAFIAA (http://www.mafiaa.org/) are concerned.

Teens are their prime market because they are highly suggestible and have lots of their parent's money to spend on high-profit-margin, disposable junk. Like ringtones - $2.50 on average for a lo-fi snippet of today's "hot" single vs $1 for a mid-fi version of the entire song. That's nucking futs, but its proof of how powerful the MAFIAA's marketing machine has become.

WyrreJ

07/23/2006, 08:42 PM

Not only that but I have quite a collection of late 70's and 80's punk that will never be available on anything but vinyl! :cool!: :naughty:
Of course most of it was on very small indi lables and was ONLY available on vinly! ;Dy;

You might be surprised at what is out on the net in the shadows. There are people with similar collections as yours who have invested the effort to "rip" the vinyl to digital formats (MP3 for the stuff like punk where fidelity is not an issue and FLAC or APE for the other stuff). Find the right community online, and you may well find that your entire collection plus stuff you never thought you'd ever find is available to download.

Of course actually downloading it is a federal crime with punishment guidelines that often exceed those for rape and murder...

biju

07/24/2006, 07:35 AM

All's well, but - back to the thread topic all...

Need input on components to my setup - specifically (now) the table. Got any?

-biju.

Triathlete

07/24/2006, 07:41 AM

When I was in Japan they have a SUPER store called Dieechis (sp?). They have an entire floor of audio. Everything from inexpensive to $50,000 mono tube amps. Anyway I remember they had these high end turntables that were mounted in 4-5 inch slabs of marble to make sure they were stable. Pretty sweet stuff. Thats also were I picked up my Nachamichi cassette deck!

WyrreJ

07/26/2006, 08:11 PM

Here's a turntable for ya: http://www.bswusa.com/proditem.asp?item=TTUSB

Hotsauce

07/27/2006, 02:43 AM

I was just about to close the link when my eye caught "USB output"

I have never seen that built into any turntable. You can't really go wrong at that price, just remember that it won't play 78's.

John C.

Hotsauce

07/04/2007, 07:07 PM

I've purchased a new place with enough room to setup a dedicated listening room, so here it is.

http://members.aol.com/jchristou/Cornertrap.jpg
Corner traps and rug added

http://www.members.aol.com/audiostorage/RadiatorCover.jpg

http://www.members.aol.com/audiostorage/RadiatorOpen.jpg
Custom radiator cover made in cherry with flipup end storage

http://members.aol.com/audiostorage/Ekornes.jpg
Couch and heavy drapes to kill reflections off rear window

http://www.members.aol.com/audiostorage/CDRack.jpg
New cd rack almost done. The whole wall behind the rack is covered in bass traps.

http://www.hawthorneaudio.com/photos/albums/userpics/10063/System.JPG
The components on 3" walnut racks

http://www.hawthorneaudio.com/photos/albums/userpics/10063/Speakers.JPG
The speakers, and more bass traps

John C.

biju

07/05/2007, 03:19 PM

a dedicated listening room? I'm green. makes my little set-up look like a jack-n-the-box pop-up toy... :yesg: :yesg:

congrats, sauce.

-biju.

JHarris1385

07/05/2007, 03:33 PM

Not as elaborate but I have a Onkyo 5.1 LS-V500C that I am very impressed with thus far. GREAT SOUND.

http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=LS-V500C&class=Systems&p=i

Killer part is I picked it up a few months ago for $142 BRAND NEW via ebay. MSRP $900.

Hotsauce

12/22/2007, 03:46 AM

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/3105/AP_Scorpio.JPG

Got myself a pair of Audio Physic Scorpio in rosenut for Xmas. These are for my HT setup in the dining room. Seen here running off an antique pair of Fisher 80AZ tubed monoblocks. Goertz AG2 cables

http://www.audiophysic.com/scorpio/index_e.html

John C.

navistar

12/22/2007, 10:25 AM

If you want some stealth go to AES Speakers. They have in-walls and their subs mount into the wall behind a cold air return grille and also mount into the floor under a floor vent.

http://www.aesspeakers.com/

If you want total stealth go to SolidDrive. These mount entirely out of sight behind the drywall in a bracket that presses the driver against the wall turning the entire wall into a speaker. It works on glass and turns the whole window into a speaker with no moving parts. It's based on US Navy sonar technology.

http://www.soliddrive.com/

If you want ultra sound quality and high price go to InductionDynamics.

http://www.inductiondynamics.com/

Ldub

12/22/2007, 11:07 AM

And for ultra stealth & ultra low price...I listen to the music inside my head.
I just wish those darned voices would STFU!:naughty:

WyrreJ

12/22/2007, 12:40 PM

And for ultra stealth & ultra low price...I listen to the music inside my head.

Sorry, that's a copyright violation. Please pay your 'protection money' to the MAFIAA. (http://mafiaa.org/)

Phantom

12/22/2007, 03:16 PM

I would definately check out these guys. For an affordable new TT its hard to beat!

http://www.musicdirect.com/product/74202

But as hotsauce said, you could spend 50 bucks on an old TT on craigslist/yard sale and buy a nice new cart for it and do just as well for less. The only drawback to that is you never know how nice someone was to it before you got your hands on it, and just how long it will last. make sure that reciever or preamp has a phono input stage or you will be buying a phono linestage to boot and good ones cost as much as a TT.

Scott Harness

12/22/2007, 06:22 PM

Great thread and equipment.Wish I would have read it sooner.I was an audiophile in the 70's,brings back memories. My system was about $8000 in 70's money. Yamaha,Bang&Olufsen,M&K

Scott Harness

12/22/2007, 06:49 PM

Also, Half-Speed Mastered Vinyl sounds fantastic!

Hotsauce

10/25/2008, 07:46 AM

Just an update to the main system, and I thought I'd throw the other 3 systems on as well.

http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/3105/DD-18.jpg

Just added to main system, Velodyne DD-18 subwoofer.

http://members.aol.com/gtspec/Scorpio2.jpg

Dining room system. Fisher 80AZ monos with Audio Physic Scorpios.

http://members.aol.com/gtspec/Bedroom_System.jpg

Fostex based bedroom system. Decware EL84 monos, Sonos server.

http://cgim.audiogon.com/i/vs/s/f/1189898895.jpg

Computer system.

John C.

Hotsauce

01/27/2010, 05:04 PM

My fellow droogs:

Any Clockwork Orange fans?

I moved my old turntable to the bedroom system, and this is now my main TT.

Transcriptors Hydraulic Reference, with Dynavector DV-505 arm. The cartridge is a Soundsmith Denon wood body 103.

http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/9774/hydref1.jpg

http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/7484/hydref2.jpg

John C.

Triathlete

01/27/2010, 06:33 PM

That is a crazy looking turntable. When I was in Japan we used to go to Hiroshima and peruse the stereo floor at dyechies (sp?). I remember they had high end turntables mounted in 3inch thich slabs of marble to "stablize" them. That store had everything from cheap walkman speakers (yeah, it was that long ago) to $50,000 speaker systems...they had some sweet Kreil (sp?) mono amps too.:yeso:

Hotsauce

01/27/2010, 06:58 PM

I had Krell monoblocks for 20 years. Great winter amps. I think they cost me almost $1/hour in electricity to run.

I restored these, and they're my main amps now.

Dynaco Mk III monoblocks
http://www.vehicross.info/gallery/data/3105/Dynaco_MkIII.JPG

Fisher 80AZ monoblocks
http://img78.imageshack.us/img78/4967/80azslk6.jpg

John C.

snowtrooper1966

01/27/2010, 08:00 PM

That turntable is a work of art!
Sure it cost about the same as a used VX.....
Best,

WormGod

01/28/2010, 08:05 AM

After the purchase of my 73" DLP recently, it was also time to update my surround sound. Didn't feel like piece-mealing a system like the "audio purist" I used to be, so I shopped around for a decent "home theater in a box". Found a pretty solid one on Newegg and made the order (not here yet of course). Going from a Yamaha Matrix 6.1 system to an Onkyo 7.1 TrueHD so it's a step up to say the least. Here's to good tv and good video games....

ONKYO HT-S7200 7.1 Home Theater System

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882120144

Triathlete

01/28/2010, 11:07 AM

Onkyo makes nice stuff. I have always liked their basic looks.

Cobrajet

02/06/2010, 03:04 PM

I just upgraded from an Onkyo TX-SR605 (part of an HTIB) to the TX-SR607 to get the additional HDMI ports. Two just wasn't enough. Unfortunately, one of the inputs I wanted to use, my PC, looks TERRIBLE when run through the reciever, but looks great when run directly to my TV (Sony 46" XBR.) And, I was never able to get the audio to work through the HDMI port, so I just ran an optical SPDIF cable from the PC to the reciever, and HDMI directly to the TV. Not worth the money to upgrade for me. But, otherwise I like the Onkyo. The Audyssey equalization seems to bump up the gain too much on every channel, so I get a pooping sound whenever I jump forward on my DVR. I have to manually override the settings, which defeats the purpose. If I was a true audiophile I may use more of the features in this receiver, but i basically bought it to watch satellite TV, and hope it does all the audio processing automatically. YMMV.

Riff Raff

02/06/2010, 07:47 PM

Cool thread. I used to run Yamaha brand "flagship" AVRs over the past 20 years, but both versions developed some sort of channel "drop out" over time. I also didn't care for the surround sound of the Yamaha's, which they refer to as "presence speakers" (more accurately, it's "Ambient Noise"). So, I said goodbye to all Yamaha brand AVRs and never looked back.

This past Summer, I purchased the "flagship" Pioneer Elite, SC-09TX (10.2 channel AVR) which has an MSRP of $7K. It uses the awesome "ICE" amp system, and does everything except dispense toilet paper. There is a blog/forum site dedicated specifically to the Pioneer Elite SC-09TX (aka "Susano") on AVS Forum. It's flawless in its audio/video reproduction, and its build quality is a work of art. Pricey yes, but I'm confident it will be the last AVR I will ever need or buy. One look at the AVR "flagship" Pioneer Elite, SC-09TX at www.PioneerElectronics.com will blow your mind to its capabilities.

My next HT purchases will most likely be the EPSON #8500U Front Projector (1080p) displayed on a Da-Lite 160" screen and a Sony-ES 400-disc Blu-Ray changer with BD/DVD/CD all-format playback capabilty. Gotta' buy the best today, because it will be obsolete tomorrow.

Martin-Logan brand speakers would be my choice for speaker upgrades.

Hotsauce

02/07/2010, 03:21 AM

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/720/ledsj.jpg

Added LED light strip to the CD rack.

It alternates white with warm white, seperate channel for each, and a remote to dim either.

Lens isn't wide enough to show the whole rack, but the overhead projector(PT-AE2000U) is the middle, so there are 3 more sections. Its all ripped to my server, with redundant raid 1 backups on the NAS. Drives are cheap now.

snowtrooper1966

02/07/2010, 12:21 PM