COMING: The Rally Beast

[Joe_Black]

Well, out of impatience and giddy excitement I'm going to share this bit of info:

The '01 Ebony that was Velvis' before he provided a home for my Dragon is about to begin its transformation into an Open Class rally truck. After we finish removing the entire interior it will go to Atlanta for a custom FIA-spec cage and the engine will be setup to run dual turbos feeding the engine through a twin-inlet top-mount intercooler, exhausting it all from dual oval-sectioned side pipes. Engine management will be MegaSquirt and the driveline will get the Aisin 5-speed and retain the TOD. The damaged front end will be completely replaced by a FRP one piece tilt-forward nose removeable with just two quick-pins.

The fabricator and I have agreed to not have a set schedule on anything, just to move along as I can come up with $$$ as needed. So I'll post any interesting news or photos as they become available.

To the best of my knowledge and those in the North American rally community, this will be the only VehiCROSS competing at any level of the sport.

All I know is that I want pics of the stage workers faces the first time they see it! :p

[nfpgasmask]

And what about the paint job? I can't wait to see it.

Bart

[Ruflyf]

I dont suppose you still need a navigator? lol. Seriously though, have you considered selling some of the parts you are removing to help with the cash flow?

[Joe_Black]

Seriously though, have you considered selling some of the parts you are removing to help with the cash flow?
The thought has crossed my mind, but I do have another VX which it would be nice to have a set of various spares for. Although for a roof-rack I could be persuaded to possibly part with something. ;)

[VehiX]

Why dual turbos? :_wtf:

What size turbos will you be running?

I would think that for a rally vehicle you would want power all the way across the rpm range and not just up top at high speeds. Are you concerned at all with turbo lag?

I would think a super charger would be a better application for rallying.

What about the suspension? What cha got goin on there?

Either way, good luck with the project and I hope it all works out. Do post pics of the progress as you go along so we can all admire them :)

[Joe_Black]

The dual-turbo setup is ideal for the V6 layout and requires no complicated plumbing or drive modifications as a supercharger would, and at a significantly lower weight. Using small, fast-spooling turbos (hydrid T25 type) will give quick response and a broad power band across the RPM range. Utilizing purge valves off the intercooler will also prevent them from stalling during decelleration, which keeps the boost on tap. The small turbos don't produce a lot of boost, which isn't needed here, but lag is practically non-existent.

Suspension is envisioned as eventually being similar to the dual-shock setup as seen on the Dakar vehicles. As we'll be shaving a significant amount of weight from the VX we'll start our baseline with singles using remote reservoirs and tune from there.

[E-ZooZoo One]

...and the driveline will get the Aisin 5-speed and retain the TOD.
Ex-squeeze me?

I'm aware of the fact that our VXs have the 1996-97 Rodeo firewall, complete with all of the holes required to mount the clutch pedal / master cylinder assembly...

But please share EVERYTHING about how you plan on keeping the TOD!
Inquiring minds wanna know! ;)

[Joe_Black]

The Asian rally teams managed to do it and I'll be takin' pictures and postin' news as we do it. ;)

[Jolly Roger VX'er]

Hey Joe,

I caught a glimpse of this little beastie on the Science Channel when they were discussing radical automobiles in history:

http://carpictures.duble.com/Lancia/Stratos/1.jpg

[Joe_Black]

Ah, the Lancia Stratos! In a previous life I was a FIAT/Lancia freak. Okay, I still am. :p Especially since I've still got three twin-cam engines and a handful of 5-speed trannies around the shop. LOL!

This is by far my most favorite Lancia...

http://www.qv500.com/Lancia%20037%20P3%201.jpg

http://www.lanciamontecarlo.net/Rallye037/photo/lancia37.jpg

[Hotsauce]

T25 will give instant response, and good boost up to about 12-14 psi, then you will run off the map and make just heat. You will probably get away with 550cc injectors at that level.

If you want to run high boost(25-30) you are going to need a bigger turbo, like a 16g or 20g, but I doubt our block will take it.

Are you allowed to mount the radiator where the rear seat was, and duct the heat out the back? It would simplify the intercooler install, and make the radiator invoulnerable to rocks.

John C.

[Joe_Black]

Yeah, we're not planning on big boost. Since we're going with a one-piece tilt nose the radiator will pretty much be in the OEM location. There's little likelyhood of anything whacking the radiator unless it's enough to stop the VX altogether.

The intercooler will be horizontally mounted over the engine, like in a Subaru. That will allow for very short runs from both turbos (dual inlet) and and to the throttle body. Simple, simple, simple!

Going with the one-piece front end opens up the engine bay considerably as all body structure ahead of the firewall will be completely eliminated. We're hoping to shed nearly 1000 lbs. of the stock curb weight and distribute the remaining mass more evenly.

[TEN36VX]

One piece front end... How's that?

[Joe_Black]

One piece front end... How's that?
We're going to pull a mold from the IronMan's front end to create a FRP tilt-forward nose. Basically, the whole front end ahead of the windshield and doors. It will tilt forward using hinges mounted at the front of the frame rails that have quick-pins so the whole nose could be removed in an instant.

Here's a similar tilt nose...

http://kitcarmag.com/featuredvehicles/p82524_image_large.jpg

[BigDave]

Hi,
Ultra cool ! Really interested in the 5 speed mod, I'm going to do that to my JDM here in New Zealand. Please let us know if the V6 flywheel will take the clutch without mods. Makes a big difference to how I plan to do my mod. Also interested in exactly what box you use.

Good luck !

[Joe_Black]

The TOD never once failed me during 2+ years of rallycross, and the professionally rallied VX's used a panel to push-button select preset torque splits using the OEM TOD unit. So it's got a proven competition history.

[Joe_Black]

You have to remember with the VX's TOD you're always in 4X4 with no less than a 85/15 torque split. Rear-wheel slip of any kind will progressively apply more torque up to the full 50/50 split based on accelleration and slip. Only the TOD Axiom and Trooper have the ability to go into 2WD, the VX is full-time 4X4.

It might do you some good to get out in a field or open snowy area and throw the VX around so you can get a good "feel" for the system, then you can have a better idea of what it'll do in the conditions you're currently uncomfortable with. ;)

[Ldub]

Sorry to pile on the thread jack Joe, but I have to agree with ZEUS.
In snow/ slippery conditions of any kind, the VX understeers horribly.
I even scared the crap outta myself a while back by overcooking an on ramp so badly, that when it came time to merge...well, lets just say, I'm glad the guy that swerved/braked to miss me had HIS poop in a group.
Maybe we should split this off to another thread? :naughty:

[Joe_Black]

Yeah, maybe a "Snow Opinions" thread. LOL!

Being a native Floridian I can't say much about snow, but have pushed it very hard in slippy stuff from slimy clay to hurricane fueled deluges and had nothing but appreciation for the VX's handling traits.

Than again, my primary background is sports cars and motorcycles not 4X4 vehicles. My definition of "handling" is probably very different than y'all's! ;)

[Joe_Black]

Finally got around to stripping most of the front sheet metal that doesn't require cutting and also got all of the interior out except the upper dash and mastic-type insulation. Here are a few pics if you've never seen a naked VX...

[Joe_Black]

VX nakedness...

[Joe_Black]

Loaded on the trailer for a trip to Atlanta for roll cage, more weight reduction, removal of all sheet metal ahead of firewall and fabrication of dual-turbo manifolds and intercooler plumbing.

Couple pics of where the factory mounting point is for the hydraulic clutch and the little perforated knock-out in the insulation pad under the carpet next to the brake pedal. Yup, everything's already there for a 5-speed!

Here's the best part of stripping down an '01: The climate control! That's right folks, I'll have the only '99 IronMan with climate control. w00t! :p

[nfpgasmask]

Looks sweet Joe, let me know if you ever want to trade your tailgate or your hood. I bought my ebony with a dent on the tailgate and a dent on the hood. I'm not sure what you are planning on doing with the body when you are all done, but if you have any spare parts, please keep me in mind!

Looks like a fun proj!

Good luck,

Bart

[BD-VX99]

Joe,

Did you finnish putting the climate control in the 99? Any pictures or details about the install

[MZ-N10]

any chance of a guide for a climate control/manual tranny swap?

[Triathlete]

Nice to see a stripped down version of the front end. Now I can see what I might need to cut when I (some day) do my SAS up front since I will be pushing the front end out a bit to lengthen the wheel base and clear bigger tires!

[Joe_Black]

Joe,

Did you finnish putting the climate control in the 99? Any pictures or details about the install
Not yet, I just did all this a couple days ago! :p

[Thmstec]

I know this is a really old thread, but any updates? Like climate on the 99, or what happened to this rally vehicross? Sounded like it was gonna be really sweet

[johnnyapollo]

Joe's taken some time off his many projects to focus on the building of his new house. I do believe this is near the top of his list when he resumes (post-building).

-- John

[Joe_Black]

As John states I'm busy laying block since I've undertaken the entire process of building myself. I'll post up the last photos of gutting the interior when a chance as it may be good reference for others looking to get the dash out, but for now we just moved the Ebony to "project row" where it will be on hold until I have more time...

http://www.planetarydomination.com/images/projects.jpg

[Solitude]

whoa.. Merkur's.. don't see many of those around..

[Joe_Black]

Yeah, I'm a bit of an XR4Ti/Sierra RS geek too. :bgwg: Two of those run great, but need all new suspension. One is an engineless shell destined for the rotisserie then rally, and the final two are in great shape but need serious engine work. Only one more to get a half dozen! Actually I'm just a real sucker for these and keep finding 'em on the cheap. :rolleyes:

LOL, maybe we should have an informal competition to see who can identify everything in the picture?

[Solitude]

LOL, maybe we should have an informal competition to see who can identify everything in the picture?

VX
Jetta
5 xr4ti's
rx7?
MB300D
military chevy p/u with a 6.2 diesal
85 chevy silverado..
not sure about the jeep behind the vx.. maybe an old rover or a toyota fj

[johnnyapollo]

Try a champie...
Also that's a CUCV next to the silverado.

-- John

[Joe_Black]

Whoa, blasphemy! That is not a Jeep. I was thinking maybe a Mighty Mite? :confused:
Mighty Mite?!?! LOL, that's worse! :p

[Joe_Black]

Never been much of a fan of the Mite, then again I've been around a few and a friend had one once. Best use he found for it was to stick on the roof as an advertisement. Structurally weak and poor metal quality prone to quick and excessive corrosion. They had a short service history for a reason. ;)

The Austin Champ was basically the British post-war answer to everything that was wrong with the Jeep, and it was done up pretty well.

http://www.panzerbaer.de/helper/pix/uk_fv1801_austin_champ-003.jpg
I'm just not much a fan of British cars per se, but got this in a cheap trade. It's complete and needs basic restoration with only some rot in the floors which is typical and easily repaired since it's all flat sheet. Neat vehicle though in that the body lifts up from the front giving access to almost the complete chassis. Drivetrain is interesting with a reverser off the rear of the engine driving the combined transfer/transaxle meaning you get all 5 gears in reverse as well as forward. Guess the idea there was to get out of trouble as fast as you got into it! If and when I work on it the LRDG version is an interesting one to think about...

[ZEUS]

Hey Joe, any progress with this beast? :)

[Joe_Black]

Not as such, decided to go diesel with it so I could figure out what I needed to do a diesel Trooper or VX for my wife afterwrd. Plus the smug satisfaction to be had when beating out the gassers in the stages. Missed a great deal recently on a nearby Trooper front clip with the 4JG2 due to lack of funds but hope to find another as I've got a little squirreled away for the right deal. Still unemployed and about to be a very full-time student for the next two years so it's kinda low on the priority list, like most of my "toy" projects. Have to admit though that the $3900 Ebony near Miami sure made my wallet tingle! :bgwo: I really, REALLY miss rally! :(

[ZEUS]

Do you still have ambitions of a fiberglass front clip for it then?

[Joe_Black]

Do you still have ambitions of a fiberglass front clip for it then?
Definitely. Especially so since I can pull a mold from our IronMan, plus it'll save a bunch of weight up front and allow for easier service access. That's a very nice thing about having body-on-frame construction which allows for such mods. ;)