4000

[tom4bren]

Put a smiley after you say that Bub.

See, I trust that was your intent ... you weren't looking to piss me off.

Gotta run & burn up a little of all that Iraqui oil we won in the war.

G'nite

[PHO2GR4]

Weird how quickly these threads can divide us.

I bought my VX purely for pleasure. I come to this board for the camaraderie and friendship...for the VX discussions...for the jokes and laughter.

Yes, it can be a serious world out there. Yes, these are important issues. But is this really the best forum for discussion out there? Aren't there plenty of other websites and blogs made specifically for that purpose?

I dunno...it's just my opinion, which is as worthless as anyone else's. On one hand, I claim that this VX website isn't the best place for heated political debate, but on the other hand here I am making a post in this thread.

The thing is, I already know that nobody cares about my opinion on the war. Nobody cares about ANY VX owner's opinion on the war. It's far too complex to even bother discussing in a few paragraphs. I mean, honestly, how many opinions are there?

1) Are you FOR the war? Is anyone truly "for" war? Is there such a thing as a "good" war, and if so, is this Iraq thingie a really "good" war? It's a friggen' mess, is what it is. And none of us...not you, or you, or you, or me...NONE of us has the teeniest idea of the true complexity of that situation. Genocide? Probably. WMD's? Maybe. Just because Saddam didn't wheel them out to show us doesn't mean they weren't there. Oil money? Maybe. Favorable contracts to Bush's pals? Perhaps. Space aliens? Hmmm...No more wacky than Muslims and Christians killing each other in any God's name.

2) Are you AGAINST the war? Hey, good for you for taking the high moral ground. You're such a brave soul for coming out against killing. So risky! So 'out there'! Wooooo hoooo. Are you also in favor of puppies and candy and love? Are you pro-good and anti-bad? Wow. NPR thanks you for your support. Keep on livin' on the edge, you radical.

I'm not trying to make light of the war. I'm just saying that this is a VX forum, and I really doubt that ANY of us in here, who CHOOSE TO DRIVE THESE OBSCENE GAS GUZZLERS, can truly claim to be experts on why this war was or was not necessary.

Having said all of that, I want to thank each and every one of you who have contributed to the knowledge base of these wonderfully fun vehicles. And props to those of you who are anti-war and anti-killing AND have found a practical way to get your VX running on tap water instead of $3.50/gallon unleaded regular fuel. Please post those instructions ASAP for the rest of us!

(Note: this post was made with tongue planted sort of firmly in cheek. Hence the "Smilies" sprinkled throughout.) :bwgr:

[Joe_Black]

Great post Pho2gr4! I admin two separate forums much like this for collectors and enthusiasts of vintage Caterpillar equipment, and the political discussions there are most notable for not being particularly divisive. Most of the folk into that particular hobby are generally cut from the same cloth, which is very interesting considering the international nature of our 4000+ membership.

Here, very different. The VehiCROSS really spans a very broad spectrum across the demographic, which is why I typically stay out of the religion/politics discussions. I know I stepped in here, but my views are usually radical enough to keep most at bay. But as mentioned this isn't the best board to to engage in such ponderings without a thick hide and an open mind. :bgwg:

[PHO2GR4]

But as mentioned this isn't the best board to to engage in such ponderings without a thick hide and an open mind. :bgwg:

I'm more thick-minded...


Thanks for your post! I love everyone in here, regardless of political persuasion.

Except for the damn Belgians!!!!

[JHarris1385]

Wow we have a fool amongst us (or two). Speaking of the media brainwashed folks that take what the tv says versus researching for themselves. Threads like this should be banned.

4Bren - If I had enough energy (car wreck view "so I" thread) or time (I consider it a waste arguing politics on a car forum or even dealing with junkies at all) I would be helping you. Its an easy war for us to fight just sometimes not even oxy clean can help ansoiled brain.

Thank you.

[WiSDoM]

4000 hmm... 40,000+ wounded and maimed. why don't you do something to help and support these people that have sacificed so much for our country and other countries around the world. I want to thank all our veterans who are serving and who have served.

This war is not a GWB invention, it was US foriegn policy dating back to the Clinton Admin. so it doesn't matter who is president. When bad things happen they have to do what they believe is in the best interest of the country. Do you think things would be much different if Al Gore was president during 9/11 or JoHn Kerry won the last election? And do you think that will be different if Clinton or Obama or McCain is elected? They have to protect our best countries interests. I don't remeber Clinton doing a go job protecting American interests here on our soil or around the world. It easy to have a lot of friends when you don't enforce the rule of law. There is plenty of blame to go around and nothing get done doing it. So solve the problems.

Lets face it oil makes the world go round. We get 20% of our oil from the middle east the rest comes from north and south america. We Americans need to change our energy policy to benefit our country's economic issues. Start investing in our infrastructure, new oil refinaries, new powerplants, and start using all our natural resources. We need oil exploration on our soil and stop tying our wallets to foreign oil producing countries that are spreading anti-american B.S around the world. Also work on developing green energy technologies too that can be shared with the whole world so they can become energy independent as well. this will eliminate OPEC's hold on the world and help stop the spread of some of their old world ideologies.

Peace my Vx brothers and sisters.

P.S. HOT_WASABI_JUNKIE Cindy Sheehan called, she would like her CODE PINK panties back if your done wearing them.

[tom4bren]

I can't agree more with the last 5 posts. I guess I'm really more 'middle of the road' than I appeared in my blathering earlier - Sorrry.

I would like to apologise to HWJ. I broke my own cardinal rule about discussing politics - discuss, don't argue. I didn't go back and reread my earlier posts but I probably took some personal shots against you. That's wrong & I'm sorry. I may not agree with your political viewpoints but I have nothing against you personally - I even like your choice in vehicles

Suddenly my signature isn't funny anymore - time for a change.

[Scott Harness]

It's about time! Animal abuse is not funny. That has been bugging me since I first saw it.

[nfpgasmask]

Weird how quickly these threads can divide us.

I bought my VX purely for pleasure. I come to this board for the camaraderie and friendship...for the VX discussions...for the jokes and laughter.

Yes, it can be a serious world out there. Yes, these are important issues. But is this really the best forum for discussion out there? Aren't there plenty of other websites and blogs made specifically for that purpose?

I dunno...it's just my opinion, which is as worthless as anyone else's. On one hand, I claim that this VX website isn't the best place for heated political debate, but on the other hand here I am making a post in this thread.

The thing is, I already know that nobody cares about my opinion on the war. Nobody cares about ANY VX owner's opinion on the war. It's far too complex to even bother discussing in a few paragraphs. I mean, honestly, how many opinions are there?

1) Are you FOR the war? Is anyone truly "for" war? Is there such a thing as a "good" war, and if so, is this Iraq thingie a really "good" war? It's a friggen' mess, is what it is. And none of us...not you, or you, or you, or me...NONE of us has the teeniest idea of the true complexity of that situation. Genocide? Probably. WMD's? Maybe. Just because Saddam didn't wheel them out to show us doesn't mean they weren't there. Oil money? Maybe. Favorable contracts to Bush's pals? Perhaps. Space aliens? Hmmm...No more wacky than Muslims and Christians killing each other in any God's name.

2) Are you AGAINST the war? Hey, good for you for taking the high moral ground. You're such a brave soul for coming out against killing. So risky! So 'out there'! Wooooo hoooo. Are you also in favor of puppies and candy and love? Are you pro-good and anti-bad? Wow. NPR thanks you for your support. Keep on livin' on the edge, you radical.

I'm not trying to make light of the war. I'm just saying that this is a VX forum, and I really doubt that ANY of us in here, who CHOOSE TO DRIVE THESE OBSCENE GAS GUZZLERS, can truly claim to be experts on why this war was or was not necessary.

Having said all of that, I want to thank each and every one of you who have contributed to the knowledge base of these wonderfully fun vehicles. And props to those of you who are anti-war and anti-killing AND have found a practical way to get your VX running on tap water instead of $3.50/gallon unleaded regular fuel. Please post those instructions ASAP for the rest of us!

(Note: this post was made with tongue planted sort of firmly in cheek. Hence the "Smilies" sprinkled throughout.) :bwgr:

Well said, Eric. I agree completely. I have avoided an opinionated response to this thread for those very reasons.

You should come to Moab again this year and hang out!

Bart

[WormGod]

Ok, here's one for ya....

This guy is walking down the street. Not Main Street, where all the business is handled for specific, everyday needs, but Misc Street, where you see all sorts of other places of interests and non essential establishments. He sees a neon sign that says "Nudie Bar: 4000 Naked Women Inside".

So, he walks in. He takes a very quick look around and sees the "stage show" and the patrons with their handfulls of dollar bills and alcoholic beverages.

The man screams out to the patrons "This is an outrage! There is a time and place for this, just not here, not now! I came here for a drink and to relax! How am I supposed to do that with all this sin and carnal activity going on!?"

The patrons turn to look at him. Then, their gaze turns to the sign and the street name, then back to him again. Shrugging, they turn back to the show to participate in what they came for.

I don't know that the moral of this story really has to be explained. Especially since I just like to run into nudie bars, throw a firecracker, and then run out.

[PHO2GR4]

Strained Analogy Alert:

I'm a little confused by this last post.

What if the street name was Vehicross Street, and the neon sign simply said "4000"? That neon sign could refer to a multitude of things. 4000 posts from that member. $4000 for a VX.

The 4400 was a cute little show on the USA Network that was recently canceled. Maybe it was picked up by a different network with a smaller cast, and they changed the name to "4000".

Maybe it referred to the number of pounds in two tons. Or the number of credit card numbers lost in the latest banking data mishap. Or today's drop in the Dow. Or the total weight lost by the contestants of "The Biggest Loser". Or the towing capacity of Tone's hitch. Or how many times a VX window can go up and down before it breaks. Or how much money 1142.857 gallons of gas will cost today. Or how many miles a VX can go on 307.69 gallons of gas. Or how many VXs are left on Earth.

4000 is a very versatile number! Don't just assume it can only refer to naked women.

[WyrreJ]

"we had Sadaam bottled up for 15 years.....he could not do anything in his own country without our knowledge."

Then why didn't we know where every mass grave and every weapon cache was located?

One day, I got really annoyed at people flinging around the "mass graves" comment and did some research on the topic. Here are some things I found out:

The term "mass graves" as used in Iraq applies to any grave with more than 6 people in it.

So far, only about 5,000 bodies total have actually been found in mass graves in Iraq.

The four largest mass graves -- purported, but not proven, to contain a lot more than 5,000 bodies -- were all created early in the 1990s as Saddam massacred people who fought against him in the hope of getting support from the americans.

No significant mass graves, or mass killings of any sort in Iraq had been committed in Iraq for close to a decade before the 2003 invasion and there was absolutely no reason to expect any more to be committed without external provocation.

Americans created mass graves in Iraq too.

To the best of my knowlege there was only the one reason ... WMD. Why would you assume that we were duped? We were mistaken, there's no doubt about it. Saddam took perverse pride in admitting that he intentionally misled the coalition forces about the existence of WMDs. I was fully convinced they were there too. I was wrong and I honestly believe that our Government was too.

I think you will be hard pressed to find actual evidence of Saddam admitting he intentionally misled the coalition forces. But even if he did, that's no excuse -- why should a tin-pot dictator be able to mislead the most powerful nation on earth? In fact, saddam did not mislead us, but the whitehouse did 935 times.

Ever stop to think that it's infinitely more effective to keep [bin Laden] contained than it is to create a martyr (sp?).

Possibly, but that point is moot because he is clearly not contained. He seems to be able to release videos at will and has directed thousands of al-quaeda to Iraq for training.

"There is no direct link to Osama and Iraq..."

I never said there was. I said that Iraq was a terrorist hotbed & you agreed ("They strap bombs to women and kids in the name of religion."). Thanks for supporting my point.

I'll dispute that Iraq WAS a terrorist hotbed. It clearly is NOW, but there is no evidence to suggest that it WAS prior to the 2003 invasion. Saddam and Al-quaeda were completely at odds with each other as his rule was primarily secular and tribal. I'm sure that Saddam had a few 'terrorist training programs' as part of his military, but so do we and so does most every other country, we just call them "special forces" when they are on our side.

"It's just Afghanastan dose not have the worlds richest oil reserve under it's heroin poppys."

That's paid out for us quite well now hasn't it.

It sure has for the oil companies, have you looked at their share prices recently?
Royal Dutch Shell is up over 50% since the invasion, Exxon is up about 150%, Chevron is up about 150%, BP is up over 50%, etc, etc.

[JoFotoz]

To paraphrase Voltaire....


“He who thinks himself wise, O heavens! is a great fool”

Wow we have a fool amongst us (or two).

jo

[JHarris1385]

Dont give me the opportunity to take at shot at you, like you just did at me.....
Given the fact that my comment was not directed towards you I congratulate you on your immaturity. You have received a pm. Take care.

One more reason I wish I never posted in this thread and believe it should be closed. Politics should not be venue that allows such comments to be said. I am done with this thread. I am politically charged and have been since birth my father has been a state rep among other numerous political positions. I have a degree in political science and have been on and still am on many national debate teams.

[WormGod]

Strained Analogy Alert:

I'm a little confused by this last post.

What if the street name was Vehicross Street, and the neon sign simply said "4000"? That neon sign could refer to a multitude of things. 4000 posts from that member. $4000 for a VX.

The 4400 was a cute little show on the USA Network that was recently canceled. Maybe it was picked up by a different network with a smaller cast, and they changed the name to "4000".

Maybe it referred to the number of pounds in two tons. Or the number of credit card numbers lost in the latest banking data mishap. Or today's drop in the Dow. Or the total weight lost by the contestants of "The Biggest Loser". Or the towing capacity of Tone's hitch. Or how many times a VX window can go up and down before it breaks. Or how much money 1142.857 gallons of gas will cost today. Or how many miles a VX can go on 307.69 gallons of gas. Or how many VXs are left on Earth.

4000 is a very versatile number! Don't just assume it can only refer to naked women.

*sigh*

And yet again, the same guy that walked into the bar and realised that it wasnt his type of establishment, found more grounds to fight the urge to just leave.

C'mon man, I am the guy throwing firecrackers to rouse people. I dont care for this thread either but it's just so damned fun getting a rise out of people. :P