Ascinder's 1-Ton VX... Cont'd

[JAMAS]

I like it, I LIKE it! I have a similar dream - V8 and a beefy "shiftable" automatic - from maybe a late model Camaro or Chorevette. My design goal would be to LOWER the VX, remove the AWD function, and just make a REALLY quick "sleeper" PUV. Brake upgrades, differential upgrade (maybe a FULL Corvette chassis underneath?) Guys are putting them under earlier Corvettes all the time - I bet a cookie it could be done, and for not THAT much cake either...

ummmmmmmmm......what would be left that would be VX?

Engine Gone
Transmission Gone
AWD Gone
Height Gone
Chassis Gone

Sounds like you just want the "tilt wheel" functionality.

[Ascinder]

so, beau... you gonna take the extreme offroad 'ghetto' method i've seen of beefing up competition tires and sawzall every other block of rubber off those tires???

give yourself some serious gaps between tread to grab with..

If they weren't $400+ per tire, maybe, but the way things are heading, I want to be able to maintain high speed in the desert and on the road, while still doing good in the rocks. I think losing half of the lugs would put those wheels in the thump thump thump category going down the road. These wheels actually do extremely well if you just air them down. That's where the bias ply actually offers some advantages over the radial design that is far more common. Bias ply flexes very very well. Properly aired down these things resemble tank treads the way the tread lugs stack up on rocks. They are actually very similar to the creepy crawlers Billy recommended.

Best thread EVER!

Living in Louisville, KY area -seems so uneventful now.

Hopefully it will be if I actually pull this off. Even I have my doubts. There is just so much to do. It's not even close to as simple as it sounds.

X-2...oh wait, living in Fargo was uneventful BEFORE this thread...

Now it's uneventful AND meaningless....

You GO Beau!...

Well, for all the VX's we have driving around Reno, it's sad how uneventful it is here. It's really just Bart and I now. We're going to have to start using strongarm mobster style persuasion tactics to get some people around here to go meet up or hang out. I figure maybe if I make mine a VX among VX's, maybe some of these local lurkers will get interested and come out of their shells to see. Thanks for the encouragement too, it helps me stay on task.

I don't know what is taking you so long Beau. So far, I have only spent 7 hours making a 1-ton VX! I'm still cleaning stuff up - the shadow sucks! I need to find some hubs and lugs to throw in there too. Beau, is there anything specific you would like to see on this? Anything you don't like or want me to fix?

It's taking me so long, because it's easiest to do nothing, easy to do something, and incredibly hard to do something right. The VX isn't destined for mediocrity, so I'm taking things slowly and methodically for a number of reasons:

1)Mistakes are costly and I'm a cheap *&%^&%#!!

2)Mistakes take a long time to fix and I'm pretty lazy.

3)No one's done anything on this scale before except for maybe coachreed, but he has all but fallen off of the face of the earth. His website I used to reference is even down now, so good thing I archived his build log and several pictures. What I'm getting at is that there is no step by step guidebook for this stuff, I literally have to just make everything up and this is the first time I've ever attempted anything like this.

4)This is the ultimate case of the kneebone's connected to the legbone. Everything has to be done one at a time and depends on going in order for other things to work. For instance, I cant start putting in the front four link until I position the engine and trans and xfer case. If I did, I would no doubt hit things. I also can't start doing the hydro system until I find out where the axle will ultimately end up which is largely dependent on the four link. Do I have general ideas of where and how everything fit together? Yes. But like any other plan, it's only good until the first bullet flies.

>RANT OVER<

The photoshop looks awesome. I really dig it. As for any changes? Yes, how about some bikini girls. But seriously, it looks great. I am shooting for a flat tan paintjob instead of the white eventually. But not like desert tan, more like the color referred to as coyote in the tactical vest and gear market. Like this color:



And if you can color match the beadlocks that would be awesome. God, that thing is going to have an approach angle from hell!!

Justin, what other trips to Nevada do you have planned? That unpaid week off I am hoping to spend in Eastern Nevada camping and wheeling along the Ruby Mountain range. It would be awesome if you could join in. And Beau, if you got the time off you should come.

Just let me know when. I can almost always wrangle the time off. I'm an accomplished slacker you know.

ummmmmmmmm......what would be left that would be VX?

Engine Gone
Transmission Gone
AWD Gone
Height Gone
Chassis Gone

Sounds like you just want the "tilt wheel" functionality.

Yeah, that's almost exactly what I'm doing though. I don't see anything wrong with it. How many classic hot rods kept the same engines or transmissions when the were souped up? The AWD is nice, but how necessary is it really? The height I'll agree on a bit, but everyone knows, height is the enemy of speed and handling, not to mention mileage. The chassis I also think I would keep, since a Vette chassis is designed around a body that's extremely low slung, and putting a weeble wobble VX body up there might cause issues. But all in all, that's the beauty of the VX, you can take it in any direction to the extreme because it was designed to handle well(for an SUV type vehicle). We're about to have a hardcore rock/desert machine, why not a street/strip version. I say go for it.

[VXorado]

I like it, I LIKE it! I have a similar dream - V8 and a beefy "shiftable" automatic - from maybe a late model Camaro or Chorevette. My design goal would be to LOWER the VX, remove the AWD function, and just make a REALLY quick "sleeper" PUV. Brake upgrades, differential upgrade (maybe a FULL Corvette chassis underneath?) Guys are putting them under earlier Corvettes all the time - I bet a cookie it could be done, and for not THAT much cake either...

I like the idea of putting in an upgraded drivetrain (i.e. Ascinder's build thread) but as soon as the suspension in modified to match a car, the VX becomes a "crossover" and not a "PUV." There are very many crossovers and very few PUVs. Just a thought

BTW I'm glad this build thread was made, its awesome

[uncle_asa]

It will be amaizing if it ever be finished!

I'm actually getting everything together to build another diesel VX. But it will be 3.0L only and still with independent front

[nfpgasmask]

It will be amaizing if it ever be finished!

Don't worry, Justin will be here this weekend, and with the 3 of us we should have it done by Sunday night.

Bart

[taylorRichie]

Amazing Beau!! too cool!!

@ASA, Why not do a Cummins 4BT, or an Isuzu 4bd1t? They're the perfect engine for the VX IMO...

Plus there is a ton of good swap information out there, and kits to bolt to standard Chevy Trans.

Just a thought

[uncle_asa]

Amazing Beau!! too cool!!

@ASA, Why not do a Cummins 4BT, or an Isuzu 4bd1t? They're the perfect engine for the VX IMO...

Plus there is a ton of good swap information out there, and kits to bolt to standard Chevy Trans.

Just a thought

Just because of short frame Bighorn will be more direct swap donor Though, lot of wiring issues anyway.

[Ascinder]

4BT's are also extremely heavy if I remember right, I was looking at putting one in a 1946 WDX dodge power wagon project awhile back. They're great for torque and good horepower, but if you do stuff like jump your ride at all, be prepared to be making trips to the body shop for a tweaked frame. I'm already very leery of my VX with this heavier engine and the winch and winch bumper up front.

[Ascinder]

Here's the progress so far. I'm still in the gutting the VX/accumulating parts stage, but at least it is progressing....

[nfpgasmask]

H O L Y P O O P ! ! !

Those jack stands look like they did the trick!!! Just be careful, bro!

Bart

[ZEUS]

Hell yeah! We'll even get the Falcon up and running this weekend too!
Yeah right, I can barely even get an oil change done anymore...

[Ascinder]

Well, it looks like bad weather this weekend, so maybe we will get some stuff done.....after all, that beer isn't going to drink itself In the spirit of this thread though, the diff covers are on their way as well as a pinion guard for the 14 bolt, and I'm going through all the brackets and tabs at ballistic right now to set up the link system. I am also looking really hard at this gas tank, since I will have to remove the stock one so the links can be properly positioned.



It is heavy duty 16 gauge 304 stainless steel. It's only 16 gallons though. Losing 6 gallons will suck a lot, but this new engine is supposed to be quite a bit more fuel efficient, so it might be a wash. I was getting a consistent 12MPG before, so hopefully I'll still see a boosted range with the new powerplant. If not, there's always Jerry cans As far as legalities go for replacing fuel tanks in vehicles, which Billy mentioned was a potential issue, I came across this:

What is a Legal Fuel Tank System?

In the aftermarket fuel tank system industry, there is a lot of confusion over what is “legal” when adding or replacing a fuel tank. We hope the following information helps clear up some of these very important concerns. Be advised that this information is not intended to be a complete list, but rather a general overview.

In order to address the question of which federal or state regulations a fuel system must meet or exceed, it is necessary to know the particular vehicle and fuel system being used. The following information is divided into two main categories, Vehicles less than 10,000 GVW, and vehicles greater than 10,000 GVW.

Regulations for vehicles less than 10,000 GVW
Regulations for vehicles greater than 10,000 GVW
ICC Fuel Tank Regulations
Refueling Tank Regulations
Miscellaneous Information
CAUTION Information


For Vehicles Less Than 10,000 GVW
TFI fuel systems meet FMVSS 301 (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards), VESC-22 (Vehicle Equipment Safety Commission), NFPA 1192, ANSI 119.2, RVIA (Recreational Vehicle Industry Association) regulations, CARB (California Air Resources Board), and EPA (Environmental Protection Agency) regulations.

FMVSS 301 states that anyone who alters a vehicle must meet or exceed the structural integrity and performance of the OEM (Original Equipment Manufacturer) fuel system. A fuel system includes anything associated with fuel systems such as the fillneck, tank, gasoline lines, fuel pump, emission canister and fasteners. In other words, if an alterer adds an auxiliary system to a vehicle thereby reducing the performance of the fuel system, he or she has violated FMVSS 301 standards. An example of performance reduction could be if fuel from the original system leaked because the auxiliary system was gravity feeding into the original tank. This creates a real concern as it not only violates FMVSS 301 regulations, but is also a hazardous waste problem.

TFI’s inboard chassis frame and in-bed tank systems meet and exceed the OEM systems in the following areas:
1. TFI tanks are designed using 14-gauge aluminized steel as a minimum instead of the 22 gauge terneplate or plastic that OEM typically uses. Transfer Flow’s aluminum diamond plate in-bed tanks are made from 1/8” thick aluminum.

2. TFI tanks are fully baffled unlike OEM tanks which have no baffles.

3. At a minimum, TFI tanks are drop tested in accordance with VESC-22. When drop tested, they are fully filled with water and cannot leak. Many of TFI’s fuel systems are also crash tested to FMVSS 301 standards.

4. Tanks are 100% pressure tested. Some are tested using a sophisticated automatic Helium testing machine. This machine is capable of finding leaks with a helium concentration of less that 1.00E-7 liters/sec (leak size of 0.0000000315 in-sq or 3.15 E-8 in-sq).

5. TFI tank systems meet the fastener (strap) regulations specified by ANSI, NFPA, and required by RVIA (Recreation Vehicle Industry Association).

6. TFI systems meet CARB and EPA emissions regulations. We design our systems with the correct emission canister capacity necessary for gasoline applications. GM, Ford, Dodge, etc. all use different canisters with different absorption characteristics. Each TFI fuel system is designed to be compatible with that vehicle’s emissions system.

7. TFI fillneck designs meet CARB fuel fill regulations. We design our fillnecks with proper alpha and beta angles and correct inclination angles for gasoline and diesel applications.

8. TFI systems meet CARB and EPA requirements concerning fuel fill rates. This test verifies that our system fills at a minimum of 10 gallons per minute - a rate equal to that dispensed at most gas stations.

Although the tank in the above picture is not from the same company, I have called and confirmed it exceeds our stock tanks' standards, so we're safe legally. I am planning on running either a Bosch 044 high pressure fuel pump or a Walbro 255. The former is a pump used by the vast majority of pro rally racers worldwide, and in other forms of racing. The latter is also a high pressure pump that is used more in the rock crawling/offroad arena. I plan on mounting either of them externally, with the VX stock pump acting as a "feeder pump" to a small accumulator that is mounted inline between the two. I'd like to get this fuel system sorted out soon, so I can begin to plan the rest of the systems.

[nfpgasmask]

I think you'll be fine with 16 gallons. I mean, you can always carry a 5 gallon jerry can and that will give you basically the same capacity you had before. Plus, it's not like you will be going on cross country road trips in it all the time, so...

Yeah, bummer about the weather, it was soooo nice last weekend. We should get some work done and drink a lot. Maybe Sunday morning it will be clear enough to take the Troop out back with some toys and spray a little lead...

Bart

[ZEUS]

Nice! I installed an aluminum version of that tank in my CJ. Mine was without baffles so I ordered two fuel pickups that have flappers. When the fuel pickup goes dry on one side it shuts and only one pick up feeds fuel. I installed a Y-fitting on my high-volume in-tank Walbro pump and cut the fuel lines long enough to put the pickups in alternate corners... no fuel starvation on ascents, descents, or sidehilling. I chose to use a fuel sending unit that has no moving parts and reads more accurately: http://www.stewartwarner.com/Comp/prel/intel00.html
http://www.maximatech.com/products/sendersandsensors

It drops right in and is not affected by the fuel pickups. Finding out what ohms to use and what depth to use are the only issues. See ya in 25 hours or so!

Well, it looks like bad weather this weekend, so maybe we will get some stuff done.....after all, that beer isn't going to drink itself In the spirit of this thread though, the diff covers are on their way as well as a pinion guard for the 14 bolt, and I'm going through all the brackets and tabs at ballistic right now to set up the link system. I am also looking really hard at this gas tank, since I will have to remove the stock one so the links can be properly positioned.



It is heavy duty 16 gauge 304 stainless steel. It's only 16 gallons though. Losing 6 gallons will suck a lot, but this new engine is supposed to be quite a bit more fuel efficient, so it might be a wash. I was getting a consistent 12MPG before, so hopefully I'll still see a boosted range with the new powerplant. If not, there's always Jerry cans As far as legalities go for replacing fuel tanks in vehicles, which Billy mentioned was a potential issue, I came across this:



Although the tank in the above picture is not from the same company, I have called and confirmed it exceeds our stock tanks' standards, so we're safe legally. I am planning on running either a Bosch 044 high pressure fuel pump or a Walbro 255. The former is a pump used by the vast majority of pro rally racers worldwide, and in other forms of racing. The latter is also a high pressure pump that is used more in the rock crawling/offroad arena. I plan on mounting either of them externally, with the VX stock pump acting as a "feeder pump" to a small accumulator that is mounted inline between the two. I'd like to get this fuel system sorted out soon, so I can begin to plan the rest of the systems.

[Ascinder]

What did that sensor setup run you? Sounds great to me!! I guess with the system I'm running(returnless), the fuel can overheat in the rails at very high temperatures, so I have to figure out a fix for that too, probably just some heatwrap.
On a sidenote, those awesome ORI struts Billy mentioned are only available in the ST version right now. I am thinking more along the lines of the DP3s, but they aren't expected to be produced until next year due to machining issues being worked out.