VT_Maverick's 5 Speed Swap

[vt_maverick]

You have boggled my mind with this statement.

Because it's that dumb of an idea? Or because it's unthinkable to go "down" to a four-banger?

[eternal21]

Just learned something... the same AR-5 manual that we're swapping into my VX was also used on the Pontiac Solstice GXP. That car featured a dual-turbo 2.0 L I4 Ecotec engine that made 260 hp and 260 lb-ft torque while getting 19/28 MPG. The VX is heavier by almost a thousand pounds, but you'd drop a good chunk of that just by going from a V6 to an I4...

So since we know an AR-5 mates to an Ecotec engine is it conceivable that you could swap that engine instead? Discuss...

Very much so, just wiring the instrument cluster would be the biggest concern. Add'l info: there is also a 2.4 non turbo engine, and it would also appear that the aforementioned 2.0 is the same engine in the Cobalt SS and HHR SS, as per ebay auction 130586906920.

I, for one, in order to increase gas mileage would strongly consider a 2.0L w/a 5MT, especially since there are aftermarket parts to boost the power of the 2.0L.

[89Vette]

Another nice thing about the manual swap is getting a better crawl ratio because the AR5 has a lower first gear than our auto.

Stock VX crawl ratio: 2.86 (1st) x 2.48 (T-case) x 4.30 (axles)= 30.5

Manual VX crawl ratio: 3.75 (1st) x 2.48 (T-case) x 4.30 (axles)=39.9



Sounds like the difference is noticable???

If this was already posted, please accept my apology. (I read thru the whole thread but don't remember it.)

What's the ratios of the highest gear? The knowledge base says VX trannies have a .72 OD. Is this M5 going to lower hwy RPMs?

[VXorado]

Because it's that dumb of an idea? Or because it's unthinkable to go "down" to a four-banger?

No its a pretty clever question and after thinking about it for a while, I didn't have a good answer.

Heavy VX= bad canidate for a 4 cylinder

I4 smaller/lighter than 3.5L= good weight shed for VX

I4 turbos= possible annoying turbo lag (maybe not since there's 2)

I4 more HP= that's all good

I4 better MPG= also all good

Sky/Solstice short production run= that engine could cost big $$$

Too many pros/cons to make a stance. I think its a great idea as long as the extra 45HP goes to the wheels. Then again the MPG alone may make the swap worth it.

[VXorado]

If this was already posted, please accept my apology. (I read thru the whole thread but don't remember it.)

What's the ratios of the highest gear? The knowledge base says VX trannies have a .72 OD. Is this M5 going to lower hwy RPMs?

No worries, its not posted... until NOW :

Aisin AR5 Transmission
1st:3.75
2nd:2.26
3rd:1.37
4th:1.00
5th:0.73
R:3.67

4L30E
1st: 2.86
2nd: 1.62
3rd: 1.00
4th: 0.72
Rev.: 2.00

To answer your question, the OD is about the same but think about all the extra power you'll have going in reverse!

[89Vette]

No its a pretty clever question and after thinking about it for a while, I didn't have a good answer.

Heavy VX= bad canidate for a 4 cylinder

I4 smaller/lighter than 3.5L= good weight shed for VX

I4 turbos= possible annoying turbo lag (maybe not since there's 2)

I4 more HP= that's all good

I4 better MPG= also all good

Sky/Solstice short production run= that engine could cost big $$$

Too many pros/cons to make a stance. I think its a great idea as long as the extra 45HP goes to the wheels. Then again the MPG alone may make the swap worth it.

Often top HP numbers don't tell the whole story. For a 2-ton vehicle, torque is an important consideration. It doesn't matter how much HP you generate if it takes 20-seconds getting it from 0-25mph. (IOW if that HP doesn't happen until higher rpms)

Responsiveness is usually a product of cubic inches and compression. OTOH, I haven't driven a dual turbo 4-cylinder.

[eternal21]

Often top HP numbers don't tell the whole story. For a 2-ton vehicle, torque is an important consideration. It doesn't matter how much HP you generate if it takes 20-seconds getting it from 0-25mph. (IOW if that HP doesn't happen until higher rpms)

Hmmmmmmmm....interesting article http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take-road-test There's an upgrade for that 2.0 I4 which consists of an ECU flash and a new MAP sensor. Results: 290hp and 360 lb/ft tq.

The 2008 2.0 engine produces the 260hp @ 5300 rpms, and 260lb/ft tq @ 2000rpms. Considering the VX makes its hp/tq numbers @ 5400rpm and 3000rpm respectively, I think we would be all right

(Source of info: Wikipedia)

[vt_maverick]

No its a pretty clever question and after thinking about it for a while, I didn't have a good answer.

Heavy VX= bad canidate for a 4 cylinder

I4 smaller/lighter than 3.5L= good weight shed for VX

I4 turbos= possible annoying turbo lag (maybe not since there's 2)

I4 more HP= that's all good

I4 better MPG= also all good

Sky/Solstice short production run= that engine could cost big $$$

Too many pros/cons to make a stance. I think its a great idea as long as the extra 45HP goes to the wheels. Then again the MPG alone may make the swap worth it.

Couple things that I think mitigate the highlighted concerns above. First, if an I4 makes more HP and torque than our 3.5 V6 and weighs less it should be all good. Second, the GXP engine is shared amongst the Solstice, Sky, HHR, and Cobalt so there should be plenty of engines out there. I haven't priced them yet though.

Hmmmmmmmm....interesting article http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take-road-test There's an upgrade for that 2.0 I4 which consists of an ECU flash and a new MAP sensor. Results: 290hp and 360 lb/ft tq.

The 2008 2.0 engine produces the 260hp @ 5300 rpms, and 260lb/ft tq @ 2000rpms. Considering the VX makes its hp/tq numbers @ 5400rpm and 3000rpm respectively, I think we would be all right

(Source of info: Wikipedia)

I saw that too, and here's an interesting note. Although the AR-5 is only rated at 260 lb-ft of torque, if you have a certified GM dealership install this turbo upgrade it does not void your factory powertrain warranty. So does that mean the transmission will handle that much more power? Or does the GM warranty not cover the clutch or other parts? In either case GM must believe it will be reliable enough not to piss off upgrade customers.

[vt_maverick]

Very much so, just wiring the instrument cluster would be the biggest concern. Add'l info: there is also a 2.4 non turbo engine, and it would also appear that the aforementioned 2.0 is the same engine in the Cobalt SS and HHR SS, as per ebay auction 130586906920.

I, for one, in order to increase gas mileage would strongly consider a 2.0L w/a 5MT, especially since there are aftermarket parts to boost the power of the 2.0L.

+1, my thoughts exactly (mileage AND power without adding the weight of extra cylinders). I wonder if you could just replace the VX instrument cluster with a Solstice / Sky / HHR / Cobalt cluster? You'd lose the TOD lights and odometer, but maybe something could be worked out? I suppose it depends on how integrated the clusters are.

[Buffy]

Feeling better and got a bit more done.

Completed pedals and interior...



I took my dremel and opened up the stock console some to accommodate the shift pattern. I am still trying to find a shift boot for this...



I took the connectors for the auto and taped them to the harness. Here is the harness ready to be installed...



Here is where all the majic happens. I am having a connector sent to me and will make a harness for the clutch switch, backup light switch, and hopefully cruise...



I ran the breather tube for the transfer case up into the engine compartment...



The big challenge is getting the wires run and connected to the correct O2 sensor. Another challenge is keeping wires away from the hot exhaust parts.

[Mile High VX]

I am still trying to find a shift boot for this.

Should arrive on Monday along with all of the interior parts from the Passport...hope it all works out well...

[VXorado]

Can you use the wiring harness from the Trooper? You had to change the ECU, right?

Also it looks like the manual shifter fits in the VX console, thats a nice easy solution.

[Buffy]

You have to use the harness from the VX due to the wiring for the TOD. Yes, I used the computer from the Trooper.

[VXorado]

Okay, that makes sense.

[vt_maverick]

Very cool, glad to hear you're feeling better.

Earl - I will send you payment tonight as we discussed. Sorry for the delay!