Bilstein Shocks Info

[t2p]

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???
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I think I'm going to get a headache ......
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my two fronts (shock absorbers) were totally gone ........
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one rear was totally gone - and the other rear was 75% or so gone ............
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I installed KYB Monomax at all four corners ....... work very well - but I do not have anything to use in comparision .......

[transio]

Originally posted by SlowPro48
Could be...

I'm no expert but it seems like all that load/vector/cosine stuff is for force transferred by solid rods, beams, etc.

Ok, there's definitely a difference between static and dynamic physics, but the load applied to the shock occurs at the point of attachment. That means that whatever happens inside doesn't matter.

It's been a long time since I've even looked at engineering or physics, but here's the low down, as I recall it:

In a triangulated system, a load applied at any point is translated across the adjoining members, creating either a force of tension or compression, depending on the direction of the force. In the case of the vehicross, you get something like the diagram below:



As you can see, when the shocks are compressed, the canter is increased. To explain why this makes a difference, here's a simple force diagram:



The shocks are in compression, with a pin joint at either end. The vertical force gets translated along the axis of the shock absorber, which then pushes back with a vertical AND horizontal load. The horizontal load gets absorbed by the wheel's mounting bracket (and whatever assembly that is attached to). Because the shock absorber is at an angle, it has to handle not only the vertical load applied by the road, but the horizontal loads created by the fact that it's angled. Essentially, it makes the shock work harder than it would in a vertical mounting position.

Additionally, it's not making the shock travel less. That's a misconception. The shock actually has to travel MORE for the same amount of wheel travel. Other negatives: the shock is applying unnecesary loads to other systems in your vehicle, and it's not mounted to your frame rails, but to the body.

I don't see one benefit to having the shocks mounted this way.

[SGT.BATGUANO]

I do.

As was mentioned before, better articulation. This is due to the fact that if you mounted a shock vertical, it would have to be much shorter and would limit rear suspension travel.

The top forward canting probably helps dampen motion with respect to the movement angle of the 4-link arms.

Also, the top of the shock IS mounted to the frame......via a stamped, welded bracket, NOT to the body.

The springs are handling the majority of the load forces, all the shocks have to do is dampen spring oscillation.

I really can't remember seeing a shock mounted perfectly vertical, maybe these are some reasons for this.

[transio]

Ok, points taken. I didn't see the bracket extension from the frame, but then, I wasn't looking too closely at the time. This was all more of an afterthought.

One more question: if the shocks are extremely stiff in compression, don't they absorb more of the initial impact of the load applied to the suspension than in softer shocks?

[SGT.BATGUANO]

Yes, I'd agree that they do. I don't know the compression/ rebound percentages (ratio,valving) for our shocks. Are they 50/50? I don't know. Someone here said they sent one to an aftermarkter to disect and find what the valving was. Probably should've asked them to find the weak link leading to premature failures, too.

[skunkworks]

Mine has been getting very skiddish in the rear on bumps lately. I got down to see if the shocks were leaking before they got out of warranty, and there is barely any clearance between the rebound bumpers and the frame. So it looks like basically I am bouncing around on the bumpers. Has anyone shortened the bumpers to see if it improves the ride and control. I would rather stiffen the sway bars than use the bumpers to control body roll.

albert
________
Suzuki Katana

[angrylittleman]

are the shocks covered under the basic warranty, or are they considered maintainence items, like spark plugs, brake pads, etc?

[transio]

If the shocks leak, they'll be covered.

[Reg Hinnant]

Hi Guy's
I thought I would give an update on Doetsch shock adventure.
HotSauce sent a pair of original shocks to them for disassembly to see if they could produce an equivalent replacement.
The only comment from them was that the oil orifice (into the reservoir) was very small and they had 3 times the shim stacks as normal. No comments on valve ratio's.
To make a long story short, I received a call from the owner stating that they did not think we would be happy with what they could provide.
So I'm going to add that to our original listing.
And I will add the comments about the new Bilstein numbers being a possible good combination.
It's interesting what the engineers came up with, for the shock design on this vehicle.

skunkworks, some have slit the 1st bumper to make it have less effect on handling.

[Denee]

I'm knew to the VX and probably will be asking quetions off and on. My question at the moment is about the rear suspension. It is rather stiff (like going over speed bumps and the rear takes it rather hard). Is there a way to "soften" the rear suspension so my rear passengers (which are few) wouldn't be jarred so much? If not, I can live with it.
thanks,
anocsunamoon@aol.com
Denee'

[transio]

You can just get some softer shocks. Probably for $100 installed, you can soften up the ride quite a bit. If you desire a "cadillac" ride, you'll have to get different springs, too. The downside is that your performance will be equally lessened. You'll have significantly more body roll. This would only cause problems if you drive your VX at high speeds, corner hard, or have to swerve to avoid something. Personally, I prefer the stiffer suspension because it better suits my driving style (aggressive).

[Reg Hinnant]

Denee,
My post, where I was answering skunkworks, should have been worded different.
Some have slit the 1st bumper to lessen the impact on the rear of the vehicle, since there is only a small amount of clearance between the axle & bumper. I have not done this but know a few owners who have and they feel it helps ease the rear stiffness feeling.

[Hotsauce]

I think most VX owners who feel their ride is too stiff will discover that their shocks are actually worn out.

Before you change out for soft shocks, see if its not just that yours are gone.

John C.

[Chopper]

Stiffen those sway bars at your own risk my friend. This is no lightweight ballerina we're talkin' about. Your *** will quickly be introduced to your nose.

[transio]

Update: I've been riding on these Bilsteins for almost a month now, and the ride is just fabulous. My VX is really tight around corners and has little body roll. Of course, I have tried not to push it TOO much. I have been driving sports cars for 5 years, so I'm still a little wary about flipping this thing!