E85 in the VX? Trooper? Rodeo? Axiom?

[nater]

Has anyone dared to put a tank (or half a tankful) of E85 into their vehicle to see how well it ran?

(E85 = fuel that is 85% ethanol, 15% gasoline)

I know officially the vehicle only supports E10 (10% Ethanol, 90% gasoline) but I have heard success stories from other folks running E85 (not Isuzu) once the Engine Computer adjusts to it.

(I'm talking about vehicles NOT approved by the manufacturer for E85).

So, has anybody tried it in their Isuzu? Know of any issues?

Nate

[Joe_Black]

E85 is a very different fuel from ~10% blends and requires a number of modifications. If you were going to convert you might as well go 100% ethanol, since it's about that much of a change. You'd be looking at mostly the fuel delivery system, all Viton o-rings and seals, higher-flow injectors, all stainless fuel rail and possibly ECU programming.

I've looked extensivley into a 100% ethanol conversion on one of my VX's or XR4Ti's, but can't start until our new home is built which will give me the room to setup for ethanol production.

Here's a good page with a lot of ethanol and E85 info: http://journeytoforever.org/

[Moncha]

Joe's gonna start a still!!!

[Joe_Black]

Joe's gonna start a still!!!

LOL! Believe it or not, the Federal permit I'm getting is about $35 (IIRC) and allows me to produce up to 10,000 gallons of 190 proof ethanol per year. You can get permitted to produce up to 500,000 a year, but the inspection requirements are significantly more stringent. Since I currently use between 45 and 70 gallons of gasoline a month now, 10,000 a year should do fine. Due to energy density differences between gasoline and ethanol usage for a 100% ethanol vehicle is about 15 - 25% more by volume. But considering how clean it is to produce and use, couple with a total production cost of about $.60 a gallon after tax credits, the increased consumption still beats gasoline and diesel hands down.

ATF Fuel Producer Permit

The best thing about the ethanol is that when stored properly it doesn't go bad like gasoline or diesel. You just need to be mindful it doesn't absorb a lot of moisture (water) which lowers its proof. Then again, if you get water in the fuel system is has absolutely no ill effect on how the engine runs.

It just boggles the mind that the entire world could run without gasoline and hardly anyone knows or is willing to do anything about it.

[TEN36VX]

Just curious on what you think the total estimated cost of the conversion would be...

[cascabel3]

Just curious as to how you will produce the ethanol

[Polie]

Sorry to dig up a 7 year old thread, but I searched!!!!

Anyways I was thinking of trying 1/3 of a tank after reading this:

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...9145952AAdI3ge

Found it at $3.17 vs $3.76

[89Vette]

From the Corvette Forum, here's a thread that might answer some related gas vs. ethanol questions.

Post #22 on the 2nd page is the most informative.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c4-t...asoline-2.html

(FWIW, I also noticed recently that E15 has been approved. Said you can only use it in 2001 and greater automobiles because the fuel systems were mandated by then. This doesn't jive with the 1993 comment.)

[Chopper]

burning alcohol is an easier conversion in older, carburated engines....
I'd be real iffy about E85 in the Isuzu. It requires changing seals and lines and a bunch of crap. It can be done
LP gas conversions were real popular back when too. LP is clean, cheap, American, cheap, and plentiful. I've just never seen it done on anything newer than a MGB.
Brits even ran on a type of Bar-B-Q fumes during the war. Saw one of those at Amelia Island a few years back

[89Vette]

burning alcohol is an easier conversion in older, carburated engines....
I'd be real iffy about E85 in the Isuzu.

No way I've got great knowledge of this forum yet, but I do try my share of searches on a given topic. FWIW, I have done one on tuning the Vehicross and I haven't found threads where it looks like people have successfully accomplished it.

Until that happens (or unless I missed it), Chopper's statement may have some truth in the VX community. Beyond that, many people have done their own programming for an E85 conversion...especially in the FORD/GM circles. That's because E85 makes more power (and uses more fuel).

I'll be interested in this project for the success/failure of the ECU programming....hoping that OEM unit is successfully reprogrammed vs getting replaced.

[Polie]

there are lost of dual fuel, LP and petrol down here in PHX. The only thing I could see would be needing to add MMO to the fuel for e85. (Marvels Mystery Oil)

[89Vette]

there are lost of dual fuel, LP and petrol down here in PHX. The only thing I could see would be needing to add MMO to the fuel for e85. (Marvels Mystery Oil)

WTH? You're smoking what again?

[Polie]

Summer yea dude not really a new concept. Almost all the phx metro work trucks are dual fuel and you can have your car/truck modified as well for $5-$7k. No yearly tags, perm hov privileges, no emissions, and super cheap fuel.

Immortal with the e85 to help lubricate the pump, upper topend, and keeps the fuel lines healthy with running that much alcohol. I had to use it with all of my classic cars including my cherry 68 beetle.

[twalker920]

You're going to need a bigger gas tank because your mpg is going to take a huge hit. Aside from any other programming, sealing, whatever, you might need to do, on our VXs a hit in mileage is not something to look forward to.

Whatever range you get out of a tank now in your VX, figure 70% of that on E85. E85 has 33% less energy per unit volume than pure gasoline.

http://www.epiphergy.com/uploads/E85...ound_2_web.pdf

http://www.edmunds.com/fuel-economy/...ison-test.html

Plus the fact that until all E85 is made from non-food-grade sources (such as "switchgrass") it hurts the economy when farmers grow corn for fuel instead of food. Right now it is mostly made from corn, with some food crop waste (rice husks, corn husks) being used. No large volume non-food sources are economically up to speed yet.

And if you're planning on making and storing your own E85, be aware of the emissions the stuff has while in storage, and how to store it safely. I am a Mechanical Engineer in the oil and gas engineering business (I know - the bad guys, I'm sorry), and we had one client that was switching a fleet vehicle tank farm from gasoline to E85, and had to spend many thousands of dollars modifying the tanks to safely store the E85.

Just playing Devil's Advocate here.

[tysamigo]

Soooooo.... theoretically.... how much would an E85 or full ethanol conversion cost?